Tanfoglio Stock 2 - Random Light Strikes???

[johnbu]

On 06/27/2017 at 11:23 AM, SoCalShooter69 said:

 

Just to be clear - I take my mixed brass and case sort it. Then run my press at different primer seating setting for .008-.010" depth. I routinely get laughed at for case sorting my brass, and adjusting for each brand... But I'm 100% w a 10# and Wins. 

 

I ran a couple thousand with the #10 hammer spring using feds. 100%.

 

But my skills weren't a good fit for that trigger. Yeah, the 3# 10oz DA was sweeet, but the 15oz SA was just a  bit too light. But i have all the finesse of an arthritic blacksmith wearing mittens.

[SoCalShooter69]

30 minutes ago, johnbu said:

 

I ran a couple thousand with the #10 hammer spring using feds. 100%.

 

But my skills weren't a good fit for that trigger. Yeah, the 3# 10oz DA was sweeet, but the 15oz SA was just a  bit too light. But i have all the finesse of an arthritic blacksmith wearing mittens.

 

Pure, 100% trigger slap on my end. There's no way to ride the reset w the 10# spring. Lmao!

[MikieM]

On 7/1/2017 at 11:51 AM, SoCalShooter69 said:

 

Pure, 100% trigger slap on my end. There's no way to ride the reset w the 10# spring. Lmao!

 

But, as Martha says, "That's a good thing." 

[johnbu]

I don't know ... I rather like the confidence the 15.5# Patriot Defense spring gives.   Ran a steel "mini-match" of 4 stages yesterday using Sellier and Bellot primed ammo.  20DA and about 90SA shots ( I was double tapping targets like a nut!).  All went bang without fail.

 

At some point,  I guess I decided to work more on trigger control and less on weasling out the last oz of trigger force.  ( 5 1/2# da / 1# 14  sa)

[oddjob]

I also switched to the Patriot Defense (PD) 15.5 springs.  Although heavier I found it to be smoother (not sure if that makes sense).  The other item I found was that when dry firing I can feel the difference (especially double action), but under match conditions I can't really tell a difference.  I let another Tanfo Stock 2 shooter feel the trigger.  He couldn't believe I had a 15.5 PD spring in it.

Edited July 3, 2017 by oddjob

[zombywoof]

I just received my XL650 and I am easily able to seat Winchester primers +.010" on most brass. I was a little worried while I was ordering. I will see how they touch off during the next practice secession. I found no need to do the shim adjustment. Maybe a revision change?

[MikieM]

On 7/3/2017 at 9:10 AM, johnbu said:

I don't know ... I rather like the confidence the 15.5# Patriot Defense spring gives.   Ran a steel "mini-match" of 4 stages yesterday using Sellier and Bellot primed ammo.  20DA and about 90SA shots ( I was double tapping targets like a nut!).  All went bang without fail.

 

At some point,  I guess I decided to work more on trigger control and less on weasling out the last oz of trigger force.  ( 5 1/2# da / 1# 14  sa)

 

Mine is like yours, a SA pull of 1# 15 using a 14# Wolff hammer spring.

However, I'm beginning to think that if the 15.5# PD spring were installed I'd feel more like I was controlling the trigger rather than it controlling me. I would love to see the SA pull at the 2# 4 mark. 

[MemphisMechanic]

A trigger under 2.5 or so is lighter than I want to go, personally. For exactly the reasons you mentioned.

[johnbu]

4 hours ago, MikieM said:

 

Mine is like yours, a SA pull of 1# 15 using a 14# Wolff hammer spring.

However, I'm beginning to think that if the 15.5# PD spring were installed I'd feel more like I was controlling the trigger rather than it controlling me. I would love to see the SA pull at the 2# 4 mark. 

 

As the gun "smoothes out", the max weight become less and less important.  I'd say get one of the 15.5# springs and try it out.

[IHAVEGAS]

On 7/3/2017 at 9:10 AM, johnbu said:

I don't know ... I rather like the confidence the 15.5# Patriot Defense spring gives.   Ran a steel "mini-match" of 4 stages yesterday using Sellier and Bellot primed ammo.  20DA and about 90SA shots ( I was double tapping targets like a nut!).  All went bang without fail.

 

At some point,  I guess I decided to work more on trigger control and less on weasling out the last oz of trigger force.  ( 5 1/2# da / 1# 14  sa)

 

I think we (maybe just me) focus too much on pull weight and too little on grip/trigger/trigger finger geometry.

 

With some guns (springfield xd for example) the sight just wants to stay still for me during dry fire, other guns with lighter and cleaner breaking triggers I can not keep on target nearly as well. Seems like once I get the stock 2 worked out it is going to be a nice balance of trigger mechanics that work for me and a good trigger in itself.  

[Gviz]

On 6/26/2017 at 4:47 AM, MemphisMechanic said:

 

Nailed it. That's exactly right.

 

As @johnbu stated, open the jaws of your digital calipers up. See that tail that sticks out the far end of the ruler? That's for measuring the depth of a hole. Use it to see how deeply primers are seated.

 

Get used to operating your press so that Winchester primers are .005"+ below flush. I find it really helps consistency to have your bench screwed into the wall studs so there's absolutely zero shifting when you cycle the handle.

 

CCI primers are physically taller, so they won't be recessed as far into the case when fully seated. Just so you know.

i'll be trying this tonight. can you tell me what thickness the washer you used? thanks in advance

[MemphisMechanic]

12 hours ago, Gviz said:

i'll be trying this tonight. can you tell me what thickness the washer you used? thanks in advance

Loosen the two bolts on that bracket, and lift it upward as far as it’ll go. Root around in your garage until you find something the right size to keep it up that high.  

[Gviz]

14 hours ago, MemphisMechanic said:

Loosen the two bolts on that bracket, and lift it upward as far as it’ll go. Root around in your garage until you find something the right size to keep it up that high.  

Yes that is what I did but when I tested the height of the rod that pushes the primer against the moded washer bit. It seems the same or the adjustment is just minute? Measuring the CCI primer I'm getting .06-.05 and some won't even go in flush so I just put them aside?

[Gviz]

On 7/9/2017 at 5:34 PM, MemphisMechanic said:

A trigger under 2.5 or so is lighter than I want to go, personally. For exactly the reasons you mentioned.

Reading some of your stock 3 builds I just jumped in using PD 15.5 and was having success with CCI primers the only light strikes I was getting was when the primers are sticking out like a zit and there were 6 of them buggered up loads. Hahaha that is what I get from late night reloading. My fault not the pistol. Now I'm feeling grave and will install a PD 14lbs hammer spring and see what pulls I get and if I will still be able to pop CCI primers. 

 

Any sudgestions which firing pin I should use? Henning or xtreme FP. I'm still waiting for PD to have theirs in stock. Thanks in advance 

[MemphisMechanic]

I’d stick with the stock one.

 

I noticed no difference in ignition ability with the heavy PD versus the stock one. The gun had the same % of light strikes with the same weight of hammer spring.

[TravisNC]

Have all the 650 users checked the tension on the nut above the spring of the primer seating rod?  The nut had loosened up on mine and I wasn’t seating primers all the way but after checking tension and adding lock tite I’m seating Winchesters at .010-.012 below flush. 

[Quag]

Got to resurrect this thread. I have been out of the reloading/shooting game for a couple of years. Moved to NC. Got into the game again, built a new reloading bench, set up my Dillion 650 loaded a bunch of 223 everything went reasonably well. Got out my relatively unused Tanfoglio Limited Elite 9 mm and shot a couple of USPSA matches with it. I used my old "match reloads" everything went great. No light strikes in over 500 rounds. Love that gun. So I decide to reload some new ammo using the same formulas as before, went to range today light strikes 1/10 what a mess. Glad it was not a match. I then shot 50 rds of federal factory not one light strike so it was not the pistol. I am using Win Primers in my reloads. (I used to use federal but Win is all I've got now and guess what no small pistol primers anywhere!) So I go to this forum and find this thread what a relief.

 

1) I used my caliper and a large magnifying glass and discovered in my newly reloaded ammo I had a number of flush primers. Suspect #1 for the light stikes

2) checked my old reloads and the primers were visually slightly deep and using the calipers they were> 0.005 in depth some about .010. Again using this batch no light strikes in over 500 rds.

3) installed a thin washer under the primer punch seat and reloaded about 20 rounds. Using the calipers the primer depth pretty much approached .010.

4) BTW using the calipers is not error free you've got to have steady hands and there is a lot of error in that measurement.I prefer the large magnifying glass you can easily discern the deeper seating.

5) also took all the newer reloads in the batch that failed today and ran then thru the press again with the washer and generally got an additional .003 to .005 in depth.

 

I will report results tomorrow after I go to the range. BTW I forgot how great this forum is, thank you Brian, 

[Quag]

On 6/25/2017 at 1:18 PM, chaserracer said:

Thanks Memphis,

when you have a sec can you take a look and let me know if this is correct? Also (noob question) how do I measure the primer depth on a case?

 

-Chase

 

 

That shim has to be real thin to get the back screw in the 

On 6/25/2017 at 1:18 PM, chaserracer said:

Thanks Memphis,

when you have a sec can you take a look and let me know if this is correct? Also (noob question) how do I measure the primer depth on a case?

 

-Chase

that washer shim has to be real thin to get the back screw in the mount if you look very closely you can see the angle on the top of the mount. The washer looks large in the picture. I had to hunt in my shop for awhile before I found the right one.

Edited June 7, 2020 by Quag

[Quag]

I have have not been to as many pistol matches as I hope this summer but having made Mr. Memphis's shim adjustment I have almost eliminated the light strikes. But I still get some. When this thread started there was no primer shortages. I have been up here in New England stocking up on small pistol primers and have bought anything available (CCI, WIn, Federal) when I go back to NC to reload I will sort by primer. I was using wins.