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USPSA, new PPC rules


mike NM

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1 minute ago, JAFO said:

 

I would be less upset about having to reload (I also shoot Production, after all) and more upset about investing in mag extensions that would become useless.  But I'm a tightwad, so YMMV.

 

If the USPSA rule does change, it will not affect the rules for UML or outlaw matches.  They will continue to be used.

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Well I will never have the chance to come to the great state of Texas . But, I'm sure you guys and girls have fun shooting your big sticks. But, Being unlucky living up here in NY where we can only have 10 rds. mags. So we reload and reload and reload. WE still have fun and new shooters learn to reload and reload without have any frustrations. Because that is what it is. As for as Open class USPSA I think they still have a mag rule of 170mm ? (limitation)

So, That they don't have a donkey dick sticking out the bottom of their weapon. Not trying to be a A but . Just jealous that we can't have more then 10 rds. and when is enough , enough?

But, I can see your side if 1 shooter has 42 round mag then I would what one also. 

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3 hours ago, WarrenZ said:

I just noticed that they changed the rule 14 wording about magazine couplers eliminating the side by side now does this mean the extension couplers as well?

14
Magazine holder restrictions
No magazine couplers
allowed, magazines must be
carried on the belt or in
apparel pockets. See rule
5.2.4. No restriction on
location on the belt. No thigh
rigs or tie down maga
zine
holders.

couplers are defined as side by side magazines and are NOT allowed. You CAN connect two or more magazines together end to end and still be legal. Do too many of them and you will be banging your knees on the magazines, LOL

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Leave PCC alone. Folks are having fun with it.  Putting stupid limits on PCC will kill it. Look at the innovations that has come out of it already.  There are companies that support PCC and make money at it, can not keep up with the PCC demands now. Let it grow.  As for the whining pistol shooters that complain because their pat on the back was not received this last match because a PCC shooter beat them, put a little cold water on your ego and shoot faster.  We all enjoy the same sport, shoot at the same targets and try to do it as fast and as possible. I have personally heard other shooters say at matches, there is no place for a carbine shooting a pistol match. Lets have fun, I sure enjoy shooting it.  I can say that if USPSA bogs down PCC , I will never renew my membership.  I have been in this sport for many, many years. I have been fortunate enough to have shot well in my prime, traveled the US, and have made and met some of the best folks out there. USPSA has been very good for me.

 

Lets have fun.

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2 hours ago, BartCarter said:

I have yet to shoot any match that required more than one reload.  Not a big deal.  I take a little pride in being proficient with a reload.

Me Too!  That's why I practice reloads.

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17 hours ago, Maximis228 said:

I have yet to see a PCC Shooter take HOA over a legit open shooter at a major. Nationals last year had a 10% difference between the two.

 

I shot PCC for several months last season, and I came to the same conclusion - An open gun is supposed to beat a PCC far more often than not.  I think the real pull is at a local level where B and C shooters can hit HOA with a rifle against average shooters who usually beat them.  I have moved back to limited, but am really looking forward to the Lucas Oil PCC match :) 

 

...and I think Chuck pretty much summed up the answer to the OP, which seemed pretty obvious to start with.

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47 minutes ago, Patrick Scott said:

For the guys posting screen caps of section 14 of the PCC appendix.. Go look at it again. It changed last night after I told Troy some stuff was missing from the rules that was in the BOD minutes.

I saw the small change they made in 14. Seems lame that some cannot understand what a coupler is and that it had to be defined as side by side. SIDE BY SIDE was NEVER ALLOWED in PCC. Connecting devices have been allowed as well as extension tubes. As usual, USPSA shooters get all twisted up over what is NOT said over what is. I can't tell you how many times I have seen or overheard how someone said that the COF didn't say I could not do that.... BUT gaming the system has always been a part of USPSA shooting.

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1 hour ago, Patrick Scott said:

For the guys posting screen caps of section 14 of the PCC appendix.. Go look at it again. It changed last night after I told Troy some stuff was missing from the rules that was in the BOD minutes.

If you have that much pull with Troy have him remove the rule that says a shooter can not even turn the dot on on a PCC unless under RO control. That is the dumbest thing. Well, except for PCC’s themselves.?

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12 minutes ago, Sarge said:

If you have that much pull with Troy have him remove the rule that says a shooter can not even turn the dot on on a PCC unless under RO control. That is the dumbest thing. Well, except for PCC’s themselves.?

HAH, I don't have any pull. I just let him know some stuff didn't make it through the update.   PCC is dumb(at pistol matches), but boy do I enjoy it. 

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17 hours ago, Darqusoull13 said:

The ability to give a brand new shooter 42 rounds to complete a 32 round stage simplifies the initial experience to the point that addiction happens without frustration. If you want reloads, shoot Single Stack, something I'd never wish on a first timer. Or just randomly reload your PCC. It really wont bother me at all. 

 

Folks shoot PCC to have fun their way. If the general membership responds similar to any of my local clubs, PCC shooters enjoy the division BECAUSE of the lack of limitations. Similar to Open, that means we prefer shooting our guns to reloading them. Do I practice reloads? Yes. Do I want to do a shitload of reloads instead of drag racing? Not really. That's part of the allure of PCC. 

 

If you'd like to shoot PCC at a match, I'd love to show you how much fun it is. Come on down to Texas where everything is bigger, including our mags :cheers:

100% this.  I started with Production 2 years ago when the addiction hit  I started gaming and loved it but quickly realized Production isn't a beginner friendly division, no matter what folks say based on equipment costs.  Racing / blasting away without counting rounds and worrying about hitting correct reload points between position transitions made what was already a fun game a complete and total addiction. 

 

There's no doubt pistols, especially Production, have in many ways a higher skill floor.  Upper levels of PCC also tend to push athleticism harder than pistol, since everyone is pretty accurate, and I'm not much of an athlete.  None of that matters, though, when the timer goes off and it's just gleeful blasting.  A 30 round limit wouldn't affect that all that much, but as an RO/SO I'd be very, very reluctant to try and police that.

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No side-by-side magazine couplers allowed. Magazines must be carried on the belt or in apparel pockets. See rule 5.2.4. No restriction on location on the belt. No thigh rigs or tie down magazine holders. End-to-end coupling/extension is allowed.

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1 hour ago, Sarge said:

If you have that much pull with Troy have him remove the rule that says a shooter can not even turn the dot on on a PCC unless under RO control...

^This, a lot of people are going to get DQ by Power Hungry RO's for just simply adjusting their stocks, turning on their reddots, brushing any dust of the gun while in the unbagging area....

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I usually turn on my dot and any adjustment at the safety table before I come to the line.  That is a DQ?  If you leave your dot on, that is a DQ?

 

I also test my trigger, bolt, etc. at the safety table.  What about that?

 

Obviously I don't load a magazine.

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1 minute ago, BartCarter said:

I usually turn on my dot and any adjustment at the safety table before I come to the line.  That is a DQ?  If you leave your dot on, that is a DQ?

 

I also test my trigger, bolt, etc. at the safety table.  What about that?

 

Obviously I don't load a magazine.

Bart, they are talking about at the unbagging area, not safety table

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34 minutes ago, noexcuses said:

Bart, they are talking about at the unbagging area, not safety table

 

There is quite a bit of ambiguity involved because one of the ranges I go to has a safety table at one berm and a rifle rack on the other. Un-bag on one side then carry the gun over and place it upright in the rack at the other.

I assume then that anything that has to be done to the carbine should be done on the safety table (remove optic caps, turn on red dot,  etc.) and nowhere else?

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7 minutes ago, Patrick Scott said:

I simply fuss with my dot at MR and ULSC, and I have my stock always set where I like it. I think that rule is a little harsh, but I also don't see the need to mess with the gun unless I'm up. 

 

That's what I do, too.

 

I can understand the simplicity of the rule.  You don't have a holster on a PCC, so whenever you are holding it away from a safe table or MR, you have access to the trigger.  To eliminate the arguments about what defines "handling", they just said you can carry it from point A to point B while not under RO supervision or at a safe table, and that's it.

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I've been to two Tier 4 matches with PCC, and two Tier 2 matches, and have not seen any enforcement of handling rules anywhere near that level.  Keen vigilance for flagging, of course, which there should be, but nobody was watching the unbagging at the berm or caring what you did with the gun while pointed at the berm. 

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