Pros/Cons Limited Minor

[motosapiens]

2 hours ago, Steppenwolf said:

Not sure what your point is. Single Stack is a separate division and a Production gun does not enter into the statistical equation nor does the overall placement of a Single Stack shooter in a match. The statistics provided only support the conclusion that you have a better chance of winning Single Stack (if shooting minor) in a larger match than you do shooting minor in Limited. You can bring lasagna to a chili cookoff, but you ain't gonna win first place.

 

the point is that since ss minor and production are essentially the same thing, conclusions can be drawn by comparing them. The fairly obvious conclusion is that ss minor is very viable in most matches. The only place it is totally unviable is SS matches held at PASA.

 

With a real SS division at nationals this year, I'll be interested to see how it shakes out. I suspect some minor shooters will be at or near the top.

 

Of course this has nothing to do with limited minor, which is a total loser proposition.

[motosapiens]

2 hours ago, waktasz said:

It's "easier" to shoot minor, but you can get away with being looser with your hits shooting Major. In Limited, this allows you to go faster, especially on partial targets. 

In SS, I'd rather have the extra rounds

 

In SS major you pretty much *have* to shoot semi-recklessly on paper to take advantage of major scoring, but be able to shoot steel with precision to avoid unplanned standing reloads. It depends a lot what sort of partials you see. if they are zebras, major has no advantage. If they are horizontal/diagonal ones that leave you little A and lots of C, then major has a pretty big advantage.  The same dynamic is at work in limited, but since the guys at PASA don't put on matches where they try screw a particular PF in limited, it turns out to be a non-issue.

[waktasz]

The guys at PASA put on 8-8-8-8 stages for SS 

21 minutes ago, motosapiens said:

 

the point is that since ss minor and production are essentially the same thing, conclusions can be drawn by comparing them. The fairly obvious conclusion is that ss minor is very viable in most matches. The only place it is totally unviable is SS matches held at PASA.

 

With a real SS division at nationals this year, I'll be interested to see how it shakes out. I suspect some minor shooters will be at or near the top.

 

Of course this has nothing to do with limited minor, which is a total loser proposition.

 

Where's the like button?

[wtturn]

5 hours ago, waktasz said:

Except battle in the Bluegrass was won by a Production gun shooting Minor.

 

 

 

I heard it was a piece of shit Glock, to add insult to injury.

 

5 hours ago, Nathanb said:

To even take this a step further. The 2nd and 3rd place shooters each had four mikes and a bunch of Deltas while the production minor guy shot all alphas and Charlie’s.  

 

This means its its easier to shoot minor right?

 

 

I heard that guy used an Accuglock cheater gun.

[waktasz]

I thought that guy was another Tanfo nuthugger?

[matteekay]

To go all the way back to the beginning... could the rise in Limited Minor simply be due to new shooters running what they have? I’d think the most common sort of pistol sold is a plastic 9mm that holds 15+ rounds. Add three mags and you’re good to go for most local matches. Production is the other likely division for them, but that requires more investment in mags and carriers (and rulebook reading).

I could be totally wrong, of course. I mostly shoot SS Minor and Revo, lol.

[Tasteslikechicken]

To go all the way back to the beginning... could the rise in Limited Minor simply be due to new shooters running what they have? I’d think the most common sort of pistol sold is a plastic 9mm that holds 15+ rounds. Add three mags and you’re good to go for most local matches. Production is the other likely division for them, but that requires more investment in mags and carriers (and rulebook)

That is exactly why I started shooting limited minor!


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[matteekay]

That is exactly why I started shooting limited minor!


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I shot my very first two matches with a MR Baby Eagle II (a Walther P99 clone) in Limited Minor because that’s what I could get away with (3 15-round mags, a cheapo mag pouch, and a holster on a regular belt). I’m sure that’s not why MOST people do it but I suspect there’s a nonzero quotient of shooters.

I actually just picked up a L-Minor gun for the winter season (I’m focused on Revo until after the IRC) to compliment my L-Major gun. I want to spend some time focusing on good hits and not worrying about reloads without relying on Major scoring superpowers.

[BillGarlandJr]

I’ve shot quite a bit of Limited with a minor caliber pistol (P320 X5) this year. Locally, the difference in scoring isn’t a big deal, and I do fairly well, however, at larger matches where there is more heat the difference is felt more. I can’t go fast enough to make up for the difference in points given for C and D hits, and a shooter of equal skill shooting major definitely has the advantage. Before shooting Limited this year I’d shot Production mostly for the previous 13 years, and I really enjoyed the heck out of it. As a division it has some unique challenges compared to the Limited, Open, and CO. What I’ve enjoyed about shooting Limited, even in minor, this year is shooting this game with a high cap pistol allows for some more agressive stage plans, and opportunities to take some chances. I dig that! Also, I can shoot for competition what I carry for work....a P320 with 21 round magazines. More reps with a work pistol has never done me any harm. All that being said, I’ll likely end up with a major caliber high cap pistol before next year. Sometimes the competitor in me wins over the practical side.

[matteekay]

Right, it’s totally a trade-off. Sometimes you just have to decide if you’d rather stand a better chance of winning or just run something because you want to.

Ex: I shoot a 6-shot Minor revo because that’s my ICORE gun and boy, does it hurt on the longer USPSA stages, lol. I could get another 627 to be more competitive, or run my 629 in Major, but I like my Rhino too much.

[ima45dv8]

Someone said it before me, and it seems true...

 

If I were shooting against my cloned-self, and I was shooting Major while my cloned-self was shooting Minor, I'd kick his ass every time.

++++++++++++++

In my limited experience I've found a lot of new shooters shoot Limited Minor because their equipment supports it (What do you mean I can only load 10 rounds?!!?), and more importantly, they don't have to plan or execute reloads as much. Having only 3-4 magazines to start with, before becoming a complete gear-a-holic like the rest of us, it's a good option for a beginner. 

[Brooke]

On 4/29/2018 at 2:03 AM, Foxtrotx1 said:

I have to wonder if the decline in popularity of .40 in the general public/LEOs will slowly, eventually show it's head in USPSA. Brass may become more expensive, projectiles as sales volume goes down. I already reload 9 and .45, no way I want to stock a 3rd pistol caliber. 

 

Im with you!! 40 is obsolete and it will strat to show both in availability of guns and used casings. There is no excuse for the scoring difference except history.

[GrumpyOne]

4 hours ago, ima45dv8 said:

Someone said it before me, and it seems true...

 

If I were shooting against my cloned-self, and I was shooting Major while my cloned-self was shooting Minor, I'd kick his ass every time.

++++++++++++++

In my limited experience I've found a lot of new shooters shoot Limited Minor because their equipment supports it (What do you mean I can only load 10 rounds?!!?), and more importantly, they don't have to plan or execute reloads as much. Having only 3-4 magazines to start with, before becoming a complete gear-a-holic like the rest of us, it's a good option for a beginner. 

 

[ima45dv8]

That was it!

 

It's too bad Chris isn't around much these days.

[motosapiens]

On 8/19/2018 at 3:46 AM, Brooke said:

 

Im with you!! 40 is obsolete and it will strat to show both in availability of guns and used casings. There is no excuse for the scoring difference except history.

my agency is going the other way. we made the last sissy-boys turn in their 9mms so everyone is carying 40 now. And at least I know the brass hasn't been through a 9-major gun a few times, lol.

[RangerTrace]

6 hours ago, motosapiens said:

my agency is going the other way. we made the last sissy-boys turn in their 9mms so everyone is carying 40 now. And at least I know the brass hasn't been through a 9-major gun a few times, lol.

Around here, 40 is fading away.  There are a few hold out agencies, but most have gone to 9mm, including mine.  

[perttime]

On 4/30/2018 at 5:14 AM, waktasz said:

Physically, you can shoot a minor round a little better, but in practice, you can shoot major faster because you don't have to aim  

 

My theory, too.

Last weekend, I had to aim my .45, though. That helped me do better than expected on a stage with targets at 25 meters - and mostly covered with no-shoots.

[IHAVEGAS]

On 8/19/2018 at 4:46 AM, Brooke said:

 

Im with you!! 40 is obsolete and it will strat to show both in availability of guns and used casings. There is no excuse for the scoring difference except history.

 

If it was obsolescence, or cost,  that drove things there would not be any 45's around by now. 

 

Edited August 21, 2018 by IHAVEGAS

[Hi-Power Jack]

1 hour ago, IHAVEGAS said:

 

there would not be any 45's around by now. 

 

I still have one of my .45's from the '80s lying around - never shoot it any more.

 

I'm all in on 9 mm's     

 

p.s.   That is the 1980s, NOT the 1880s.

[Sarge]

47 minutes ago, Hi-Power Jack said:

I still have one of my .45's from the '80s lying around - never shoot it any more.

 

I'm all in on 9 mm's     

 

p.s.   That is the 1980s, NOT the 1880s.

⏱?

[mike4045]

I shot limited minor for 3 months while waiting on my major pistol to be repaired. Shooting it faster was easy, doing it more accurately was not. About 12 to 15% difference in scores. Classifiers was about the same. I got my 40 backs and don't shoot 9mm in uspsa anymore. In single stack in my area stages lean toward a minor pistol to ge tot 10 rds. I am looking into getting a 9mm SS gun to play with.

[dthomas1003]

6 hours ago, RangerTrace said:

Around here, 40 is fading away.  There are a few hold out agencies, but most have gone to 9mm, including mine.  

Same with my agency. New officers are all issued 9mm now.

[Hi-Power Jack]

9 hours ago, dthomas1003 said:

Same with my agency. New officers are all issued 9mm now.

 

Any idea why ?   On paper, the .40 does seem to have some superior features.

[waktasz]

Capacity, recoil and with modern bullet design not much of an advantage over 9mm

 

[motosapiens]

14 hours ago, Hi-Power Jack said:

 

Any idea why ?   On paper, the .40 does seem to have some superior features.

 

millenials are such pansies that too many of them wash out of academies if they have to shoot grownup guns.

 

plus what waktasz said. The pendulum swings....