Throat Ream 9mm PCC?

[1911luvr]

I'm wondering if maybe something else is going on as others have indicated.  I intentionally long throated my KVA barrel for a couple of reasons that may or may not be scientific or germane to this conversation.  But, the point is in that barrel bullets have to make a substantial jump (like .230"-ish) before they engage the rifling lead-in.  My accuracy is very good.  With a good bullet I can shoot a paster out at 20 yards off bags.  In fact, the accuracy improved after I throated the barrel (might have been a new barrel vs. broken in barrel effect). 

I'd suggest taking a look for rough lead ins and/or asymmetry of your throating job.  Also, might want to run a hundred or so jacketed bullets to burnish the fresh cut lead in.

The barrel may yet be salvageable. 

You may be right about the burnishing. I had a club tactical pistol shoot today and shot 3 classes, including PCC. I let a buddy shoot mine today too, so it got a good 250+ rounds by day's end. All the targets were close (15 yards or less) until the final stage where they added some 12" plates at 60 yards just for PCC, so the lack of initial accuracy didn't hurt me. I initially ran the 160gr loads with 4.5gr of HS-6, but switched to 115gr over 4gr of Bullseye after watching the lighter muzzle rise my buddy had with his loads. Anyway, I shot last on the final stage so there was close to 300 rounds through it by then, and I noticed the accuracy seemed to be improved. There were 3 targets at about 60 yards and you had to single, double, then triple tap them in order. I was able to easily squeeze the double and triple taps off as fast as I could pull the trigger, and all were on target. Long story short (oops, too late), it shot well enough to win, so perhaps it's good enough for now.

After the match I was going to put it on paper again, but my better half is 36 weeks prego and called saying she was having contractions and in a lot of pain, so I jammed home to go to the hospital. Turns out baby wasn't coming yet so I'm going back to the the tomorrow to put it on paper and see if it was just rough spots that may have smoothed out.

Thanks for the help everyone!


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[Flatland Shooter]

On 1/1/2017 at 8:23 PM, 1911luvr said:

After the match I was going to put it on paper again, but my better half is 36 weeks prego and called saying she was having contractions and in a lot of pain, so I jammed home to go to the hospital. Turns out baby wasn't coming yet so I'm going back to the the tomorrow to put it on paper and see if it was just rough spots that may have smoothed out.
 

 

Any updates?   Baby here yet?  

[1911luvr]

Any updates?   Baby here yet?  

Baby is coming Thursday! Well, they're inducing her Thursday, so I guess it could be Thursday or Friday. I was hoping to shoot one last match today before the baby came, but with all the rain here is CA the match was cancelled. The normally dry creek bed that you cross to get to the range is a river now and already had one truck stuck yesterday, so I guess in the interest of safety it was ruled a no-go for today.

Hopefully I can still get out for a match here and there after he arrives, but I'm reasonably certain I won't be shooting every weekend anymore. At least not for 6 months- Santa brought him baby hearing protection that is rated to fit 6 month olds to 6 year olds, so the wait begins shortly! Lol

I can't wait until he's old enough to shoot with his brothers and sisters. I got them into light competition a couple years ago, but they don't yet have the same passion for it as for video games...

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[Flatland Shooter]

13 hours ago, 1911luvr said:

Hopefully I can still get out for a match here and there after he arrives, but I'm reasonably certain I won't be shooting every weekend anymore. At least not for 6 months-

Gotta love an optimist.  

As a father of two daughters, now both grown, shooting took a backseat from birth to at least until they are out of college.

Early congratulations.

[1911luvr]

Gotta love an optimist.  

As a father of two daughters, now both grown, shooting took a backseat from birth to at least until they are out of college.

Early congratulations.

Thanks, I can barely wait until he's old enough to learn how to shoot!

He just arrived last night!



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[Flatland Shooter]

Congratulation again.

Need to break him of only one eye open.  He will never make it past C class with one eye closed.

 

[CrashDodson]

I just got off the phone with Bevin Gram because I have some pistol barrels I want reamed.  He can not ream the nitride coated barrels.  He said he has A LOT of PCC guys sending him barrels.  One of my pistol barrels is TIN coated and he said he cant do that one.  Manson said his reamers will not cut TIN barrels either.  

If its not coated I would send it to Bevin with a few rounds that you want to shoot.  Its only 30 bucks for the service.  

[JMike]

Gratz on the new baby. I hope everyone is doing well!

[JRM83]

5 hours ago, CrashDodson said:

I just got off the phone with Bevin Gram because I have some pistol barrels I want reamed.  He can not ream the nitride coated barrels.  He said he has A LOT of PCC guys sending him barrels.  One of my pistol barrels is TIN coated and he said he cant do that one.  Manson said his reamers will not cut TIN barrels either.  

If its not coated I would send it to Bevin with a few rounds that you want to shoot.  Its only 30 bucks for the service.  

My barrel was definitely nitrided...

[brytec]

My Faxon barrel has a very short throat. It doesn't like any coated bullets unless they are extremely short but it will run my 147gr Xtreme plated bullets with no issue. I normally run Xtreme anyway so it's not an issue for me. 

What powder and how much are you using with your xtreme 147s? TIA


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[Flatland Shooter]

I'm also using Xtreme 147 gr RN bullets @ 1.085" oal.  For powder I'm using 3.0 gr N320.  Its a little more accurate than my earlier load of 2.8 gr.  Both run just fine.

My barrel is PSA (nitrided).  I planned to order a throat reamer after Chrismas so I would not need to load so short, but between how tough it was to cut by hand and the problems one person had with after-reaming accuracy, I discarded  that plan.

Instead I'll wait and see if any of the barrel makers solve the problem for us like JP has done with their barrels.

The foremost authority on 9mm barrels at this point is Aircooled6racer.  Before buying any new barrels, I will contact him and see if he has any words of wisdom.

 

 

[CrashDodson]

A lot of the coated barrels can not be reamed as the coating is harder than the tool.  But give Gram's a call he does a lot of them. 

[1911luvr]

Congratulation again.

Need to break him of only one eye open.  He will never make it past C class with one eye closed.

 

Thanks! I'm giving him a pass for now since he was only 30 minutes old when the photo was taken, but by the time he's able to pull a trigger I'll be all over it! Lol

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[1911luvr]

I'm also using Xtreme 147 gr RN bullets @ 1.085" oal.  For powder I'm using 3.0 gr N320.  Its a little more accurate than my earlier load of 2.8 gr.  Both run just fine.

My barrel is PSA (nitrided).  I planned to order a throat reamer after Chrismas so I would not need to load so short, but between how tough it was to cut by hand and the problems one person had with after-reaming accuracy, I discarded  that plan.

Instead I'll wait and see if any of the barrel makers solve the problem for us like JP has done with their barrels.

The foremost authority on 9mm barrels at this point is Aircooled6racer.  Before buying any new barrels, I will contact him and see if he has any words of wisdom.

My barrel is melonited (nitrided) and I was able to do it, but it practically destroyed the reamer. I'm going to send it back for sharpening, and I expect it will be good to go again afterwards.

So here's a few things I learned after doing mine:
1. Use more cutting fluid with the reamer. Mine was practically dry, so bad move on my part.
2. Go slow. It's not a race and going fast will destroy the reamer fast.
3. If the reamer comes out with a jagged edge, you can bet your leade has a bit of ragged edge. It's not the end of the world but it does need a little polishing to smooth it back out. I didn't know this and the first time I shot it- well you can see my post-team report above to know the first time shooting it did not go well. Since then it has seen close to 1500 rounds and it is back to being almost a tack driver, with .5" groups at 17 yards. I blame the shooter's technique and red dot flare from the shooter's astigmatism for not grouping better.
4. JP bore paste and an oversized bore swab used only where the reamer touched will make the world a better place. Well maybe not, but you'll feel that way after your accuracy is restored.




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[GJGary]

Has anyone successfully reamed there psa nitride coated barrel?

Mine barrel loads bbi 125 to an oal 1.090 would like to go longer and different profile projectiles 

[1911luvr]

Has anyone successfully reamed there psa nitride coated barrel?

Mine barrel loads bbi 125 to an oal 1.090 would like to go longer and different profile projectiles 

You'll have the same issue I did, but if you follow my instructions above you will be fine. Mine will pass the plunk test with 160gr coated round nose projectiles loaded to 1.16.


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[Ryan N]

I have the Faxon barrel and often have a tough time removing the chambered round at ULASC.  It has been mentioned that the Manson reamer can be bought for $40.  I can't seem to find the F9MMLUGB for less than $70.  

 

Are you guys removing the barrel from the upper to do the reaming?  It seems possible to do it with the barrel attached to the upper but might require an extension.  

[lhoward762]

I have the Faxon barrel and often have a tough time removing the chambered round at ULASC.  It has been mentioned that the Manson reamer can be bought for $40.  I can't seem to find the F9MMLUGB for less than $70.  
 
Are you guys removing the barrel from the upper to do the reaming?  It seems possible to do it with the barrel attached to the upper but might require an extension.  

The Manson reamer direct from Manson (you have to call them) is $40 with the solid pilot. The T-Handle extension is $16, if you don't want to pull your barrel.

I ended up having to pull my Faxon/KVP barrel and use a drill motor to cut through the nitride finish.

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[Ryan N]

1 hour ago, lhoward762 said:

 

The Manson reamer direct from Manson (you have to call them) is $40 with the solid pilot. The T-Handle extension is $16, if you don't want to pull your barrel.

I ended up having to pull my Faxon/KVP barrel and use a drill motor to cut through the nitride finish.

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Thanks for the quick response and info.  I will call them tomorrow to order the reamer and maybe the T-Handle.  What size square is on the reamer?  I have a lathe at work I can use if needed.  

[vinconco]

I did a chamber cast on my NFA 16" 9mm barrel and the results are what I expected.

I experienced hard to eject factory rounds, blow back from rounds not seated fully firing slightly out of battery.  This is a safety issue.
 
The chamber throat (area directly in front of the end of the case) measures .354" which is smaller than any 9mm bullet.
SAAMI Spec is .358  +.004  (this is why the round won't pass the "plunk" test and sticks when ejecting a loaded round
 
The rifling actually touches the case mouth on one side of the chamber and is approx. .068"  on the other side.  
That means the chamber was reamed off center.

 

Why do WE have to be the ones to bring these barrels into SPEC?   The manufacturer should be held to account on this.

[lhoward762]

The end is not square, I can't remember if it's 1/4" or 3/8" dia, a friend is borrowing the reamer. But it has a flat for the a set screw.

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[Flatland Shooter]

9 hours ago, vinconco said:

Why do WE have to be the ones to bring these barrels into SPEC?   The manufacturer should be held to account on this.

 

Have you contacted New Frontier?     What did they say?

[Ryan N]

My PCC with Faxon barrel has just over 500 rounds through it and has been trouble free except when unchambering a round.  I assumed it was my reloads and was going to order a Manson reamer tomorrow.  Tonight I thought I would do the plunk test and sure enough when I drop the bullet into the chamber it stop consistently with the case protruding ~.100".  I tried 124 gr Gold Dots, 124gr Nato and 115 gr WWB.  All gave the same result consistently.  I plan to call Faxon tomorrow.  

[vinconco]

2 hours ago, Flatland Shooter said:

 

Have you contacted New Frontier?     What did they say?

I contacted NFA before I made the chamber cast and described the problem of hard extraction of loaded rounds (factory 115's).   The want me to send the barrel back for "inspection".   I asked them if they had heard of this problem before and they said I was the first to mention it.    I have a feeling they weren't being truthful. 

 

I am going to buy a JP barrel and then fight NFA for a refund because I don't want to get into a revolving door of bad barrels with them for months.  

 

 

[Ryan N]

I didn't think about the case sitting proud of the chamber and the fact that the bolt face is recessed. I'll have to look at this again.