Hornady LNL Progressive Issues

[MAC10]

19 minutes ago, Kenstone said:

Thanks for posting your results and a glued primer onto the frame like in the video I posted, worked.

Sounds like you filed the wrong end of that part though...

 

no i didnt. on the filing. the more i would file the further in it would screw in. but it got to the point it was rubbing on the

bottom of the slide. it would not stop it from working correctly though. i just knew a little more off it would have made

too much contact.

[paul788]

Try removing material from the other end other end of the body and then clip the spring to allow the punch to protrude further.   Won't work if you don't shorten the spring.  Mine go past flush now.

 

For FWS: when that happens I use a feeler gauge thinner than the cardboard. 

 

I have had my LNL with casefeeder for 13 years.  Biggest problem is spent primer crap and tumbler media hanging up the primer slide.  Keep a can of comp air and blow the punch and slide clean every hundred rounds.  I added a case feeder bowl flipper and eliminated the 9mm upside down issue.

 

YMMV

Paul Beck

[T-Free]

Paul you are correct, I literally just got done experimenting this lol!

[T-Free]

Here are some pictures of the experiment -

 

 All i did was cut off the part of the coil that doubles up (single spring picture points to this area). The springs are .017 diameter, so by clipping both sides that doubled up i just gained .034 of upward travel. The picture with the 2 springs is showing a new one and a modified one, and how little of the spring i cut on both ends (could only find 1 piece, the other piece I will find later when i step on it!) It still has about the same amount of tension and did not affect the overall length of the spring. With your now extra upward movement you will need to file the side that touches the press as stated by Kenstone and paul788, or the glued primer that you already did.

[MAC10]

i`ll try and do this tonight

[Kenstone]

3 hours ago, MAC10 said:

Rno i didnt. on the filing. the more i would file the further in it would screw in. but it got to the point it was rubbing on the

bottom of the slide. it would not stop it from working correctly though. i just knew a little more off it would have made

too much contact.

Re-read my posts, I suggested you file the other end of that part, not the shoulder near the thread.

The end that touches/contacts the press frame.

Even warned you the slide would catch on it, doing it the way you did.

um...never mind,

 

[Kenstone]

3 hours ago, T-Free said:

Kenstone- I initially wanted to do it that way but when you push it up "seating the primer" it is flush with the bottom of the nut and will not go up any farther. So filing that end would not resolve anything because it physically can't go any farther up. If the dimple on the press is covered with a washer and you have a flat surface I don't know how it would imorove anything. Have you filed the non threaded side before or just heard about it? I have a spare one I can experiment with.

OK, if doing it "that way" didn't solve it, the spring on the primer punch is probably coil bound, trim off a coil.

Not sure why this seems to be so complicated for some...

carry-on

I'm out...

 

 

Edited September 26, 2018 by Kenstone

[FWSixgunner]

Update: my primer feed woes have been isolated to Winchester SPPs.

CCI 500, Federal SPSs, and CCI 400s all feed without a hiccup.

Hornady says they’re unaware of any issues with Winchester primers but are sending a new slide & tube.

Hope this fixes it, or there may be several thousand WSPPs appearing in the classifieds soon.

[dannyd]

1 hour ago, FWSixgunner said:

Update: my primer feed woes have been isolated to Winchester SPPs.

CCI 500, Federal SPSs, and CCI 400s all feed without a hiccup.

Hornady says they’re unaware of any issues with Winchester primers but are sending a new slide & tube.

Hope this fixes it, or there may be several thousand WSPPs appearing in the classifieds soon.

Look at the primer Winchester's have curved cup and the rest are flat.   Winchester's also have problems in primer tube filling equipment.

[Fasthenk65]

I have a LNL and a 650... LNL is much smoother (once you go hand priming and separate recapping (I use rock chucker) :) 

 

Now my new 650 is running (including all) I can tell you I never go back!!!!!!

 

Now looking at Mark7 Evo to see if things can improve even more...

 

regards

[GMP]

I have an LNL and after some tuning its flawless.  IMO the press has too much clearance in some areas.  I took it completely apart, shimmed the shell plate and indexer wheel. Also some of the linkage pivots.  Stoned all the edges of the primer system smooth.  Add a larger thick flat washer to the shell plate bolt and Blue Loctite it in.  VERY small amount of Moly grease on the detents and a good amount on the pawls.  No more powder spill from case jumping, indexing never moves, no primer issues.  I have loaded about 10K 9mm rounds since.  I do deprime and clean brass first on a single stage.  In addition to better cleaning it also screens out some mil brass with staked primer pockets that will cause issues priming on any press.

[Harpo]

On 9/27/2018 at 4:14 PM, FWSixgunner said:

Update: my primer feed woes have been isolated to Winchester SPPs.

CCI 500, Federal SPSs, and CCI 400s all feed without a hiccup.

Hornady says they’re unaware of any issues with Winchester primers but are sending a new slide & tube.

Hope this fixes it, or there may be several thousand WSPPs appearing in the classifieds soon.

Last weekend I had a primer hang up on the edge of a primer pocket and pop.
It was a WSP.

Several weeks before that, I had one hang up in my primer feed tube, and I don't know how many I've accidentally crunched.

This makes me think L-N-Ls just don't like WSPs(maybe they're out of round or something). The only trouble I've had with CCIs(which I've run twice as many of through that press) has been due to me not leaning into the press enough on the priming step,  so I'll be switching back to those for sure.

[GMP]

On 9/25/2019 at 1:17 AM, Harpo said:

Last weekend I had a primer hang up on the edge of a primer pocket and pop.
It was a WSP.

Several weeks before that, I had one hang up in my primer feed tube, and I don't know how many I've accidentally crunched.

This makes me think L-N-Ls just don't like WSPs(maybe they're out of round or something). The only trouble I've had with CCIs(which I've run twice as many of through that press) has been due to me not leaning into the press enough on the priming step,  so I'll be switching back to those for sure.

Chamfer all edges including those of the primer slide hole, then polish.  Mine runs with any primers, WSP were no problem when Federals were out of stock.  Just a little more pressure on the handle to seat, I suspect because they are not plated (smooth) and not quite as soft as the Federals. My biggest issue has been with the powder measure, not function but corrosion.  I don't know what cheap steel/casting its made from but the drum rusts solid to the casting unless its stored clean and lubed.  I would always blow it clean with dry compressed air but to disassemble and clean of lube before every use is a PIA.   I have since installed an older RCBS powder measure I've had for 40 years, no more problems.

[vince]

Just this past week, i bought another LNL AP to add to my bench. (i`ve been a hornady buyer even way back when it was Pacific reloading, yeah, i`m that old) I dialed in my load on this new LNL AP, banged out 500 rounds of 9mm with zero issues the first night i had it mounted to the bench. The press came already dialed in on the pawls right from hornady, and it couldnt have been more perfectly timed, hornady did a great job assembling and setting up this press from the factory. I set-up the priming system slide, (ww wsp primers) ran flawless, zero hiccups zero stoppages in 500 rounds, other than refilling with more primers and bullets. Pay no attention to some of the youfoolers (youtube) that tell you how to center the primer system... it needs to run a few thousandth`s past center to work perfect. When the machine is new, it runs a little and some of you are getting into trouble real quick because you dont understand it. Some of you are tinkering way more than you need to. Go a smidgen past center, it will begin wear in a little bit and come more centered as it wears in from new. Yes, you`ll have to re-adjust it maybe once after you`ve run it awhile. Everything has to take a set, then it will settle down. Yup, even the dillon`s have to settle down. Every press does. Its nature of the beasts. No press is 100% perfect. Every press is going to NEED a little TLC once in awhile. Yup, even a dillon needs some TLC too.

 

One thing people seem to overlook, every time, is the shell plate. (whyyyyyyyyyy, is this ALWAYS overlooked?!?!?! It should be one of the first things looked at when problems arise in timing) Ok, keep in mind, i know of no written spec`s for the ball bearing seating depths, i`m just going off from past years experience with hornady progressive presses. Remove your shell plate from the press, then flip the shell plate over, and make sure the detente ball bearings aren`t pushing out to far out of the shell plate with to much spring pressure under the ball bearing. If they are pushing out to far with alot of spring pressure behind them, it will cause alot of UNNECESSARY drag while rotating. (a hard dragging shell plate can give you false understandings of whats actually going on) If the shell plate is dragging to hard, this will also cause your shell plate to jump harder, which some of us know, as case/powder jumping while indexing. The fix for the ball bearings is to punch the ball bearings back into the shell plate a little deeper with a brass punch from the under side of the shell plate. Now flip the shell plate over and look at the top of it where the black bearing covers are. Make sure they are flush (or just slightly under) to the top of the shell plate. If they look to high, or above the shell plate surface, you punched them to deep. Take your punch and with a hammer, tap them just a tiny bit below the top of the shell plate surface. You should be real close to having a perfect indexing shell plate. Feel free to play with it a little. No 2 presses are equally the same. (nope, not even dillon is THAT good, nobody is) There is absolutely no need for the shell plate to drag and then jump hard into its detentes. Consider it when the shell plate is moving all those cases during its indexing process, that creates ALOT of drag too. So we need the shell plate to move as smooth and freely as possible.

 

Clean your sub-plate, put a tiny small dab of white lithium grease in the detente pockets, place a film of white lithium between the contact points of the shell plate and sub-plate, install the shell plate, WITHOUT the shell plate spring. Now check for rotational indexing and timing. If the shell plate still jumps hard, move the bearings a little bit more. This usually fixes the LNL AP, as long as you`ve followed the instructions in the manual for setting the pawl timing. Dont forget to make sure you put the shell plate spring back down into its groove in the sub-plate once your happy with its smoother indexing. This method i just wrote out here, will make the indexing MUCH smoother, and stops the case/powder jumping. At the least, it will cut the jumping down by 50% or in most cases, eliminate it all together.

 

Most people are not mechanically minded, so i dont expect everybody who own/bought a Horandy LNL AP press to understand them enough to know how to make them run flawless. I`ve never seen a LNL AP i couldnt fix, or make run 100% flawless, after somebody messed it up. I still have AND use the first Hornady Pro-Jector press i bought over 30yrs ago, and it still runs flawless as the day i bought it new. In 30yrs, i`ve adjusted the timing twice. And thats after 30+yrs of loading on it. I have a 3 pound coffee can that is over flowing with spent primers, and i`m filling my second 3 pound coffee can, and it too, is almost running over wit spent primers... so that will tell you how many rounds that press has loaded in that length of time. Thats quite a few spent primers to be able to fill 2 three pound coffee cans. Now i need to put another can under the bench for my other presses. Guess i better go make more coffee, cause i need more cans to catch my spent primers.

 

Hornady`s warranty? Well, i finally had to call them after 30+yrs. This was the first time i have ever had to call Hornady for anything. I`ve never had to in the past because their products work fine for me. BUT anyhow, i called them to ask them why the powder measure hopper was so cloudy with this latest LNL AP press, couldnt see the powder thru it very clearly. So i wanted them to replace it because i thought i got a bad one. So, this is what i was told... the NEW powder hoppers are made from a different product than all shiny clear earlier ones previously. Supposedly, this NEW material they are now using, are supposedly not as quickly effected by powders like the earlier hoppers were. We`ll see. But nonethless, Hornady sent me out another hopper free of charge to take care of one of my other powder measure hoppers that was starting to become loose from age. Pretty darn nice of them to do that for me. The people in CS were absolutely polite, seemed to care about my questions. When they directed my call to a tech, super nice guy. No questions asked, just asked me for my address and sent me a brand new hopper free of charge to my door. I would say hornady pretty much has a NO BS warranty as well.

 

Sorry for the long rant guys... i just think some things really needed addressing.

 

vince 

Edited February 11, 2020 by vince

[DRock]

Thanks for the tutorial, vince. I don't own a LNL but always thought if I ever got tired of my LCT I'd get one. After all these years I'm not sure my brain could keep track of more than one case at a time. 

 

Dave

[slodsm]

I ran a blue SDB for a long time when I only loaded 9mm. I decided to step into limited late last year so it made more sense to me to sell the SDB to offset the cost of a LnL and go with it. 
 

The first 100 rounds were rough, there were little things that were rough like burs in the primer slide, the indexing being ever so slightly off on the down stroke (shell plate up) and a few other things. Once I worked out the issues with the , primer feed, got the indexing correct, figured out the appropriate tension on the detents of the shell plate, and a couple of other things I can’t even remember, it runs smooth and fast with no issues. 
 

I was just in the garage tonight and I swapped my 40 stuff out for my 9mm stuff, reset the powder throw to what I needed, and started slinging brass. Took 50 minutes give it take to load 300 rounds of 9mm and fill one primer tube. 
 

Out of the box it’s not as refined as my Dillon was, but once you make some minor adjustments it’s a caddy and I have no issues with it or with recommending it to someone else. 

[Charlestiller]

Stoning on the primer system is an absolute must right out of the box! Once you get that squared away it’s really just small adjustments to get them to run smooth!


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[vince]

On 2/22/2020 at 11:41 PM, Charlestiller said:

Stoning on the primer system is an absolute must right out of the box! Once you get that squared away it’s really just small adjustments to get them to run smooth!


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Yes, i totally agree. Stone BOTH of the primer bar`s, they do have crappy burrs most of the time on them right out of the gate.

 

 

[vince]

May have to chamfer the small primer hole open a little bit more, and polish it too. I use flitz polish with a dremel tool. Seen a couple i`ve had to do that to, to let the primer drop easier into position. But DO NOT enlarge the primer hole down inside the bar!

 

I would just polish the large primer bar chamfered area. Most i`ve seen dont really need re-chamfering. You can get away with using your case chamfering tools. Be careful using a carbide one though, as it will cut extremely fast.

 

And i recommend people to stay off youfool (youtube), there is a few people saying these primer bars have to be set zero centered...NOT TRUE! You have to set the rod to allow the priming slide bars to go past "center" a few thousandths, then when it comes back towards the sub-plate, wah lah, primer is there for the next round!

 

Just got done loading 1,000 rounds of 9mm`s, and 500 rounds of 45acp`s for this coming weekends club shoot. Both LNL`s ran non-stop without a hiccup.

Edited February 24, 2020 by vince

[Tunachaser]

"You have to set the rod to allow the priming slide bars to go past "center" a few thousandths, then when it comes back towards the sub-plate, wah lah, primer is there for the next round! "

X2

 

and one other thing I have found helpful is to occasionally run a Q-tip through the primer feed tube.  I put some alcohol on the first end and leave the second one dry, then push it through with the primer follower (part #10).  A clean primer system is a thing of joy.

[vince]

16 minutes ago, Tunachaser said:

"You have to set the rod to allow the priming slide bars to go past "center" a few thousandths, then when it comes back towards the sub-plate, wah lah, primer is there for the next round! "

X2

 

and one other thing I have found helpful is to occasionally run a Q-tip through the primer feed tube.  I put some alcohol on the first end and leave the second one dry, then push it through with the primer follower (part #10).  A clean primer system is a thing of joy.

Exactly, thank you, you get it!!! I actually use my stainless rifle cleaning rod with a JAG and a tiny patch to clean my priming tubes. Clean it just like i do any barrel of my guns. I`ll run a few patches (with gun cleaner) thru it until its clean, then run a couple last patches with some brak-kleen to clean out and evaporate any residue left behind. Talk about smooth operating afterwards.

 

I always keep a can of compressed air on the bench at all times too, just to give a shot of air into the primer cup and slide bar to make sure nothing got in there. I have yet to have a problem with the priming systems on any of my LNL AP`s. And being that the hornady powder measure's are good and tight, i never see powder leakages. Past dillon powder measures i`ve had, were a nightmare for powder puking all over the place.

 

I also got rid of the LNL AP steel shell plate retainer springs too. Those retainer springs are a joke on the LNL AP press. I just run a rubber oring on them instead. No powder jumping out of the cases anymore when the shell plate moves to the next stage. The oring also actually absorbs the shock when the shell plate turns. The oring also holds the case more firmly into the shell plates. I rub a very tiny film of lube on the oring, then install it under the shell plate. If there were ever an improvement anyone could do on a LNL AP press, replace the steel retaining shell plate spring and install an oring. Biggest improvement you`ll ever do to these presses. Not to mention, the price you have to pay hornady for those worthless shell plate retaining springs is just ridiculous. You can buy a bag of orings dirt cheap, and they last longer.

[Charlestiller]

Exactly, thank you, you get it!!! I actually use my stainless rifle cleaning rod with a JAG and a tiny patch to clean my priming tubes. Clean it just like i do any barrel of my guns. I`ll run a few patches (with gun cleaner) thru it until its clean, then run a couple last patches with some brak-kleen to clean out and evaporate any residue left behind. Talk about smooth operating afterwards.
 
I always keep a can of compressed air on the bench at all times too, just to give a shot of air into the primer cup and slide bar to make sure nothing got in there. I have yet to have a problem with the priming systems on any of my LNL AP`s. And being that the hornady powder measure's are good and tight, i never see powder leakages. Past dillon powder measures i`ve had, were a nightmare for powder puking all over the place.
 
I also got rid of the LNL AP steel shell plate retainer springs too. Those retainer springs are a joke on the LNL AP press. I just run a rubber oring on them instead. No powder jumping out of the cases anymore when the shell plate moves to the next stage. The oring also actually absorbs the shock when the shell plate turns. The oring also holds the case more firmly into the shell plates. I rub a very tiny film of lube on the oring, then install it under the shell plate. If there were ever an improvement anyone could do on a LNL AP press, replace the steel retaining shell plate spring and install an oring. Biggest improvement you`ll ever do to these presses. Not to mention, the price you have to pay hornady for those worthless shell plate retaining springs is just ridiculous. You can buy a bag of orings dirt cheap, and they last longer.

Could you take some pictures of this O ring setup and post them please?


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[vince]

14 minutes ago, Charlestiller said:

 

 

Could you take some pictures of this O ring setup and post them please?


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I sure will if i can get them from my phone into my computor! Give me some time, i`m an old f_rt so it takes me a bit to get it onto the forum.

I`m actually surprised i havent seen more people do this. I`ve been using orings on the shell plates dating way back to the days when i bought my first hornady pro-jector press in the 80`s.

[vince]

Well hopefully if i did this right, it should be view able here

[Beef15]

1 hour ago, vince said:

Well hopefully if i did this right, it should be view able here

You have a size, part number, or link where one can find these o-rings? I have close to 30k on my original spring without major issue, but I'd like to give this a try.