benos Posted November 13, 2002 Share Posted November 13, 2002 Leaving aside miracles for the moment , if you wish to manifest your current capacity in competition, you must learn to do exactly what you do in practice, in competition. Or more subtly, you must learn how to ALLOW your capacity to manifest when under stress. And since YOU won't feel the same in a match as you do in practice, each must figure out how to accomplish this on his own. be Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tightloop Posted November 13, 2002 Share Posted November 13, 2002 Ghost Dog Looking back, was there a singular moment in time when you learned how to do that, or was it a gradual awakening. If it was the latter, how gradual was it and over what period of time? After you felt comfortable that you could shoot in competition the same as you shot in practice, could you call it up upon demand? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SiG Lady Posted November 14, 2002 Share Posted November 14, 2002 BE, what a timely post!... We just finished a seven-week stretch of indoor league action and what I learned from it was essentially that my very respectable practice session performance was simply not translating (often enough) into respectable competition scores or stunning timed performance. I concluded--probably correctly--that the only thing that went wrong was my apparent inability to FULLY relax at the proper time. The times that I did flip the mental switch to "relax mode" as the buzzer went off were the times my scores soared accordingly. Just not often enough . That's SiG Lady's 'confession' for the week. At least I know what the problem was. But you can bet I'm making plans for the next league session, you betcha. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jake Di Vita Posted November 14, 2002 Share Posted November 14, 2002 I have the opposite problems. When I push myself really hard in practice it all falls apart. When I get to a match and I really push myself, it all stays in one piece. It's almost like I'm more relaxed and aware during a match than practice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcoliver Posted November 14, 2002 Share Posted November 14, 2002 For me it would probably be an issue of TRUST. In practice, I trust myself that I it won't be downhill for me when I miss an A or a steel. But in competition, with everybody looking and all, I can't seem to trust myself that much. There's always these nagging thoughts of "What if I miss? Do a standing reload? Run out of ammo? Forget a target? What if I trip? Need to hurry up I feel to slow. And on and on." I guess I need to condition myself to trust in my abilities and trust that i can recover. Whew! Thanks for letting me rant. ---- WHOA! Talk about tri-burst. (Edited by mcoliver at 8:05 pm on Nov. 13, 2002) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bird Posted November 14, 2002 Share Posted November 14, 2002 Great question Brian, I seem to do better at matches then I do during practice, because I don't think when I shoot at a match I just shoot and I don't have time to think,(if that makes sense...lol). I do all my practicing at a small indoor range with poor lighting, LOUD concrete walls, and usually the sound of a 44 magnum shooter in the lane next to me. (and usually after a long 10hr+ work day). My practice involves just trying to shoot at a small dot at about 7 yds(group shooting-slow fire which drives me nuts as I am a hoser), or shooting empty boxes of factory ammo boxes that I find in the trash can from 7- 15-25 yds,(its is really fun watching them swing). After practicing under these adverse conditions, I find that shooting outdoors, with plenty of light, etc.etc., I shoot even better, alot better. While practicing at my local indoor range under such adverse,(this really sucks)conditons, I tend to analyze/over-analyze and just think too much, way too much when I practice. When I shoot my weekend IPSC match, once the buzzer goes off I don't think I just shoot and I am no longer concerned about how I hold the gun or anything else because I don't care, I am on auto-pilot... THS has a signature that really sums it up for me: Learn in dry-fire, confirm in practice and prove in competition, or something like that... When I Dry-fire and practice I think about every-little thing, (from the way my toenail feels on my left foot to the way I parted my hair on the right side). but when I shoot IPSC, my IQ drops to about room temp. and I just shoot. It has been a long 16hr+ day for me so I hope I am making sense......lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Anderson Posted November 14, 2002 Share Posted November 14, 2002 Lately I have abandoned all thought of winning or even placing well. I judge the day on whether I shot my best, representative of my capability. If I feel good about the shooting, I don't care where I place. If I screw up, the placement bothers me a lot more. In practice, the mind goes nuts. From time to technique, to mistakes, to things done well, to questions without answers, to answers to old questions that I had forgotten about. For example, this Tusday I practiced barricade ingress/egress. I was so consumed with the ingress shot that I neglected a faster way to shoot the other side. (outside in, NOT inside out) In a match, I would have shot them as visible during the walk-through, a method that is working well for me lately. In practice my single mindedness got those damn ingress shots whittled down to the point where I understand what the hell you guys have been talking about. Now to get there... SA Hey mcoliver: the fast runs always feel slow, so forget about it and shoot!!!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcoliver Posted November 14, 2002 Share Posted November 14, 2002 Quote: from Steve Anderson on 9:04 pm on Nov. 13, 2002 Hey mcoliver: the fast runs always feel slow, so forget about it and shoot!!!!!!! Yeah, couple that with those times you feel like you just shot the worst stage yet be surprised you actually placed well in the standings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benos Posted November 14, 2002 Author Share Posted November 14, 2002 Interesting comments all, and they definitely illustrate how various Temperaments respond differently to various circumstances. Some think and overanalyze too much in practice, some think and worry too much in matches, and some do both. tightloop, "Looking back, was there a singular moment in time when you learned how to do that, or was it a gradual awakening. If it was the latter, how gradual was it and over what period of time?" It was both. The realization that it is futile to attempt to exceed your capacity was like a brick on the head. But the effort required to always function at that level is continuous, and is complicated by the various levels of anxiety or stress present. "After you felt comfortable that you could shoot in competition the same as you shot in practice, could you call it up upon demand?" If I could I would never make a mistake related to rushing, of course. If I was the type of person that would be satisfied with a "safe" run, it would probably be "easier." But, I'm not; I typically always want to perform at my maximum ability/capacity. Again, combining that attitude with the various degrees of anxiety or stress present (in competition) is what "keeps us coming back." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flexmoney Posted November 14, 2002 Share Posted November 14, 2002 Here is an interesting bit of knowledge, by Olympic shooter Don Nygord... right up our alley. http://www.sportshooter.com/improving/nygord_psychology.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Million Mom Posted December 16, 2002 Share Posted December 16, 2002 What I finally figured out is that the shooting part of the match wasn't fun. It was torture. The fun part was the interaction with the other guys. I shoot matches only to add the stress of peer-pressure. Practice,with a few good buddies, that's the real fun. However, match performance is the standard by which you have to judge if your practice is actually leading to improvement. I've almost never shot anywhere close to my practice performance, while at a match. Depending upon the level of competition at a given match, I often still did very well in the ranking, but I was usually very upset at how poorly I had done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcoliver Posted December 16, 2002 Share Posted December 16, 2002 sigh...nevermind (Edited by mcoliver at 9:22 pm on Dec. 15, 2002) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TommyC Posted December 17, 2002 Share Posted December 17, 2002 I couldn't decide whether to post this question as a reply here or as a new topic, but since it seems to fit I decided to post it here: When I was involved in competitive indoor archery I reached a point where practice was almost monotonous and would almost Always do better in tournaments. I just seemed to focus better when "it counted" I shot quite a few 300/60x scores in tournaments, but only a few in practice. Have any of you experienced this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Ankeny Posted December 17, 2002 Share Posted December 17, 2002 TommyC: When I shot PPC I reached the point where I shot better scores in matches than in practice. I think part of the explaination is the fact that in PPC I shot the exact same courses of fire over and over, and like you, I found it monotonous. I also strongly believe that the presicion shooting sports, be it PPC or hurling sharp sticks at a five spot, are games of super concentration and intense mental focus. It is difficult to maintain that concentration when you know it isn't going to count. Can you relate to that? On the other hand, IPSC is not a game of super concentration, it is a game of super awareness and high speed information processing. In IPSC (compared to PPC) there is a huge difference in how I practice. I practice a variety of skill sets rather than static courses of fire. If I get bored, I just set up something different. I also try to practice those things that I do not do well, then finish on a positive note by shooting an itty bitty group. Above all, remember to practice with a purpose. Make every shot meaningful. I know that is hard to do, but it is the key to quality practice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AT Posted December 18, 2002 Share Posted December 18, 2002 The question posed by Brian reminds me of a quote from Lanny Basham. In a recent seminar that he hosted, he stated that "we should make it happen in training and let it happen in a match." After I started thinking about Lanny's comments, I felt that there was a lot of wisdom hidden within this quote. I have tried to apply this wisdom to most of my matches that I compete in and have found it to be very successful. Rob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Ankeny Posted December 18, 2002 Share Posted December 18, 2002 AT: Gotta love it...great quote. I think all of us would agree that your quote pretty much sums it up. Accomplishing the goal is where the problem arises. I used to wear a jersey back when I coached football that read, "It is not the desire to win that wins, it is the desire to prepare to win that wins." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AT Posted December 18, 2002 Share Posted December 18, 2002 Awesome quote Ron! Thanks! Rob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deaf Smith Posted December 18, 2002 Share Posted December 18, 2002 Ron, Do you know who made that quote? That's a very good saying. In fact, the more I think about it, the more truth I see in it! Deaf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Sharp Posted December 19, 2002 Share Posted December 19, 2002 Deaf, I heard it attributed to Bear Bryant. ROLL RIDE!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deaf Smith Posted December 19, 2002 Share Posted December 19, 2002 Maybe it came from this: The will to win is not nearly as important as the will to prepare to win. Bobby Knight, College Basketball Coach Another one I thought was good was: If you treat every situation as a life and death matter, you'll die a lot of times. - Dean Smith Oh, and the funniest: "If you don't learn from your mistakes, there's no point in making them." - Anonymous Deaf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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