Decision on 650 or 1050 upgrade

[Bayou]

I've read almost every topic on this site and others about the 650 vs 1050 debate and still undecided. I have a 550 with all the add ons except the case feeder and want to either sell the 550 and get a 650 or keep it and get a1050. I don't reload a bunch of calibres, mainly 9 with 45 (small primer) and 40. In anticipation off 223 reloading, I do have a new Giraud that I've never used as it was bought for 223 that I could sell if need be.   Not made out of money but like to buy/cry once. I would eventually be putting a bullet feeder on either and of course the case feeder for the 650. On both machines I would try to seat/crimp so I could keep the powder check. It seems the advantage for the 1050 would be the built in swage priming on the downstroke. The swage would be nice because of the possible crimps of 9 and 223 but I don't think that would be a deal breaker. The 1050 off the bat seems to be $800 higher not counting the more expensive conversions/quick change because I'm lazy. I've read several times from different places that a 650 with all the bells and whistles is not far off from a 1050 but I can't seem to make the math right or I'm missing some bells and whistles. Monthly usage in 9 is roughly 2k maybe a little less but I have two kids that are starting to shoot (22 for now). I do plan on getting envolved in steel this year or trying uspa but haven't yet as we will be moving soon.  Probably 2 to 3 matches a month due to work schedule. Any insight appreciated 

[rjacobs]

super 1050 is an awesome press no doubt...  Caliber conversions are about 500 bucks(200 tool head, 125 for caliber conversion kit, 30 bucks for case feed plate, 70-150+ for dies).  Then if you need the primer conversion to large primer its 115 bucks.

 

Mr. Bullet Feeder conversions are 150, but that would apply to either press.

 

 

Im probably one of the only people who has gone from running 2 Super 1050's down to a single XL650 MOSTLY due to conversion kit costs.  Im happy with the XL650 with case feeder and bullet feeder.  Its plenty of press for me.  I just couldnt get over the caliber conversion price on the 1050.  I needed to get setup for loading 223 and 45acp and was looking at spending 1000 bucks.

 

I like the primer swage on the 1050, although I will likely get the frame mounted Swage-It swage setup for my 650(i know all about the warranty issues).  I also liked seating primers on the stroke of the 1050 vs. the push that the 550 and 650 have.

 

As far as speed.  I am likely in the 800-1000 round per hour range on the 650.  I could run the 1050 between 1200-1500 rounds per hour.  I COULD run it as fast as 2000 rounds per hour with a second guy to keep the machine fed, although I would likely fall over dead after about 15 minutes at that speed.  It was a work out LOL.

Edited May 13, 2018 by rjacobs

[oteroman]

Get the 1050

use one Toolhead 

reload big batches

priming on the down stroke and swaging big pluses. 

 

[tkheard]

I started with a 550. Ran it for two years and added a case feeder. It was quite fiddly, but eventually worked it out. Got a good deal on a 650; no casefeeder issues at all. It ran very well. Started shooting revolver and needed well seated primers. Had trouble being consistent. I found a 1050 at a really good price (used) and have been more than happy with it. Swaging on the press and adjustable primer seating depth on the down stroke are fabulous. I load 9mm major, 45ACP, and revo on it. I added an MBF for my 9mm. It is a dream!
I seriously considered the 650 to start, but was scared of the progressive character of the 650, but really shouldn’t have been so shy. If I had to do it all over again, I would have gone straight to the 1050. YMMV, but that’s just me.
You will be pleased with whatever you choose. All of them are fine machines.

[camaross400]

Go with the 1050. Yes...the caliber conversion is expensive. However, I looked on calguns and purchased them used from fellow calgunners and saved a lot of money. You can always find someone that is selling 1050 parts.

Priming on the downstroke is great

You mentioned the Giraud. Trimming on the press is great for me. I have a Giraud as well but I rarely use it now. I do everything on the press.

I also ended up adding a Mark VII and process 223 brass at about 2000 rounds per hour (decap, Swage, resize & trim)


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[Want2BS8ed]

Another vote for the 1050. As mentioned previously, it's just not the priming on the down stroke, but the consistency and adjustability of the primer depth that's worth the price of admission in my opinion.

Caliber conversions are expensive, but you don't necessarily need a head for every caliber you load. I have 2 1050's and several heads setup for calibers I shoot frequently, but I have one head that is a floater. Dies are switched out as needed for things like 10mm or 44 magnum that are used enough that loading on a single stage doesn't make sense, but having a permanent head doesn't either because of the cost.

M


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[dvc4you]

Get the 1050, keep the 550 for load development.


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[Bayou]

I think I will get the 650 if my 550 sells and if doesn't I'll get the 1050 to go with it.

[pjb45]

I use a 1050 for 9mm, 40, and 45.  Each with its own tool head so to speak---reloading the .223 was a major concern.

1050-haveing the extra space for the sizing and undersize die is awesome.  The stroke is smooth.

223:

1 tool head for decapping, sizing, and running the trimmer.  I had the full setup including a small vacuum cleaner.  I would do thousands and thousands at a time.

2nd tool head resiizing and powder, etc.

Bottleneck cases require more exacting prep work in my experience, especially for the AR platform.  I used the JP case gauge.  Cases would pass the gauge and hang up in the gun.  This was an operator issue not the press.

I liked I was able to customize my load but what a PIA when I got it wrong.  Cheaper to buy .223.  Just as a side note I used X193 for the most part of SMMM3G and RM3G.  They worked fine for most of the distances.  I did have dope for my 69 gr SMK with VV133 or VV135 for the long long shots.

 

Conversion from one caliber to the next with the extra tool heads was not all that time consuming.  One tool head for all calibers was a pain hence my buying multiple.  Make sure you have the right wrenches.  It would have helped if I had standardize on one brand of dies. 

 

I would rather have one 1050 than 3 650s. 

[PPGMD]

I have a 650, and I wish I had just bought a 1050. For me I reload only one caliber a vast majority of the time in large batches. And along with the fact that my brass often has tight primer pockets (ie I want a swager), are my reasons.

[Bayou]

I agree with the one tool head being a pain, I would want multiple tool heads to make life enjoyable. In all reality, I too would only be loading 9, 40, 45. The 223 would be a possibility but hell I have a new Giraud that I've never used lol. 

[191138sc]

21 hours ago, Bayou said:

I agree with the one tool head being a pain, I would want multiple tool heads to make life enjoyable. In all reality, I too would only be loading 9, 40, 45. The 223 would be a possibility but hell I have a new Giraud that I've never used lol.

Bayou, you have laid out the main issue. Cost of the multiple heads. But what a beautiful machine!

[camaross400]

I agree. One toolhead didn’t work for me so I purchased one for each caliber I load. I purchased it all at a reduced price.


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[ultimase]

11 hours ago, camaross400 said:

I agree. One toolhead didn’t work for me so I purchased one for each caliber I load. I purchased it all at a reduced price.


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Just lucky timing buying them all or could you share a source?

[bjones6686]

Keep the 550 and buy a 1050 setup in the caliber you shoot and reload the most of. Then over time you can buy tool heads and caliber conversions for the 1050 and phase the 550 out. With you doing 9mm and anticipation of doing .223 the swage with be a must have for those calibers.  

[camaross400]

Just lucky timing buying them all or could you share a source?

It was lucky timing. I searched on calguns for 1050 toolheads each day and ended up purchasing them from a few different sellers. People were downsizing, and I agreed to take them off their hands.!


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[crispyrice]

I decided to get the 650 over the 1050 thinking that I wouldn't shoot enough to justify the 1050..........well I was wrong and am looking into picking up a 1050.  I would go with 1050 and if money is an issue just start with one tool head and make large batches  like other have said.

[Acsr]

Been loading on a pro 2000, which was fine but missed a case feeder, bought a 1050 off the classifieds, such a sweet machine, I have no experience on a650, but my nod goes to the 1050

[gobabygo]

I went from a 550, then added a 650, then added a 1050.  After the 1050 I couldn't stand loading on the 550 & 650 so I sold them and bought conversions for the 1050 to do everything.

[Full mag]

Go with the 1050 it is the best thing since sliced bread, the best being priming on the down stroke. I have a 650 also but I would rather load or process everything on the 1050. Buy once cry once

[Bayou]

Gonna keep the 550 and get a 1050, tired of going back and forth. Already through half a life and can't take it with me lol.

[Micky]

9 hours ago, Bayou said:

Gonna keep the 550 and get a 1050, tired of going back and forth. Already through half a life and can't take it with me lol.

I have about come to the same conclusion as you have. Like you, I am tired of going back and forth. The call of the 1050 is strong, and I don't really have to justify purchasing one. Reloading is very enjoyable for me. Time to make a decision and never look back.

[Want2BS8ed]

I have about come to the same conclusion as you have. Like you, I am tired of going back and forth. The call of the 1050 is strong, and I don't really have to justify purchasing one. Reloading is very enjoyable for me. Time to make a decision and never look back.

If you need some justification though...

One of my two 1050's is driven by a MkVII. I am loading 147g subsonic 9mm. The closest commercial loading is running ~$0.92 a round. I'm reloading that same jacketed bullet (not plated) for $0.19 a round using cleaner burning powder and tuned to my gun. At a rather sedate (but realistic) 1,800 rounds an hour; that's a savings of $1,314.00 an hour.

See? In less than an hour you can pay for at least two full 1050 conversions.

Feel free to use the same logic for buying new guns as well. Post-facto-justification at its finest! :-)

M




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[jhgtyre]

10 hours ago, Want2BS8ed said:

If you need some justification though...

One of my two 1050's is driven by a MkVII. I am loading 147g subsonic 9mm. The closest commercial loading is running ~$0.92 a round. I'm reloading that same jacketed bullet (not plated) for $0.19 a round using cleaner burning powder and tuned to my gun. At a rather sedate (but realistic) 1,800 rounds an hour; that's a savings of $1,314.00 an hour.

See? In less than an hour you can pay for at least two full 1050 conversions.

Feel free to use the same logic for buying new guns as well. Post-facto-justification at its finest! :-)

M




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Now THAT is my kind of logic

[Bayou]

lol, thanks I need 9mm sub rounds also. Damn, like the forbidden fruit.