open cost

[Bird_Dog0347]

To each his own... your money, your gun. I'm of the opinion that if you buy a Ferrari then complain about a few cents difference in cost between premium and regular gas, you've only got yourself to blame when/if it goes wrong. There's also far more malfunctions in 9mm open than 38 open at the matches I attend weekly.

Another way to look at it is this... if you try to order a new SVI tomorrow, they won't make 9x19 major at all. That's a clue in my opinion.

[Sarge]

2 hours ago, Bird_Dog0347 said:

To each his own... your money, your gun. I'm of the opinion that if you buy a Ferrari then complain about a few cents difference in cost between premium and regular gas, you've only got yourself to blame when/if it goes wrong. There's also far more malfunctions in 9mm open than 38 open at the matches I attend weekly.

Another way to look at it is this... if you try to order a new SVI tomorrow, they won't make 9x19 major at all. That's a clue in my opinion.

SV is hung up on using double sided mounts and 9mm is much harder to tune ejection. They made them for a while then my guess is just had too many ejection issues. I have a gun that has only hiccuped a few times in almost 5 years.

[Gooldylocks]

Also, they do still build 9 major guns if you are a high enough class and tell them to.

[Sarge]

4 minutes ago, Gooldylocks said:

Also, they do still build 9 major guns if you are a high enough class and tell them to.

And I know they will build a 9mm top end for you if you have a 38 already.

[Steelix]

So I think ether way 9mm or 38sc, once you get over the price of the gun and magazines it's not anymore expensive than shooting limited. And that's what OP was asking, not what's better 9mm or 38sc. 

 

[Sarge]

8 hours ago, Steelix said:

So I think ether way 9mm or 38sc, once you get over the price of the gun and magazines it's not anymore expensive than shooting limited. And that's what OP was asking, not what's better 9mm or 38sc. 

 

Ok. Open ain’t cheap. Like the op said, if you have to ask you probably can’t afford it.

[Gooldylocks]

Ok. Open ain’t cheap. Like the op said, if you have to ask you probably can’t afford it.

See that's not what I got out of this thread. The cost is heavily front-loaded sure, but once you have the gun and mags then reloading it isn't bad. I am legitimately reloading my 9 major for cheaper than I was loading my limited ammo. And I'm using a premium jacketed bullet versus coated.

[chenault]

Cost is really dependent upon commitment.  If you go to mostly local matches, shoot 300 rounds a week and price hunt for reloading components then it's reasonable; howeve, if you travel a lot to bigger matches, shoot a 1000 a week and buy all your brass, the more expensive powders and bullets than it can get pricy fast.

Edited December 15, 2017 by chenault

[Gooldylocks]

35 minutes ago, chenault said:

Cost is really dependent upon commitment.  If you go to mostly local matches, shoot 300 rounds a week and price hunt for reloading components then it's reasonable; howeve, if you travel a lot to bigger matches, shoot a 1000 a week and buy all your brass, the more expensive powders and bullets than it can get pricy fast.

That is true of any division, that isn't open specific. This thread is about the cost of Open vs the other divisions.

[EEH]

I get my 9 brass for almost nothing,, use PD bullets j h p ,,Hs 6 powder.  Powder is where  I see cost difference,, bullets not much if any..

but you will find yourself taking more shots so rounds per match may be up..

 

[Broncman]

Equipment is more, ammo is about the same as my CO. Little more if I shoot jacketed. So far, a magazine of jacketed during practice cleans out any residue in comp from running Blue Bullets.

 

I was skeptical at first, but it does work, so ammo is same price basically, since it is 9 major

[tomjerry1]

I've been shooting Limited for a few years, making the switch to open this year. I have been listening to a lot of open shooters on the reason they shoot 9 major over 38S. Number 1 reason I hear is cost of brass? people are shooting a 4-5 thousand dollar guns, so they are picking up fired 9mm brass from the range to save a few pennies? I believe it is just what the pros are doing, and everyone is following along. Bet this gets a response! I look at it from what the gun was designed to do, not what we want it to do. When is the last time you went to the sporting goods store and bought 9mm that moves at 1450fps(115 gr)? I know this is not the reason I see as many broken 9 mm open guns?

I will be shooting a 38S Caspian, 125gr

Edited December 15, 2017 by tomjerry1
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[tyman1876]

I'll buy every piece of brass I shoot before I'm the guy on his hands and knees picking up brass while someone is trying to do a walk through. All my matches are lost brass. I'd much prefer to help paste, plan the stage, talk to people, etc. than grab brass all day.

One of the reasons I shoot 9 major.

[Gooldylocks]

I've been shooting Limited for a few years, making the switch to open this year. I have been listening to a lot of open shooters on the reason they shoot 9 major over 38S. Number 1 reason I hear is cost of brass? people are shooting a 4-5 thousand dollar guns, so they are picking up fired 9mm brass from the range to save a few pennies? I believe it is just what the pros are doing, and everyone is following along. Bet this gets a response! I look at it from what the gun was designed to do, not what we want it to do. When is the last time you went to the sporting goods store and bought 9mm that moves at 1450fps(115 gr)? I know this is not the reason I see as many broken 9 mm open guns?
I will be shooting a 38S Caspian, 125gr

A few pennies is not accurate, it adds up to hundreds of dollars a year in additional ammo cost. Also, saying "it's what the pros are doing" is equally inaccurate since most of the pros shoot supercomp guns.

When is the last time you walked into a sporting goods store and picked up a box of 38S going 1450 with a 125? Oh wait, also never. You are still going off book loading a 38 to major.

[Gooldylocks]

Doing a little quick math (rant incoming, brace for impact)....


I'm coming to around 2500 pieces of brass per year I would be leaving in a match, and that's just majors. So I would need to load each piece of brass 6 times and then load it a 7th time and leave it at a major if I wanted to get through a full year of shooting on 2500 pieces. That is $372.50 in additional brass cost every single year.

Compared to 0 dollars in brass cost, ever.

[tomjerry1]

Gooldylocks, you are right about loading hot, although the margin is much less from a 38S. I went to Starline, 130$ approx. for 9mm, 150$ approx. 38S, thousand cases each.

20 dollars difference, 2 cent a piece diff, times 2500 pieces is 50 dollars a year. The primers are the same cost, the bullets are the samecost, and the powder is also, so the diff is 2 cent per. The last open nations that USPSA reported on has 38S/SC at a slight lead on 9mm, there are pros out there shooting 9mm. 

I guess this is not helping the fella who started this post, Open is expensive for the initial outlay, but the cost of running it really isn't much more.

Have a great time shooting, be safe.

[Gooldylocks]

Gooldylocks, you are right about loading hot, although the margin is much less from a 38S. I went to Starline, 130$ approx. for 9mm, 150$ approx. 38S, thousand cases each.
20 dollars difference, 2 cent a piece diff, times 2500 pieces is 50 dollars a year. The primers are the same cost, the bullets are the samecost, and the powder is also, so the diff is 2 cent per. The last open nations that USPSA reported on has 38S/SC at a slight lead on 9mm, there are pros out there shooting 9mm. 
I guess this is not helping the fella who started this post, Open is expensive for the initial outlay, but the cost of running it really isn't much more.
Have a great time shooting, be safe.

But that's the thing, you never have to buy 9m brass. If you were buying and shooting new starline then yes it's only 2 cents per, but when the difference is 14.9 cents vs 0 cents when you pick it up at the range, that is significant.

And yes there are pros shooting 9mm, I wasn't trying to imply there were not. Just that MOST shoot 38SC.

[tomjerry1]

I also pickup at the club matches, don't go crazy trying to find everyone, my back doesn't appreciate it. See you in Missoula.

[Gooldylocks]

I also pickup at the club matches, don't go crazy trying to find everyone, my back doesn't appreciate it. See you in Missoula.

See you there!

[fatjoe123111]

I just got into the open also. With the gun, mags, and rig I'm in for about $5500. But after the cost of that stuff, reloading open doesn't cost much more than anything else. 

[Sarge]

20 hours ago, tomjerry1 said:

I've been shooting Limited for a few years, making the switch to open this year. I have been listening to a lot of open shooters on the reason they shoot 9 major over 38S. Number 1 reason I hear is cost of brass? people are shooting a 4-5 thousand dollar guns, so they are picking up fired 9mm brass from the range to save a few pennies? I believe it is just what the pros are doing, and everyone is following along. Bet this gets a response! I look at it from what the gun was designed to do, not what we want it to do. When is the last time you went to the sporting goods store and bought 9mm that moves at 1450fps(115 gr)? I know this is not the reason I see as many broken 9 mm open guns?

I will be shooting a 38S Caspian, 125gr

If you are seeing a bunch of 9mm open guns broken then they were not built right or are tinkered with too much.

[Sarge]

If you lose much 38sc brass that gets expensive. A 32 round stage costs $4.80 just in brass.

[R.Elliott]

Almost 9 bucks for us Canadians.  It's brutal. 

I switched both of open guns to 9 major and couldn't be happier. 

Also, cfe is less than half the cost per round from the 3n38 loads I was using in supercomp. 

[drewbeck]

1 hour ago, Sarge said:

If you are seeing a bunch of 9mm open guns broken then they were not built right or are tinkered with too much.

 

Agree, if a 9mm and 38 are built identically either is just as likely to break parts from the forces involved. I have never seen or heard of a 9mm 2011 based open barrel blowing up which is the “real” risk of choosing to go with 9mm over .38 

 

the slide for example has no idea whether a 9 or 38 just slammed it into the frame for the 10 thousandth time, and whenever it’s ready to give up the fight it’s gonna break without bias to the size of brass it just spit out.

 

I also see the SVI doesn’t build a 9mm argument get thrown on the table as the ultimate trump card by people that say there is something wrong with 9 major if sv won’t even build one.  In my opinion I’d guess the real reason they don’t make them is they don’t want to deal with 9mm mags, feeding, or customers having issues due to their own crappy reloads. .38 is an easier round to load than 9mm just like .40 is easier than 9mm to do consistently, this doesn’t mean 9mm is hard it just requires more attention/quality control to ensure reliable ammo when it matters.

 

the gun really isn’t part of the equation in the 9mm/38 debate, it’s really a decision on whether you want to run 9mm brass closer to its limits than you are doing with a larger case capacity. 

 

I buy Buy once fired, roll sized, cleaned, deprimed, sorted 9mm brass for $50/k because it’s more consistent than me sizing range pickup brass.  I have no issue shooting range pickup and shoot a lot of it many times.  Roll sized is more consistent on the rim and dings on range pickup can cause feeding issues more easily for me. I pickup all brass and can get $18 of the $50 per thousand back just taking it to the scrap yard. Makes it pretty cheap to have new quality processed brass

[zzt]

I have two 40 Open pistols that run like champs, and a Limited pistol I use for Steel Challenge with minor PF loads.  I'm currently building a 9mm 1911 for Steel Challenge, and have parts on the way for a 9mm 2011 build.  I agonized over the 38SC/9mm choice and decided 9mm because of the cost of brass.  I'm the MD at my home club's matches, plus I RO.  So every match I run or shoot is a lost brass match for me.

 

As I mentioned above, I buy all my brass.  I pay 3.6 cents each for beautifully cleaned and polished 40sw.   The same quality 9mm costs 3 cents each, or 2.6 cents each for a multi-thousand piece order.  I shoot between 6000 and 7000 rounds per year at USPSA matches.  6000 @ 3.6 cents = $216.  For me that is a small price to pay to avoid the brass chicken dance, assuming I had time to pick up the brass.  Fully processed, deprimed, swaged, resized and roll sized brass is 5 cents each.  If it turns out 9mm brass is funkier than 40sw, that's what I'll buy.

 

So really, for me, the only additional reloading cost for open is powder.  2.8~3.6gr inexpensive powder for minor, vs. 7~10gr expensive powder for major.  I'll reload for 9mm major, because store bought costs 38 cents each with a plated bullet.  For minor, I won't bother reloading.  At 16.4 cents delivered for a 115gr plated reman round, it isn't worth the time.  Geez, you can buy brand new 115 plated (minor) ammo for 19 cents each.