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TommyK

For those interested in Alliant E3

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I've been doing some experimenting with Alliant E3 and believe it has some real potential for the 40.

4.4 Grains of E3, CCI 550 Magnum Primer and a 180 Gr Montana Gold gives a pleasant load at 170 PF from my DVC Limited.

My CED chronograph recorded 10 shots with a high of 964 FPS and low of 932 for an average of 947.

E3 seems to burn clean, not a lot of smoke. As I get more information I will add to the thread for those that are interested.

TommyK

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I run e3 for Limited Major at 3.6gr under a 180gr poly coated bullet. I run 2.8 for 40 Minor. e3 is fast, clean, meters beautifully and is consistent from lot to lot. It also has no temp sensitivity that I can see.

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There are several people who have been using it in 9, .40 and .45 for several years. Almost all I use these days.

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Hey TommyK and ZZT, Your two loads seem pretty far off to both be using 180 gr and making major. Mind enlightening us on what guns you are using and what oal you are loading to. I know the difference between the coated lead and Montana Gold's pretty hard jackets is responsible for some of the difference, but 0.8 gr is a lot of powder...

I love my WST load for major with a 180 gr coated bullet, but the temperature sensitivity is starting to drive me nuts...

Edited by EngineerEli

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Eli, I load to 1.126" OAL for my CZ 75 TS. I'm sure Tommy loads longer, and that would require more powder. I'll also say that my TS barrel is really fast; much faster than my 2011 40sw barrel.

My load, specifically, is: Mixed HS brass, CCI 500, 3.6gr e3, 180gr TC Falcoated bullet @ 1.126". If using a BBI coated bullet I have to go to 3.7gr to make 172. Lubed lead is in between. Plated, such as Rainier is a little slower, and jacketed would be slower yet.

So really you are trying to compare a short round with a coated bullet that is faster than lead against a longer round using the slowest bullet.

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That's kind of what I figured. How is it getting consistently accurate powder throws with 3.6 gr of the e3? I forget, stick, flake, or ball?

Edited by EngineerEli

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That's kind of what I figured. How is it getting consistently accurate powder throws with 3.6 gr of the e3? I forget, stick, flake, or ball?

Flake. I have to take out my powder baffle to get you most consistent throws.

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Eli, I get SDs in the 4.83 to 7.95 range with my Dillon press, so e3 meters very well. With smooth press operation there is no variance at all. My new LnL press is even better, because disruptions to smooth operation don't seem to alter the drop at all.

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I was shooting an STI- DVC, OAL was 1.1145, temperature was pretty close to 90 degrees at the time. Elevation here is about 3100 feet.

I will test the 4.4 grain load again this week using a Glock 35 & a STI Eagle as well as the DVC. In past testing the Glock was 50 to 75 FPS faster the the Eagle.

I should receive my shipment of Blue Bullets soon and I am anxious to try the 3.6 gr load.

Metering is pretty consistent with my Dillion 550.

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I was shooting an STI- DVC, OAL was 1.1145, temperature was pretty close to 90 degrees at the time. Elevation here is about 3100 feet.

I will test the 4.4 grain load again this week using a Glock 35 & a STI Eagle as well as the DVC. In past testing the Glock was 50 to 75 FPS faster the the Eagle.

I should receive my shipment of Blue Bullets soon and I am anxious to try the 3.6 gr load.

Metering is pretty consistent with my Dillion 550.

Interesting, that eliminates the loading length possibility for slowing down your load, and the actual measured barrel lengths are just about the same, CZ measures their barrels weird, but apples to apples, I believe the CZ measures about 5.1" (same as the eagle) where as the DVC should be about 5.0". And, your even using a magnum primer too. All use conventional rifling, but I guess some barrels are just faster than others...

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I am working on it, meanwhile I have been able to test it with some 180 Gr. Blue Bullets. My DVC would not make major with the 3.6 Grains of E3, but 4.0 grains looks promising.

4.0 Grains of E3 with the 180 BB produced a 10 shot average velocity of 945 FPS. (170 PF) Highest velocity 955, Lowest 932. The test was run at approximately 56 degrees, elevation 3100. I use Magnum Primers for all my loads.

 

 

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I know this is a bit older, but I have been not shot for a year since i have been building my house. I was running e3 in my accurail sti with the infinity sight tracker barrel.  I believe i was 3.9gr at 1.2 with acme bullets... e3 powder was clean in chamber, but the end of my gun was filthy.  After a stage I could not see my fiber front sight.  When the gun is holstered, my pants were all carboned up.  Has any one else had this result.  I think I want to try red dot, n320, and maybe ramshot competition.

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On 1/17/2017 at 8:34 PM, durdy1 said:

I know this is a bit older, but I have been not shot for a year since i have been building my house. I was running e3 in my accurail sti with the infinity sight tracker barrel.  I believe i was 3.9gr at 1.2 with acme bullets... e3 powder was clean in chamber, but the end of my gun was filthy.  After a stage I could not see my fiber front sight.  When the gun is holstered, my pants were all carboned up.  Has any one else had this result.  I think I want to try red dot, n320, and maybe ramshot competition.

Bare lead bullets or coated?

 

I use E3 a lot and have never had an issue like you're describing. I'm guessing it's fouling from the lead bullets that you're seeing.

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Acme coated bullets.  I am guessing that either I need a magnum primer, or the powder is too low.  

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E3 and Clay Dot are supposed to be very similar to Clays.  Presume this was the Australian Clays as the Canadian version hasn't received a real glowing press from what I've read so far.

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Clay Dot and Clays are as close to identical as you can get.  Both are equally spikey when you get near max pressures, and both are equally dirty.  The only difference is the Clay Dot debris is black and easy to see.  Clays is gray and harder to see.  The Clays debris is very slightly gritty.

 

e3 is actually a completely different powder.  It burns cleaner than the other two, and exhibits no pressure spikes right up to max.  It has no temperature sensitivity.  It is the most consistent powder I've tried, and the best so far for 45 ACP.  For 200gr target loads at 740fps (bullseye) I get SDs in the 11 range.  Push the speed up to 800 or go for Major and you get single digit SDs.  It is so much better than the VV N310 I used to use it isn't even funny. 

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My experience with Clays hasn't shown me that it is a very dirty powder - but I use the Australian variety and have not tried the Canadian version.  It's been very accurate for me also.

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I found that E3 meters better than Clays, which is one reason why it would be more consistent.

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4 hours ago, durdy1 said:

Acme coated bullets.  I am guessing that either I need a magnum primer, or the powder is too low.  

How heavy are your bullets?

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180gr acme coated bullets.  May I need to run the e3 powder closer to max to get rid of the soot.  But Ithe seems like it defeats the purpose, and I would imagine it would increase power factor a bit along with more recoil.

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On 1/17/2017 at 8:34 PM, durdy1 said:

I know this is a bit older, but I have been not shot for a year since i have been building my house. I was running e3 in my accurail sti with the infinity sight tracker barrel.  I believe i was 3.9gr at 1.2 with acme bullets... e3 powder was clean in chamber, but the end of my gun was filthy.  After a stage I could not see my fiber front sight.  When the gun is holstered, my pants were all carboned up.  Has any one else had this result.  I think I want to try red dot, n320, and maybe ramshot competition.

 

I had this problem until I got up into the proper pressure range.  I was very conservative and backed way off when I first started with it.  Dirty barrel just like you mention.  Then it just went away, it may be the cleanest powder I've ever loaded.

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What gr powder are u at.. I am sitting at 172 pf with 4.2 gr of 3e at 1.2 with acme hi-tekm 180gr bullets.

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