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Iron sights


RickyH

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I like the dot torture stuff.  Extend the range as it becomes easier and add an element of time to increase difficulty.  Frank Garcia's dot drill.  Lastly, I've been having a lot of fun with distance change up drill that I got from Ben Stoeger.  All of these are easy to find if you just google the names.  

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The drill I've been using is setting up a white target with six 2" or 3" neon green dots on it at 7 or so yards. Set a par time of 5 seconds on my timer and draw and fire 5 shots on target within the 5 seconds. I've been doing it at every training session for the past 10 or so months and have only ever made every shot in all 6 dots once. You can of course increase or decrease the dot size, change the distance, or change the par time to fit your skill level and based on how much you want to challenge yourself. I think this is a good way to practice both accuracy and speed. I didn't come up with this drill but heard about it from another member here on enos.

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  • 2 weeks later...

Another drill I do can be done at 5m.

No time limit. Draw fire two rounds freestyle, two rounds strong hand only, two rounds weak hand only, and finally 2 rounds freestyle. Goal is to have all shots touching at 5m. It's a variation on another drill from Rob Leatham where you shoot 5 rounds freestyle into the target with all touching. Best done as your last rounds of the practice so there's no do-over.

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22 minutes ago, Pat Harrison said:

That's fine if your intent is to shoot bullseye. If you plan to shoot USPSA/IPSC or Steel Challenge then you need to learn to be accurate at speed.

Using a reaction drill combined with an aiming point is enlightening

Yes, but if you can't hit the target, it doesn't matter how fast you are. 

 

After you learn how to do something, then you can add a time element. 

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8 minutes ago, Pat Harrison said:

You missed the point, you have to learn to shoot accurately, fast

Agree, but...does "crawl, walk, run" not apply?  Not knowing RickyH's current skill level and goal's, i'll take his request at face value...

Dry Fire:

Aim at a white wall, focusing only on sight alignment and not disturbing sights during trigger press.  

Penny on the front sight when dry firing (smooth trigger press & no flinching).  

Live Fire:

Group shooting.  

Dot Torture.  

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8 minutes ago, Pat Harrison said:

You missed the point, you have to learn to shoot accurately, fast

I get it. But it the OP asked for accuracy drills. I have no idea their level, so I wasn't going to put the cart in front of the horse. My suggestion was to learn accuracy first with no time component. Otherwise a person who can't hit the target is going to grow more and more frustrated by trying to do something they can't, faster.  It is impossible to improve speed AND accuracy at the same time.  Sure you can apply the accuracy you already have, at speed, but you will never get both simultaneously.  If you want to try that, let me sell you ammo.  It will be a long and frustrating road  

 

By all means, if you can hit the target on demand, add a time component. A good one is The Dots as advertised by Ben Stoeger. Going 6 for 6 on 2" dots is at least a Master level drill. Even at 5 yards. 

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8 minutes ago, uewpew said:

Agree, but...does "crawl, walk, run" not apply?  Not knowing RickyH's current skill level and goal's, i'll take his request at face value...

Dry Fire:

Aim at a white wall, focusing only on sight alignment and not disturbing sights during trigger press.  

Penny on the front sight when dry firing (smooth trigger press & no flinching).  

Live Fire:

Group shooting.  

Dot Torture.  

Ricky is not a newb....

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3 minutes ago, GrumpyOne said:

Ricky is not a newb....

I'm obviously new to the forums... and don't know Ricky...so pardon the ignorance.  I'm still semi-newb, so Dots, Groups, dry fire, & 15yd Bill Drills are still advancing my skills.  Maybe i'm not qualified for giving Ricky accuracy drill advice.

What would kind accuracy drills would you suggest for not a noob, Ricky?  

 

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25 minutes ago, Mhall said:

I get it. But it the OP asked for accuracy drills. I have no idea their level, so I wasn't going to put the cart in front of the horse. My suggestion was to learn accuracy first with no time component. Otherwise a person who can't hit the target is going to grow more and more frustrated by trying to do something they can't, faster.  It is impossible to improve speed AND accuracy at the same time.  Sure you can apply the accuracy you already have, at speed, but you will never get both simultaneously.  If you want to try that, let me sell you ammo.  It will be a long and frustrating road  

 

By all means, if you can hit the target on demand, add a time component. A good one is The Dots as advertised by Ben Stoeger. Going 6 for 6 on 2" dots is at least a Master level drill. Even at 5 yards. 

What you said was "You can't get faster AND more accurate at the same time. " which is just not true. Sooner or later you are going to have to learn how to shoot accurately fast. Otherwise, and what is fairly common, is we separate being accurate and being fast in the belief that you can't do both. 

A simple drill I use to teach people to be more accurate and faster is a reaction time drill with an aiming point. Line up the sights on the aiming point and using a delayed, random beep, pull the trigger as fast as you can on the start signal. And I can tell you exactly what's going to happen, if the shots break below .20 of a second you will end up with a very good group, if they break above .25 the shots will be bad. I can do this with experienced shooters and I can do it with new shooters and the result invariably is the same. Break the shot over .25 and it means that you took time to think about the shot and either flinched in anticipation or tried to make a last minute, unnecessary adjustment and threw the shot.

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11 minutes ago, Pat Harrison said:

What you said was "You can't get faster AND more accurate at the same time. " which is just not true. Sooner or later you are going to have to learn how to shoot accurately fast. Otherwise, and what is fairly common, is we separate being accurate and being fast in the belief that you can't do both. 

A simple drill I use to teach people to be more accurate and faster is a reaction time drill with an aiming point. Line up the sights on the aiming point and using a delayed, random beep, pull the trigger as fast as you can on the start signal. And I can tell you exactly what's going to happen, if the shots break below .20 of a second you will end up with a very good group, if they break above .25 the shots will be bad. I can do this with experienced shooters and I can do it with new shooters and the result invariably is the same. Break the shot over .25 and it means that you took time to think about the shot and either flinched in anticipation or tried to make a last minute, unnecessary adjustment and threw the shot.

Well, I guess we can disagree on that... Ernest Langdon, Steve Anderson are a few who preach this.

Yes, sooner or later you ARE going to have to learn, but wouldn't you need to learn how to hit what you are aiming at first?  I bet you would't give a completely new shooter a full magazine and ask them to empty it as fast as they can and then judge accuracy...would you?  Then, you wouldn't reload it and have them do it again, and tell them to go faster and judge accuracy again??? NO, sounds absurd doesn't it?  So if we take it to extremes, it becomes clear.  

 

Of course, a shooter who can already hit the target can work on doing it faster.  That's what we all do in practice every day.  But there is a point a person needs to get before adding a time component.

 

The drill you described is a speed and trigger control drill.  Trigger control and accuracy are not the same thing, although one will lead to or could prevent the other.

 

 

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The problem is new shooters can hit the target just fine, it's usually things like flinch and bad instruction that makes it harder. If you take people who have never fired a gun, explain the process of lining up the sights and pulling the trigger, more often then not their very first shot is near the Center of the target....it's usually the next one, after they know what to expect, that goes awry. I've seen new shooters literally walk a series of shots down the target as their flinch increases on each shot. Most people's trigger pull is far better then they are led to believe, but usually the first thing blamed, so they spend a lot of time working on the wrong thing.

I think when we are talking speed you and I are referring to two different things. I am talking about the ability to pull the trigger quickly and land the shot where you want it. 

 

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