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mike NM

USPSA, new PPC rules

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Probably NOT a rumor... A buddy with good info says our friends at USPSA are coming out with some magazine restrictions for PPC..... You know there has been some serious whinning from within our shooting ranks. Why can't "they" allow the class to develope on it's own?... IF a 50 round magazine or drum works well?... We will all have one, an advantage or not?.... I see more and more 32 round stages locally, just to force a reload. Pretty soon, the "rule book" will be size of the "Bible"....So what if PPC is the high overall shooter in a match??, somebody has to "win"....  

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Do you think it's related to the current political climate, or is that coincidental?

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Hello: Since they did not have a magazine limit from the start or an overall length rule I think it will be difficult to enforce now. If they do have a magazine limit I think it will hurt PCC and may cause other shooting clubs to grab those shooters for PCC only matches. Bad move for USPSA if they mess with a division that is growing so fast. Thanks, Eric

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Not that I think it's needed, but I could see them adding some mag restrictions to create multiple PCC classes.  It would hard to make work well though with some having straight mags, some curved, etc...

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Back when the division was brand new I proposed to Mike a 30 round limit, because that keeps things competitive as almost every gun has a 30 round magazine, but not all will have the 40+ round magazines.

 

Mike's response was (paraphrased) "I don't want to put an additional burden on the ROs to have to count rounds."

 

So that would be a huge 180 on that issue. And I agree with him, as we see from the recent Florida State Match often ROs have trouble tracking a 10 round magazine

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IF this isn't bullshit it will kill the division and right now I get the impressions that is not something USPSA is looking to do given the growth of PCC. The most recent BOD meeting notes suggest a tone more in line with encouraging more manufacturers the flexibility in divisions to produce aftermarket products like basepads in PCC. 

 

Ranges that hold multiple events might just decide to change rule sets (e.g. UML) to continue to allow PCC to flourish and leave USPSA behind if this nonsense is true. 

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Darqusoull13..... please read the link I posted. 

 

Again, there is NO magazine restrictions. If you want to have 3 33 round glock magazines attached end to end then go for it. There is nothing in the rules prohibiting doing that.

 

Appendix D8--Pistol Caliber Carbine Division

1 Minimum Barrel Length **see Special Conditions** None (See special conditions.)

2 Approved/Permitted Calibers 9mm, .357 Sig, .40 S&W, 10mm, .45 ACP

3 Minimum Power Factor 125 **Minor Scoring Only**

4 Maximum Velocity **Minor Scoring Only** 1600 FPS

Quote

5 Magazine Capacity Limit None

6 Must have stock attached and be capable of being fired from shoulder position. **Note: Sig Brace and any variant thereof is not allowed** Handgun to carbine conversions are allowed, provided they meet the criteria above.**see Special Conditions** Yes, see 5.1.10.

7 Sling use authorized Yes

8 Optical sight/electronic sights permitted Yes

9 Compensators /Muzzle Brakes permitted Yes

10 Flash Hiders permitted Yes

11 Suppressors permitted No

12 Rules References All references to “handgun” are deemed to apply to PCC as well, except where the terms “holstering”, “drawing”, or “re-holstering” are referenced, and where otherwise noted. PCC specific rules are in the PCC rules addendum.

13 Lasers/Flashlights Yes

14 Magazine and Magazine holder restrictions No side-by-side magazine couplers allowed. Magazines must be carried on the belt or in apparel pockets. See rule 5.2.4. No restriction on location on the belt. No thigh rigs or tie down magazine holders. End-to-end coupling/extension is allowed.

15 Full Auto/ “Burst” Capabilities (one trigger pull fires more than one round--see special conditions) Permitted, but semi-auto function only, see PCC 5.1.11, PCC 5.1.12, PCC 10.5.18

16 Binary Triggers (firearm fires once on trigger pull and once on release) Not Allowed

 

Special Conditions:

1) Short Barreled Rifles (SBR’s) are permitted provided that the competitor is in full compliance with all state and federal laws and regulations concerning ownership and transport of the SBR.

2) Handgun to carbine conversions are allowed as long as the conversion is shot in PCC division, and meets the criteria in #6.

3) Full auto, burst fire, mechanically aided bump fire, and binary fire will result in a procedural on the first instance, and a disqualification for any subsequent occurrences, (unsafe gun handling, see PCC 10.5.18).

Edited by mstamper
added copy of pcc appendix

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I have yet to see a PCC Shooter take HOA over a legit open shooter at a major. Nationals last year had a 10% difference between the two.

 

Also... If you are shooting more than 32 rounds on a 32 round field course... you already f*#ked up.

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I think this was nothing but a rumor, afterall.

 

Edited by MikieM

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15 minutes ago, MikieM said:

I think this was nothing but a rumor, afterall.

Just like the rumor that went around about my second wife cheating on me. I never did believe it until I bought a used car one day and found her dress in the back seat. :lol:

 

My wife has decided that she will only have sex with me once a month.

 

I don't feel that bad though, I know 3 guys that she has cut out altogether. 

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1 hour ago, Maximis228 said:

I have yet to see a PCC Shooter take HOA over a legit open shooter at a major. Nationals last year had a 10% difference between the two.

 

Also... If you are shooting more than 32 rounds on a 32 round field course... you already f*#ked up.

We've got some fast PCC shooters here in DFW and I have yet to see one take HOA (or even get in the top 5) at our larger club matches where a dozen GM Open shooters show up. 

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4 minutes ago, NervousEnergy said:

We've got some fast PCC shooters here in DFW and I have yet to see one take HOA (or even get in the top 5) at our larger club matches where a dozen GM Open shooters show up. 

In my local indoor club we hardly ever get any M or GM shooters. That being said, we have a LOT of A shooters and one of our PCC guys is consistently finishing 1st HOA. (until last night when he had a brain fart and put two in a no shoot and still finished 2nd HOA)

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Locals mean nothing. Especially with no M's or GM's. 1 Baller SS shooter could come mop the floor.

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I don't think it would happen due to how far down the rabbit hole people have gone investing in couplers/extensions. The only reasonable way I see to even attempt to limit it would be by magazine length. And even that gets tricky with straight vs curved mags. No way they can reasonably do it with actual round count. 

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I just noticed that they changed the rule 14 wording about magazine couplers eliminating the side by side now does this mean the extension couplers as well?

14
Magazine holder restrictions
No magazine couplers
allowed, magazines must be
carried on the belt or in
apparel pockets. See rule
5.2.4. No restriction on
location on the belt. No thigh
rigs or tie down maga
zine
holders.

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Sure reads like couplers are outlawed now?? Just when I get my Taccom coupler running 100%.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

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I personally don't care what the magazine capacity is as long as it is close to what is "normal" to a sub gun.  30 or so rounds is fine for me.  I haven't extended any of my mags from off-the-shelf condition.  A mag change is not that hard to do, doesn't take that much time and adds a skill requirement to the match.

 

Of course I am not trying to be competitive at a national level.  ;-).

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So what is "PPC"? Yeah you know me? 

 

Sorry, couldn't resist. I don't really care what new rules they come up. Overcome and conquer. For me it's about having fun and it's way too easy to get caught up in things that derail that process and create the opposite result. 

Edited by Posvar

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WOW !! I can't believe we are having such a hissy fit over having to make 1 reload (maybe) on a stage at a pistol match. Sounds like somebody needs to change their diapers.

NOW, Do you really thing for one moment that if you have to make one or two reloads in a match. That people will not what to shoot PCC or give it up. You must be smoking some bad shit.

Shooting PCC is the best thing to come along in the shooting sport in a long time.

BUT, THAT'S JUST MY VEIW. I COULD BE WRONG ?

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The ability to give a brand new shooter 42 rounds to complete a 32 round stage simplifies the initial experience to the point that addiction happens without frustration. If you want reloads, shoot Single Stack, something I'd never wish on a first timer. Or just randomly reload your PCC. It really wont bother me at all. 

 

Folks shoot PCC to have fun their way. If the general membership responds similar to any of my local clubs, PCC shooters enjoy the division BECAUSE of the lack of limitations. Similar to Open, that means we prefer shooting our guns to reloading them. Do I practice reloads? Yes. Do I want to do a shitload of reloads instead of drag racing? Not really. That's part of the allure of PCC. 

 

10 minutes ago, LoneRanger said:

WOW !! I can't believe we are having such a hissy fit over having to make 1 reload (maybe) on a stage at a pistol match. Sounds like somebody needs to change their diapers.

NOW, Do you really thing for one moment that if you have to make one or two reloads in a match. That people will not what to shoot PCC or give it up. You must be smoking some bad shit.

Shooting PCC is the best thing to come along in the shooting sport in a long time.

BUT, THAT'S JUST MY VEIW. I COULD BE WRONG ?

If you'd like to shoot PCC at a match, I'd love to show you how much fun it is. Come on down to Texas where everything is bigger, including our mags :cheers:

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20 minutes ago, LoneRanger said:

WOW !! I can't believe we are having such a hissy fit over having to make 1 reload (maybe) on a stage at a pistol match.

 

I would be less upset about having to reload (I also shoot Production, after all) and more upset about investing in mag extensions that would become useless.  But I'm a tightwad, so YMMV.

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59 minutes ago, 3GLewie said:

Sure reads like couplers are outlawed now?? Just when I get my Taccom coupler running 100%.
 

 

Unless something changed recently, you are OK.   Couplers attached two magazines side by side.   Tim even renamed his couplers to magazine splices to avoid further confusion.

 

What you have is a magazine extension made out of another magazine plus a Taccom splice.

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Your correct, I asked him about it and he said it is good to go.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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