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AzNooB

When to upgrade to a new gun?

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Not saying he has to earn the right to buy a new gun, just he would be buying 2 to keep carry and comp similar. So his money would be better spent on ammo or training if he was looking to improve his scores. Also he has a 34, 17, and a 19 I was mistaken. He never mentioned what division but being all 9mm glocks I would assume production if he were going for limited and looking to improve I would definitely agree to switching platforms.

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Not saying he has to earn the right to buy a new gun, just he would be buying 2 to keep carry and comp similar. So his money would be better spent on ammo or training if he was looking to improve his scores. Also he has a 34, 17, and a 19 I was mistaken. He never mentioned what division but being all 9mm glocks I would assume production if he were going for limited and looking to improve I would definitely agree to switching platforms.

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On 3/21/2017 at 11:48 AM, AzNooB said:

Would I be doing myself a disservice by spending money on new firearms instead of spending that same amount of money on match experience and training? 

 

Back to the OP: spending money on guns/gear is not the same as spending money on matches/training; the former is an asset, the latter an expense.  If you buy a gun for $1,000 you haven't spent $1,000, you've converted $1,000 from cash to gun, the only expense is tax, registration, and any depreciation with use.  If you make a good deal you can covert it back into cash again with nothing lost (some guns actually appreciate over time).

 

Training/match fees/ammo, while they may increase your skill level are expenses and belong on the income statement rather than the balance sheet.

 

The difference is critical to a healthy understanding of personal finance.

 

 

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Let me preface this all to say I am an equipment whore. I love guns and I love shooting multiple platforms.

 

I started with the XDm from SA in .40 just because of limited major scoring. I subsequesntly sent it to Matt and Powder River Precision for a new barrel, high grip relief, SS pins, a multitude of other upgrades as well as Taran Tacital base pads. Its a great gun. Amything I could do to it I did. I shot it for 4 seasons.

I then moved to STI and 2011's because I pefer rhe weight and trigger.

Given what I know now, I should have had a 1911 variant from the start. I just prefer it. I still have the XDM but I now exclusively shoot my Executive. Would have been nice to save the $1,700 I have in the gun for ammo or reloading.

The guy didn't make me better practice did. However, i do love new guns.

 

On a side note, Vogel shot his 34 limited in Open and finished 3rd in the Worlds.

 

 

 

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I look at it this way...get what you're gonna get and be done with it.  Otherwise it is going to bug the heck out of you until you do.  Just get it for whatever reason you want.  There really should be no true "reason" you should have to justify getting it (unless it is to your significant other due to money.  LOL).  But seriously, you shouldn't have to "prove" to anyone (even yourself, really) that once you make C, then you "need" or are "allowed" to have a 2011 or whatever.  If you want a 2011, can afford it, then go for it and be happy.  This whole thing is a fun game/competition.  You might as well enjoy it.  So, if a different gun will make you happier while enjoying this game/competition, then go for it and be happy.  Why wouldn't you?

 

I admit that I'm just starting out with this and I was going to shoot my regular 9mm XD Mod .2 that I have in the safe.  However, I admit that I didn't want to lose points shooting minor in Limited that people suggested I started out in (instead of Production).  Ok, cool.  Plus, admittedly, I like 40's anyway, always have.  So, I looked online and bam, found a heck of a deal on an XDm 5.25" Competition in .40 that I felt I couldn't pass up, so I bought it.  Did I do it because of others telling me to?  Nope.  Did I do it because I thought I would shoot better with it?  Nope.  I did it because I thought I would be happier with the gun because it is in .40 and has a longer barrel.  So, I could shoot in Limited and be scored in major.  That's it.  I did it "just because".

 

Maybe once I get rolling in all this and enjoy it, I will look into 2011's and such.  Right now I don't know a thing about them to be honest.  Yes, I have "normal" 1911's at home, but never thought about them for competition.  But maybe once I get rolling, I may get excited in some of these expensive 2011's and just "have to have one" because I like it.  Not because it will make me shoot better or that I will receive "approval" from others to get one.

 

I agree with with some others have said...continuous perfect practice makes you better, not the gun.  So the question is...if I start whipping everyone's butt with my stock SA XDm 5.25" in 40 and everyone else has their fancy tricked out 2011's, are you going to still want the 2011 or is mine the better gun because I'm whipping everyone's butt?  Getting my point? :):P 

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Just made the leap from Glock 34 to CZ Shadow as my primary competition pistol.  I had the money available, a wife who wanted to begin using my Glock in competition (an actual need for a new weapon), and the desire to try something news.  This was the perfect combination for when to upgrade to a new gun...though many will likely suggest that I did not upgrade.  

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This is a great discussion.

 

I've been a long time shooting enthusiast, but only got into competition in the last year.

 

I understand the lust for new guns, believe me I do. But i think the OP said it really well - "I'd rather be a great shooter with an OK gun than an OK shooter with a great gun".  Put that on the fridge and look at it 5x a day... :-)

 

I decided in the spring to focus on shooting, and dry fire my G34 (stock except for sights and grip tape) 5x a week (mostly). I can only get in 1 trip to the range a month, but I've been following Anderson's R&R and am seeing improvement. Now to prove them at the local matches.

 

Around March, I got a call from CZ Custom that my S2 had come in (I forgot I put a down payment on one in the fall), and against my better judgement, I paid for it and it showed up at my LGS. It's beautiful, flawless, and put together like a bank vault. And I've never shot it yet, and don't plan to until I feel there's a benefit to switching. Stupid I know, but I don't want to be tempted to switch platforms when I'm just starting to actually develop some shooting skills.

 

Someone said shooting isn't about the gun, and I try to remember that when my alarm goes off at 5:30 and I go down to the basement to strap on my rig and holster my well worn G34.

 

But is it wrong if I fondle the Shadow 2 almost daily?

Edited by RMJack
typo

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Remember, the real thing is seldom as good as the dreams !!

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I've always been one to shoot the gun you want to learn with, not get any gun and learn to shoot.  You'll get habits (good and bad) depending on the gun so save up and get the CZ.  Keep looking on the forum and you'll eventually find one you can afford.  You can also get a non Shadow and customize it yourself and have a great gun.  Recommend Cajun Gunwerks parts to get you close to a CZC Shadow.

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It's been over 5 months since my initial post and I finally decided to sell off my G34 and buy a CZC Shadow because the curiosity was killing me. I have no illusions that the gun itself will improve my scores, but I think it'll help me overcome some mental blocks I had with my Glock.

 

I'll continue shooting my G17 through the OK sectionals in October, and then I'll start training on the CZ. 

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I found a 40 slide for my stock 3 .now I'm going to shoot major. Cost more to reload. Need to get different magazine tubes, unless I can modify 45 tubes.also need a conversion for the 650.

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I'm not sure if this makes sense, but I'll put it out there. Sometimes you have to try a few things to see what you shoot best. I've tried a few different platforms and shoot best with a 2011 style pistol, so I'm sticking with that. I thought I really wanted a CZ and tried one for a few matches and hated it real quick.

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On 10/1/2017 at 6:47 PM, Balliet said:

Cz money would sure go along way in instructor fees.  

 

It would pay for about one class from a reputable instructor (plus ammo) as I purchased used. I think I need more matches under my belt before I can benefit from another class. I'm still trying to grasp everything I was exposed to in my class with JJ Racaza earlier this year.

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I know this is an older thread, but a good read right now when I have a case of the "wants." I keep trying to justify to myself that I need to upgrade my M&P to one of these fancy new production guns so that I have have a 5" barrel and adjustable rear sights. I'll stay strong and shoot what I've got for a while longer. Maybe the street price on the new Q5 SF will come down to reasonable levels some day :D

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A friend just changed from a CZ75 B to a Glock 17 gen5. After 2 weeks of training he already was a bit better with that Glock than he was with his CZ.

The CZ wasn´t a Shadow, sure,  and the trigger wasn´t good at all. Even in SA. But it´s not only the better groups he is shooting now. His draws, reloads, transitions and recoil management became a bit better/faster. The gun is lighter, has a bigger magwell and a lower bore axis.

Theres a lot that makes a Glock good for IPSC/USPSA. Even the (sooooo bad) trigger can be an advantage, because there´s no real wall. I think everybody knows that surprise breaks can be pretty good.

If you learn to roll the trigger, and make it a bit lighter, a Glock is pretty good for USPSA/IPSC, i think.

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On 3/21/2017 at 12:59 PM, MemphisMechanic said:

If the practice were equally intense? No.

 

I'd probably be there already. 

 

Guns don't make you better. Matches are won with a G34 over a Shadow all the time. A Glock 34 has won Production nationals around half a dozen times. No one has ever won Nationals with a CZ.

 

Remind your buddies of that, when they tell you that your gun is holding you back.

 

Didn’t JJ Racaza win  nationals with a CZ? Might have been a tanfog.

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I’m of the mind get the best you can afford for each division you want to shoot. Don’t shoot just one division. Especially in local club matches where you can shoot multiple divisions in a day. Do so. You may find you have a better time/better skill set with something you started off trying with no love for.

 

personally I shot a lot of firearms as a collector and retired Mil. So when I opted to do competition ( recently mind ya) I figured pick up everything, find out what makes it the most fun, and run with it, litterally...

since doing so I’ve shot 

single stack major ( Springfield TRP 1911) didn’t like the mag planning. Gun was fun but stages are much tougher counting out shots and plotting mag changes.

production (sig p226 legion) former carry sidearm but DA/sa I don’t like. Also a glock 34 don’t like the grip on glock and all the addons to make it decent but never great.

limited minor STI 2011 DVC 3Gun , easily the most fun, plenty ammo, room to mess about modding even though not nessessary . Best trigger

and PCC with a Nordic and sig mpx. Fun, but meh, too much like running shot houses in mil. Kinda old now.

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7 hours ago, jmtyndall said:

I know this is an older thread, but a good read right now when I have a case of the "wants." I keep trying to justify to myself that I need to upgrade my M&P to one of these fancy new production guns so that I have have a 5" barrel and adjustable rear sights. I'll stay strong and shoot what I've got for a while longer. Maybe the street price on the new Q5 SF will come down to reasonable levels some day :D

I’m holding out on q5 sf becoming more availabile as well. Imo the weight and striker fire should be a whole new level in production 

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Posted (edited)
8 hours ago, Sawdustnsteel said:

Didn’t JJ Racaza win  nationals with a CZ? Might have been a tanfog.

 

Tanfo. He refently switched to limcat for Lim & Open... but before Nationals he was shooting Tanfos in all divisions.

 

I don’t know if he was running a 2011 in Open or Limited at Nationals, but it certainly wasn’t a CZ. Stoeger won production, with a Tanfo.

 

 

 

Edited by MemphisMechanic

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Im still a newer shooter, but I dont really have many fundamentals outside of shooting a straight lane. I figured now is as good as any time to buy a CGW Shadow 2, ill just learn on that platform and try not to lust too much over a Czechmate. 

 

I did debate over a G34 though. The appeal of being able to shoot Production or CO on one stock platform was VERY appealing, but Glocks just dont get me excited to shoot.

 

Im not in it to win it, this is primarily about fun and getting into a new hobby. Im sure ill get more serious as time goes on though.

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Just my .02$. I'd get a Vanek drop-in trigger kit - easy for a newbie, and great to deal with if any questions/issues. And then compete in 9mm limited at first so you don't have to worry about mag changes until you're ready to add that to the list of skills to learn.  

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Wow, my viewpoint on guns has totally changed nearly 2 years after the original post. I have my A card now and I believe that if you know how to shoot, you know how to shoot.

 

If you have a gun you thoroughly enjoy shooting, you are more likely to practice with it. I shot my Accu Shadow until I found some ergonomic annoyances with my hand size/shape. I've switched to a Stock III Xtreme which fits me better and I really love shooting it. If I get annoyed with it and find something I enjoy more, I'll just switch and keep practicing.

 

My new advice would be to just buy the most baller gun you can afford for your division and enjoy shooting it.

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20 hours ago, lfine said:

Just my .02$. I'd get a Vanek drop-in trigger kit - easy for a newbie, and great to deal with if any questions/issues. And then compete in 9mm limited at first so you don't have to worry about mag changes until you're ready to add that to the list of skills to learn.  

 

Not sure if that was directed at me, but I dont own a Glock right now. I have a P10C that is extremely uncomfortable to shoot. Accurate as hell though.

 

20 hours ago, AzNooB said:

Wow, my viewpoint on guns has totally changed nearly 2 years after the original post. I have my A card now and I believe that if you know how to shoot, you know how to shoot.

 

If you have a gun you thoroughly enjoy shooting, you are more likely to practice with it. I shot my Accu Shadow until I found some ergonomic annoyances with my hand size/shape. I've switched to a Stock III Xtreme which fits me better and I really love shooting it. If I get annoyed with it and find something I enjoy more, I'll just switch and keep practicing.

 

My new advice would be to just buy the most baller gun you can afford for your division and enjoy shooting it.

 

Thats where I was going with it. I get switch happy and usually regret not just going with what I wanted in the first place. Started with cameras, now with guns. 

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