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1-4 variable vs .... for a shtf AR


ATMester

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I was doing a lot of research on scopes regarding to this thread.

Low power variable scopes (1-4, 1-6) have no battery life, they last about 30 hours max on max setting regardless of brand.

(That VCOG is just way too expensive....)

Most of them hardly ever visible in bright daylight.

Black reticle on black cloths....well you wont see nothing.

Accupoints are "disposable" optics, when fiber optic gets dimmer in a few years no one is gonna be able to recharge it. Also tritium has a half life of approx 12 years. Meaning 6 years would be 25% loss of the original brightness and so on. Assuming it was new when it got put into the scope and the scope wasn't sitting years on a shelve somewhere before it was picked up by the customer.

(personally experienced this with a tritium front sight, ended up changing it out after 4-5 years.)

Not sure what accupoints look like inside in a building without natural light though, never had one.

Aimpoints stated to look like more and more the best option....

(with an extra battery or two they could go decades...)

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A trijicon with dead tritium is still fiber optic powered and works fine as a scope. An aim point with a dead battery is nothing.

If you open the trijicons fiber optics up all the way, enough splashed light from a weapons light will light it up fine and if you're shooting from pitch black into a lit area, it still works as a blacked out reticle.

I'm torn as I'm currently trying to pair down my collection to just game and zombie guns. I love my 3 gun rifle, but it's heavy, and I think setting off a JP comp inside the house would make everybody deaf

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I have a number of scopes, but for this scenario I wouldn't choose anything that required batteries. Something made by Trijicon would be first choice in an optic. Even good old black duplex cross hairs work well in most lighting situations.

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I have a number of scopes, but for this scenario I wouldn't choose anything that required batteries. Something made by Trijicon would be first choice in an optic. Even good old black duplex cross hairs work well in most lighting situations.

I go back and forth in this regard. A quality red dot is super fast, but there is the battery issue. I guess I must be indecisive because I'm sticking with my 1-5x on top backed up by a dot on a 45 degree mount! :ph34r::devil::ph34r::devil::ph34r:

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I have a number of scopes, but for this scenario I wouldn't choose anything that required batteries. Something made by Trijicon would be first choice in an optic. Even good old black duplex cross hairs work well in most lighting situations.

I go back and forth in this regard. A quality red dot is super fast, but there is the battery issue. I guess I must be indecisive because I'm sticking with my 1-5x on top backed up by a dot on a 45 degree mount! :ph34r::devil::ph34r::devil::ph34r:

Sounds like Open Division SHTF!

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I think a good tac optics or open three gun rifle minus the comp and low mass bold carrier and adding a suppressor would make the best all around end of the world gun.

Agreed. There's definitely advantages to having a variable optic, and the reality is that an MRD adds so little weight, pairing them up is a wise choice whether it's for sport or otherwise.

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I think a good tac optics or open three gun rifle minus the comp and low mass bold carrier and adding a suppressor would make the best all around end of the world gun.

Agreed. There's definitely advantages to having a variable optic, and the reality is that an MRD adds so little weight, pairing them up is a wise choice whether it's for sport or otherwise.
+2

I think my idea of a SHTF gun is skewed away from the red dot majority because of my rural location. If things really go down hill my rifle will be more useful to gather food than anything.

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Trijicon TR24 withouth a doubt. Can shoot just as fast as a red dot with a good variable optic.

Don't take it as an insult, but I strongly believe that fiber optic and tritium equals a disposable scope.

[Accupoints are "disposable" optics, when fiber optic gets dimmer in a few years no one is gonna be able to recharge it. Also tritium has a half life of approx 12 years. Meaning 6 years would be 25% loss of the original brightness and so on. Assuming it was new when it got put into the scope and the scope wasn't sitting years on a shelve somewhere before it was picked up by the customer.

(personally experienced this with a tritium front sight, ended up changing it out after 4-5 years.)

Not sure what accupoints look like inside in a building without natural light though, never had one.]

Also came across post about ACOGs loosing their daytime brightness due to the fiber optic getting old I guess.

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Fiber optics used in the computing industry is expected to last 40 years, meaning acceptable data transfer reliability. I'm 43 now, so if the fiber in the Trijicon lasts 40 that would be good enough for me.

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I'll play.

The best all around optic for Z-Day would be a low powered variable bar none. RDS are great up close but tales of 200-300-400 yard shooting are always done on conspicuous targets not on hidden targets in the shadows. Is that guy 250 m away a threat? A zombie? A friend? Ever shoot at a deer in the brush at 150 w/ a RDS? Pretty low percentage shot. I think that overcomes an RDS black reticle on black cloth advantage.

RDS are no doubt fastest up close but I'll shoot a variable on 1X, 95% as good as a RDS inside of 25 but an RDS is no where near 95% of a 6X optic at 300 m on an indistinct target in the shade or a target at even 50 in the dark. I will take massive increase in visual info that a variable offers over the minute speed that a RDS gets you.

So make it a mil grade variable power scope as a 1st choice (Leupold Mk6/8, Steiner, VCOG, Kahles), mil grade fixed power as 2nd choice (ACOG, HAMR), civilian variables as 3rd and RDS as 4th.

Of course, Z-Day is open/stealth class so multiple optics are in play!

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I can shoot as fast with a 1x optic as a red dot, so to me there's not much to contemplate.

Everyone knows zombies has to be shot in the head......5 zombies in 1.65 sec with a Trijicon TR24:

Or if they're standing next to each other (and have big heads :ph34r: )....1.36 sec:

Edited by slemmo
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One thing that concerns me about a 1-x for a gun of that purpose is setting the eye relief correctly for me at a given stock setting (generally fully extended stock) and then can that that eye relief be correct for my wife with a much shorter stock setting? I know the eye relief is generous on the 1-x's but is it generous enough?

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One thing that concerns me about a 1-x for a gun of that purpose is setting the eye relief correctly for me at a given stock setting (generally fully extended stock) and then can that that eye relief be correct for my wife with a much shorter stock setting? I know the eye relief is generous on the 1-x's but is it generous enough?

Might be, depends on the scope and the difference between you and your wife.

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One thing that concerns me about a 1-x for a gun of that purpose is setting the eye relief correctly for me at a given stock setting (generally fully extended stock) and then can that that eye relief be correct for my wife with a much shorter stock setting? I know the eye relief is generous on the 1-x's but is it generous enough?

Might be, depends on the scope and the difference between you and your wife.

Lets say: Vortex Strike Eagle, fully collapsed vs fully extended stock. Any idea? I need to pick one up for another rifle so eventually I can just check it out. Just won't be soon.

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I can pick up a Steiner M5Xi 1-5 for $1990 plus tax

Just wondering if it worth the $900 extra over the T5Xi 1-5

Anybody has any experience with both? I like the rapid dot reticle over the 3TR but I am not sure if I like it $900 more...

How is the battery life on those?

Just wondering if there's a more wise way to blow approx 2 grand....

For somebody who doesn't really shoot rifles in the firts place...

For $2100 out the door I could pick a VCOG but that 1st focal plane is not really appealing to me.

Or half the money could get me a Leupold VX-6

Edited by ATMester
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I was doing a lot of research on scopes regarding to this thread.

Low power variable scopes (1-4, 1-6) have no battery life, they last about 30 hours max on max setting regardless of brand.

(That VCOG is just way too expensive....)

Most of them hardly ever visible in bright daylight.

Black reticle on black cloths....well you wont see nothing.

Accupoints are "disposable" optics, when fiber optic gets dimmer in a few years no one is gonna be able to recharge it. Also tritium has a half life of approx 12 years. Meaning 6 years would be 25% loss of the original brightness and so on. Assuming it was new when it got put into the scope and the scope wasn't sitting years on a shelve somewhere before it was picked up by the customer.

(personally experienced this with a tritium front sight, ended up changing it out after 4-5 years.)

Not sure what accupoints look like inside in a building without natural light though, never had one.

Aimpoints stated to look like more and more the best option....

(with an extra battery or two they could go decades...)

Gee how did we make it in the days before illumination? The reality is yes illumination helps you shoot faster in a variety of lighting conditions but a black reticle is far from uselsss and much more usefull than any red dot sight with a dead batter. I have owned 2 Trijicon TR21's and 3 different TR24's while these scopes are not perfect they are not disposable. I like AImpoint and I have two but I won't buy anymore since I have found the Primary Arms Advanced Series Micro dot to be 95% as good for 1/3 the price. The best optics for end of days type work better not depend on batteries.

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Gee how did we shoot before optics? Once all the batteries die and all the scopes loose the ability to stay zeroed, iron sights will rule the kingdoms of hope and goodness.

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