Switching to Red Dot - need help

[Bench]

24 minutes ago, Angus46 said:

Used a dot for quite a while on a M and P.  I find the best way to use it is total target focus.  Train your eyes to focus where you want the bullet to impact, (not looking at the sight at all)  then move your hands/gun to where your eyes are focused.   So for example, when I start a stage, I focus on a specific spot on the target, (not just the target).  I then draw and in the process of driving the gun to the target the dot will come into view.   I  refine the picture depending on distance and hard cover/no shoots and press the trigger.  

 

I did pracice a bit a bit with this and found what helped me most was dry fire practice presenting the gun.  Work through those steps a few times picking  a spot when I dry fired.  Then do the same drill by picking the spot visually, focus intently on it, then close my eyes, present the gun and then open them after presenting the gun and pulling the trigger when I think I’m on target.  Then I open my eyes and see if I’m actually on target.  Suprizingly it didn’t take long and I was able to get this down where I’m almost always on target.  This really helped me to train the mechanics of aligning my muscle memory/gun index to my visual focus.  Then when shooting a stage, it became easy, my gun just continues to follow my eyes from target to target.  

 

Dots are sooooooo much quicker than iron sights.  Just shot limited division today with my DVC and wow.  It had been a while since I used open sights and forgot how much more there is to do.  

 

Sounds like you have the drill down!! I was able to go out shooting with a friend and took a look through his red dot on his PCC. Even though it was a PCC I was surprised that the dot was still there and in focus even though I was target focused. Thanks for the confirmation of being target focused and your drill. I have some work to do on a gun I"m prepping for production and moving my Beretta 92 towards a red dot.

[Angus46]

44 minutes ago, Bench said:

Sounds like you have the drill down!! I was able to go out shooting with a friend and took a look through his red dot on his PCC. Even though it was a PCC I was surprised that the dot was still there and in focus even though I was target focused. Thanks for the confirmation of being target focused and your drill. I have some work to do on a gun I"m prepping for production and moving my Beretta 92 towards a red dot.

With my M and P I usually am in the top 10 or so in the matches here.  Today with going to Limited Major with my STI I was mid pack.  Starting to question why I wanted to change guns and go from a dot back to open sights.  LOL

 

I bet you will love the dot on your Beretta.  My prediction in 10 years dots I’ll be more common than iron sights on pistols.

Edited July 15, 2018 by Angus46

[Bench]

12 hours ago, Angus46 said:

With my M and P I usually am in the top 10 or so in the matches here.  Today with going to Limited Major with my STI I was mid pack.  Starting to question why I wanted to change guns and go from a dot back to open sights.  LOL

 

I bet you will love the dot on your Beretta.  My prediction in 10 years dots I’ll be more common than iron sights on pistols.

Thanks Angus16, I'm looking forward to the day where I'll have my own red dot vs. iron sights story.

[Nalle2491]

keep both eyes open and focuso on your target. After a while everuthing will start to focus without thinking about it. Its the beauty of a red dot sight.

[ShredderTactical]

I second what others here have already said.  Angus46 gave an accurate description above about how to break this down.  Focus on your target (where you want the bullet to hit), then drive the gun to your point of aim and the dot should appear.  This takes lots of practice to be consistent with your presentation every time you bring the pistol up for a shot.  Dryfire is your friend here and will get you where you need to go without spending any money on ammo!

I switched from iron sights to red dot about 1 1/2 years ago when I was struck with aging eye syndrome and figured it was worth a shot.  Before switching, I tried chasing some magical prescription for my eyeglasses so that I could continue to shoot with iron sights but could not find a good solution that worked for me.  The great thing with a red dot is that all you need to focus on is the target, at one focal distance, instead of dealing with three focal distances (rear sight, front sight, target).  I have been using a Vortex Razor on a Glock 17 Gen4 MOS and shoot Carry Optics division in USPSA matches several times each month.  I’ve had C class for about a year now, starting to shoot B scores on the classifiers and my average is on a steady rise toward making B since reading some books about proper mental focus.  Enjoy the red dot, they are most likely the wave of the future for all shooters and can put the fun back into shooting when you have old(er) eyes !

[Doublehelix]

So I just got a new 22 pistol that I want to add a red dot to start using for Steel Challenge, but I will continue to use my Limited Major gun with iron sights for USPSA. Sounds like this is going to be a problem switching back and forth (front sight focus to target focus). Does anyone else do this and find it is a problem?

 

Also looking at the Vortex Venom. Recommendations for the 3 MOA or the 6 MOA dot?

 

Thanks, hope this wasn't too much of a hijack!

[George16]

Go with the 6 MOA. I’m using a vortex Viper 6 MOA on my TSO and I like it so far.

[ShredderTactical]

George16 - Another vote for 6 MOA dot size, has worked great for me for the past 22 months of shooting USPSA Carry Optics and I would not go smaller.  Some folks use 3 MOA, but most of the feedback I read and hear about seems to support that the majority favor 6 MOA.  You want a larger dot in order to pick it up faster for the initial shot and this will also allow faster split times.  As for dot size, the 6 MOA dot will be about 3 inches at 50 yards and 1.5 inches at 25 yards and a 3 moa dot will be about half that size.  So, going smaller than 6 MOA is really not needed for USPSA type shooting and you want a little larger dot for fast acquisition to provide fast split and transition times.

As far as going back and forth between a red dot and iron sights, I think if you have a red fiber on your front iron sight you will be fine.  I gave up shooting iron sights at speed for competition due to my aging eyes, but most top level shooters I have talked with and heard speak on the subject agree that shooting with a red dot will actually improve your shooting experience and accuracy with iron sights.

As for Vortex...I'm a big fan of their products.  Have run their large Razor line scopes for precision long range tactical rifle matches for about 6 years and highly recommend them.  Have been using a Vortex Razor red dot w/6 MOA dot on a Glock 17 Gen 4 MOS in USPSA Carry Optics and can highly recommend that Vortex product.  I'm currently building a second Glock 17 Gen 4 MOS for a backup pistol and will be installing a Vortex Venom w/6 MOA dot on that one.

Good luck and have fun!

Edited August 9, 2018 by ShredderTactical
Add some info.

[sweatpants]

I'll be "that guy" ... I use a 2.5 MOA DPP and enjoy it.  I have also held and shot with an 8 MOA RTS2 and didn't really perceive a functional difference.

 

For shooting red dots I find it helps to exclusively target focus.  As far as finding the dot goes, practicing and honing an index is the only thing I've found to help.