For the first-timers: First ten rounds ever reloaded (and shot just pe

[ZackJones]

I tried that...never could get my brass to land end up where I could see the mark...mine always seems to lay on the side....and the wide red mark makes it pretty easy to see.

Your extractor needs tuning . The mark around the case does make it very easy to spot your own brass I'll give you that.

[Sarge]

Marking is nice I guess but tedious at best. Now, if somebody invented a spinning device coming out of the loaded round chute.......

[TJART]

DO NOT STOP THE PRESS TO CHECK THE CHARGE WEIGHT EVERY 50 ROUNDS. I can't stress this enough. This is where squibs and double charges are made. Check your charge weight before you start a session, then leave it alone. Trust your press.

Another thing, don't do the charge weight thing in the case anymore either. Throw 10 charges, putting each one into the pan that comes with your scale, then divide by 10 to get the charge weight. The amount of powder that will stick inside of a case is so small as to not be measurable even on the powder scales.

And I'm going to mention this now, as I have no doubt you will come across it very soon. DON'T TRY TO DETERMINE A SQUIB BY WEIGHING A COMPLETED ROUND. It can't be done. Even with brass from the same manufacturer, the weight of each case can vary by more than the weight of the powder charge inside. If you think you've made a squib, you have two options....pull all the bullets and see, or shoot them, one at a time.

I get what you're saying with this piece of advice; but if someone is too stupid to throw a charge, dump it, then forget to throw another before bullet seating, they shouldn't be reloading. (Not trying to be a jerk, just sayin')

[Steve RA]

Let he who has never made a mistake hold their hand up !

[Nathanb]

You nailed it Steve. Everyone has screwed it up

[TJART]

Let he who has never made a mistake hold their hand up !

You nailed it Steve. Everyone has screwed it up

I just pulled almost 200 rounds due to seating depth error. Everyone makes mistakes. But to throw a charge, weight and not recharge is pretty careless.

[peterthefish]

Let he who has never made a mistake hold their hand up !

You nailed it Steve. Everyone has screwed it up

I just pulled almost 200 rounds due to seating depth error. Everyone makes mistakes. But to throw a charge, weight and not recharge is pretty careless.

Says the guy who just made 200 mistakes in a row [emoji28]!

[Youngeyes]

DO NOT STOP THE PRESS TO CHECK THE CHARGE WEIGHT EVERY 50 ROUNDS. I can't stress this enough. This is where squibs and double charges are made. Check your charge weight before you start a session, then leave it alone. Trust your press.

Another thing, don't do the charge weight thing in the case anymore either. Throw 10 charges, putting each one into the pan that comes with your scale, then divide by 10 to get the charge weight. The amount of powder that will stick inside of a case is so small as to not be measurable even on the powder scales.

And I'm going to mention this now, as I have no doubt you will come across it very soon. DON'T TRY TO DETERMINE A SQUIB BY WEIGHING A COMPLETED ROUND. It can't be done. Even with brass from the same manufacturer, the weight of each case can vary by more than the weight of the powder charge inside. If you think you've made a squib, you have two options....pull all the bullets and see, or shoot them, one at a time.

I get what you're saying with this piece of advice; but if someone is too stupid to throw a charge, dump it, then forget to throw another before bullet seating, they shouldn't be reloading. (Not trying to be a jerk, just sayin')

Leave the" stupid" comments, and all personal remarks out of this thread. I remind you of the Forum Guidelines...

Attitude

Please be polite. Or if not polite, at least respectful.

No bickering. Regardless of the subject matter.

Antagonistic, offensive, or quarrelsome tones are not acceptable.

[ChemistShooter]

I made a brass marker. Makes a 1/4" wide mark around the middle.

I wondered if making a mark around the middle was safe. This will be a lot easier to see than on the head.

[GrumpyOne]

I made a brass marker. Makes a 1/4" wide mark around the middle.

I wondered if making a mark around the middle was safe. This will be a lot easier to see than on the head.

Been doing it that way for many years. Since it is just a sharpie marker, there is no residue that I can tell.

[ChemistShooter]

Ah. My very next question, marking cases for retrieval. I have discovered TiteGroup leaves a distinctive burn mark around the mouth that makes it easy to see what I fired. (Done shot 300 of them puppies so far. I reek of TiteGroup.) But a mark would be better. I only want what I fired. I know their history.

Again, thanks to all. Y'all are making this easy.

Chem, TiteGroup should not leave soot on the case, nor should any powder, that is because your charge weight is too low. I have been running that powder for over 15 years thru my Glocks and the fired cases look nearly as clean as they went in. 125 TC Bayous on top of 4.2 grs at 1.100". Can you post a pic? Suggest you go with the published Hodgdon data, 4.5 grs minimum at 1.125" OAL. 4 grs would work ok for moly lead or coated, but not FMJ, since there is more friction. I would actually take it to 5.0 grs, and guys I know using 115's are running 5.4 grs

I saw that but that was for hollow points. I had 3.9 gr in one of my manuals for .355" FMJ RN, which was closer.

The cases are black as soot on the inside. You're probably right but what I have is working, and I'm reluctant to change it. What I need to do, of course, is chrono the rounds but a) I don't have a chrono and don't even know where I could set one up. 1.125" OAL is over SAAMI spec for 9mm and it's going to be a good long while before I try going over SAAMI spec.

[Bkreutz]

SAAMI maximum spec for 9mm is 1.169". http://lh3.ggpht.com/-iOdCpSrdwxM/UXQ6-VWlZEI/AAAAAAAAMT0/CZga4lfZ5-c/Capture%2525209mm_thumb%25255B4%25255D.jpg?imgmax=800

The 1.125" you are referring to is the length that that particular load was tested at.

[9x45]

chem, I'm tying to help you buddy. 1.169" is the max for 9mm, not the minimum. I have loaded as short as 1.050" OAL. It all depends on the bullet. JHPs are the same as FMJs all copper on the outside diameter. The Shooting Chrono is about $100, some even cheaper at $70, the Caldwell. You don't need a chrono yet, just get your loads right. If you don't need to make a power floor for competition, then accuracy and function are first.

[IDescribe]

Chemist, a few things:

The soot ring does indicate your pressure is too low. Basically, when the powder ignites, it expands the case walls out to form a pressure seal between the case and the chamber. In your case, that pressure seal isn't happening quickly enough, and your bleeding hot gases out between the case and chamber walls, and the result is sooty cases (as well as inefficient, inconsistent burns).

Some plated bullet manufacturers will tell you to load their plated like lead while others will say to load it like jacketed. I have found plated to be about the same or maybe take a little more than jacketed. This is relevant here because the GDHP is actually a plated, not jacketed bullet.

Not all FMJ RN load the same, so load data for generic bullets, like your load data for the 115gr RN FMJ, is often not that accurate and frequently on the conservative side.

Given the same bullet weight, lead bullets typically have lighter charge windows than jacketed. The fact that Hodgdon's 115gr Lead RN data has a starting load of 3.9 suggests that 3.9 is probably too low a starting load for your jacketed RN.

JHP typically load deeper into the case than RN, leaving a smaller initial combustion chamber and thus higher pressure. So if you want to use RN data for HP, you should probably reduce the charge window, but using JHP data for jacketed RN is typically safe, especially when you're loading them out long like you are at 1.15.

Basically, there's a lot to suggest that 9x45's suggestion that you use the GDHP data is in fact safe. If you want to be extra extra safe (which I'm going to go out on a limb and say that you do ), maybe you could load some at 4.1, 4.3 and 4.5, then test the lighter charges first. If you hit one that significantly reduces the sootiness, then maybe stop there and wait for a chrono before going higher, but 3.9gr is almost certainly underpressure.

Edited January 5, 2016 by IDescribe

[Beastly]

Caveat Loader: You will get much higher pressures when reducing OAL's; ALSO reduce powder charge as required.

[Sarge]

I'm reminded of WTG.

[9x45]

Caveat Loader: You will get much higher pressures when reducing OAL's; ALSO reduce powder charge as required.

Of course, but his current load has a lower charge weight and longer OAL than the as tested Hodgdon load so he is not even at the starting point. If he was already at 4.8 grains and 1.125", well for one there would be no soot, and if it shot very accurately and cycled fine, there would be no reason to go any further (because he is not trying to make a power floor for competition) even though the data suggests it made minor in the test gun. At this point a chrono would be useful if he decides to increase charge weight or lower the OAL, but it is still nowhere near +P, or +P+ pressure levels.

[9x45]

What's WTG mean?

[Youngeyes]

The "dirtiness" that is left behind after shooting a number of rounds is basically "unburned" component materials in the powder. There are a number of different chemicals that are used to control the burning rate of the powder and if enough pressure isn't generated to consume those components and turn them into a gas they are left behind as residue. Carbon is typically one of the most plentiful residues left behind. Those of you who have any experience with a cutting torch will know what happens if you don't have enough oxygen in your flame...........carbon build-up on your torch tip. That is because you need the oxygen molecules to combine with the gas in order to bond with the carbon that is the gas. If not enough oxygen is present the carbon doesn't have anything to bond with and is simply left behind as residue.

[9x45]

That is because you need the oxygen molecules to combine with the gas in order to bond with the carbon that is the gas. If not enough oxygen is present the carbon doesn't have anything to bond with and is simply left behind as residue.

Uh oh, that's going to get going! Will a round still fire in outer space where there is no ambient oxygen present??? (assuming an airtight seal on the primer and bullet). And can you hear it?

What was Newtons 3rd law again? oh yea, go ahead, make my day.

Edited January 5, 2016 by 9x45

[Youngeyes]

Punk.

[Nebwake]

Don't vacuum spilled gunpowder.

Static charges and brushes in the motor can ignite it. Just use a brush and sweep it up. Maybe a little compressed air.

Black powder is explosive, smokeless powder burns with vigor.

Congratulations on getting started with rolling your own ammo. It's really gratifying to find the your own ammo produces groups half the size of factory ammo.

I never saved any money reloading, just get to shoot more.

Plus, you can loose all your locator pins before you realize what happened. Digging in the shop vac is not fun. (happened during 223 trimming)

I have done this more times than I like to admit You would figure I would have learned by now!

[GrumpyOne]

What's WTG mean?

One of Sarge's close personal friends.

[ChemistShooter]

chem, I'm tying to help you buddy. 1.169" is the max for 9mm, not the minimum. I have loaded as short as 1.050" OAL. It all depends on the bullet. JHPs are the same as FMJs all copper on the outside diameter. The Shooting Chrono is about $100, some even cheaper at $70, the Caldwell. You don't need a chrono yet, just get your loads right. If you don't need to make a power floor for competition, then accuracy and function are first.

Brain screw-up on my part. Somehow I was thinking it was too long.

I will soon get a chrono, I'm sure. I just have no clue where to set one up. Someone at the range will know a place, I reckon.

I'm gonna try iDescribe's method.

[ChemistShooter]

Chemist, a few things:

The soot ring does indicate your pressure is too low. Basically, when the powder ignites, it expands the case walls out to form a pressure seal between the case and the chamber. In your case, that pressure seal isn't happening quickly enough, and your bleeding hot gases out between the case and chamber walls, and the result is sooty cases (as well as inefficient, inconsistent burns).

Some plated bullet manufacturers will tell you to load their plated like lead while others will say to load it like jacketed. I have found plated to be about the same or maybe take a little more than jacketed. This is relevant here because the GDHP is actually a plated, not jacketed bullet.

Not all FMJ RN load the same, so load data for generic bullets, like your load data for the 115gr RN FMJ, is often not that accurate and frequently on the conservative side.

Given the same bullet weight, lead bullets typically have lighter charge windows than jacketed. The fact that Hodgdon's 115gr Lead RN data has a starting load of 3.9 suggests that 3.9 is probably too low a starting load for your jacketed RN.

JHP typically load deeper into the case than RN, leaving a smaller initial combustion chamber and thus higher pressure. So if you want to use RN data for HP, you should probably reduce the charge window, but using JHP data for jacketed RN is typically safe, especially when you're loading them out long like you are at 1.15.

Basically, there's a lot to suggest that 9x45's suggestion that you use the GDHP data is in fact safe. If you want to be extra extra safe (which I'm going to go out on a limb and say that you do ), maybe you could load some at 4.1, 4.3 and 4.5, then test the lighter charges first. If you hit one that significantly reduces the sootiness, then maybe stop there and wait for a chrono before going higher, but 3.9gr is almost certainly underpressure.

Very well-reasoned and explained. You've convinced me. I'll give it a shot. (My primers are on the floor underneath a bench now. :-) Can't fall, nothing can fall on them.)