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Accuracy is coming...


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I'm pretty curious about this, as well! I'm at the point now where I'm either going to spend money on the M&P or retire it for a new prod gun. Decisions decisions!

Skils>Tools

absolutely right...you gotta be able to shoot first before you start switching things out on your gun..

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  • 2 weeks later...

Read some of the writings on Bullseye shooting. http://www.bullseyepistol.com/cstomgun.htm

First you remove all the mechanical issues you have control over, then work on the ones that YOU have to improve.

I have been leaning towards an STI Trojan in 9MM. This would be used in Steel plates, IPSC, and IDPA.

After looking into the improvements possible to an M&P by APEX Tactical, that decision may change.

True, the Trojan is Single Stack class and the M&P is Limited, I believe that shooting Limited would be best for me at this point.

If my shooting ability improves, then the Single Stack class with an STI 1911 is a potential.

I figure about $700 to $750 to start with a fully modified M&P, based on what I have now, and what I would have to purchase, to reach a functioning, competitive M&P.

To compete with an STI Trojan would run about $1400 after purchasing a new firearm, extra mags, mag holders etc.

Edited by Jimk60
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  • 2 weeks later...

I'm a little concerned about the comments on having to load a little short.

You guys that are having issues would you mind describing your load, COL, etc, what it was prior to the switch and what you had to shorten it to?

Thanks!

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  • 2 weeks later...

Just installed the semi drop in in my 5" gun on Friday and shot it yesterday at the range. Put 10 rounds through it...115 grain Winchester....and then sat down at 25 yards, set the gun on a bag and pushed out 5 rounds for this......

post-19315-145583243634_thumb.jpg

I didn't take a great deal of time but didn't rush it either. The gun is considerably more accurate and POA/POI did not change at all for me. Install was not quick! I have a cerekoted slide and it made things less than fun. Install time was about 3.5 hours but I did take plenty of time. Lock up is TIGHT. I ran 115, 124, 147 and hand loads and had zero issues while running a 14# recoil spring. So, shots 11-15 out of the barrel from a sand bag with moderate concentration yielded a sub 2" group at 25 yards....for what that's worth.

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I had an M&P 9 Pro (2011 vintage) that I put a new factory two dot barrel and an new locking block. This helped a little but could not compare to my CZ shadow. The M&P went good-bye. When the new Carry Optics division came out, I got the bug to set up an M&P Core with the new Apex semi drop in barrel. The barrel took about ½ hour to fit.

I am not a very good group shooter, especially at 25 yards and beyond. Below is a 10 shot group at 25 yards off hand (no rest). The M&P is now on par with my best groups from my CZ or Brazos STI HP Edge.

MP%20Core%20Apex%20Barrel_zpszrok2bq9.jp

Load:
124 Berry HBRN
4.0 gun of TiteGroup
1.13 oal
3.77 crimp

I am testing 147 bullets and the chamber is tight. ACME and SNS 147 Coated require 1.120 OAL to pass the plunk test. I can do 1.130 with my CZ Shadow.

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I load 147gr Bayou FP to 1.135'' and had 0 issues with the APEX barrel.


Some updates on mine as it now has close to 6000 round count. I can see the barrel has been marked at various contact spots with the slide. It also no longer requires a light push to go into battery when I chamber & gently release the slide. Appears the initial tight lockup is gradually wearing away. However, I have not seen any accuracy degradation, yet.

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Installed the barrel, but my current load will not seat. MG 124 jhp, OAL 1.13 (avg) with 4.7 WST. Placing a bullet in a spent shell multiple times and seating it reruns an oal of 1.085. Not sure how safe or how to go about rebuilding a load for that oal.?

The barrel did shoot @ 1 inch at 23 yards braced on my knees compared to 2 inch with the factory barrel. That was using a friends 115 RN loads witch seat fine with oal of 1.128

Any advice would be appreciated.

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Installed the barrel, but my current load will not seat. MG 124 jhp, OAL 1.13 (avg) with 4.7 WST. Placing a bullet in a spent shell multiple times and seating it reruns an oal of 1.085. Not sure how safe or how to go about rebuilding a load for that oal.?

The barrel did shoot @ 1 inch at 23 yards braced on my knees compared to 2 inch with the factory barrel. That was using a friends 115 RN loads witch seat fine with oal of 1.128

Any advice would be appreciated.

I have had a gunsmith fitted BarSto barrel doing the same, though the APEX SDI is perfectly fine with 1.135'' OAL flat points bullets. The BarSto wouldn't pass plunk test unless I load to <1.1'' OAL. One thing you can try is to use RN bullets. They offer shorter ogive than flat point for the same OAL and likely won't hit the lands early. Another options is to ream the chamber - I did that to the BarSto, but my perception is that the accuracy degraded slightly after the reaming, although the smith said it should not affect accuracy at all.

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Sounds like I'm going to be fine with the required oal, now I just need to get the load worked up before next weekends match. Hopefully the load will work well enough in a factory barrel also, as I intended to shoot production and production optics. I have two M&Ps to keep switching back and forth simple.

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I am fitting my semi drop in tonight how many of you had to remove material from the front of the barrel the get the barrel into the slide? I have been working on it for about an hour and a half and can't get it to go in I have been slowly removing material as shown in the installation video but it doesn't seem to make it any better.

Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk

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I am fitting my semi drop in tonight how many of you had to remove material from the front of the barrel the get the barrel into the slide? I have been working on it for about an hour and a half and can't get it to go in I have been slowly removing material as shown in the installation video but it doesn't seem to make it any better.

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Took me an hour to do that too... That's the longest part in the whole process for me

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I am fitting my semi drop in tonight how many of you had to remove material from the front of the barrel the get the barrel into the slide? I have been working on it for about an hour and a half and can't get it to go in I have been slowly removing material as shown in the installation video but it doesn't seem to make it any better.

Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk

Took me an hour to do that too... That's the longest part in the whole process for me

Yeah it was really tight on my pro series 9 but slid right in on my ported CORE.

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Also I ended up with one small issue. My load is too long to clear when ejecting a live round. I have been shooting Missouri Bullet Company 147 gr FP coated bullets. And the bullet profile doesn't taper quickly enough to clear the chamber before the round hits the ejector it is only by a thousandth or two. I may just have to seat them just slightly deeper to give me clearance to show clear at the end of a stage. Has anyone else experienced this?

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Hi Guys,

I figiure I would chime in with some technical data/support information that might be helpful.

When I designed the barrel, the throat dimensions were generated around optimizing accuracy with run of the mill 115 gr. ball ammo. All of the ammunition that I tested in the barrel ran 1.085-1.125" max.

We did discover that some of our first run barrels had slightly shorter throats than I had spec'd due to a worn reamer. Since that discovery, the barrels are now being checked by our QC department pre and post heat treat.

The barrels can be throat reamed for longer length cartridges if needed.

We have also found that due to frame tolerance and ammo combination that some rounds aren't clearing the barrel when performing administrative unloading. We are addressing this issue by making a clearance cut on the right hand side of the chamber wall to eliminate the issue across the board, regardless of frame dimensional tolerance.

We also are addressing some feed ramp issues as again, we are encountering dimensional tolerance changes as the factory guns have evolved.

If you are experiencing any issues, please do not hesitate to contact us so that we can address any issues related to how our barrel is functioning in your pistol.

Thanks,

Randy

Edited by Randy Lee
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Thanks for the info Randy. I experienced the issue regarding the rounds not clearing the barrel during admin unload, but it was sporadic and seemed to go away, especially since I started jacking the slide really hard to get the round out. I also experienced failure to chamber a round, but I believe it was only when the magazine was fully loaded with 17 rounds. The ammo I used was PNC 115gr and Atlanta Arms 147gr, both of which are round nose. I shot less than 100 rounds the first time and figured the barrel had to break in. Also, I did a plunk test at home and noticed that Atlanta Arms would not touch the rifling, but PNC did, but I did not use a caliper to confirm the length of either cartridge.

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I asked our guys to reconfigure the feed ramp, as I was measuring some inconsistency in some of the barrels. Our ramp is steeper than factory due to the change in dwell time (which accounts in part for our acuracy).

The next production run will have the clearance cut for loaded rounds, and a gentler angle on the ramp. Most guns seemed to run fine, but I have seen about 10 reports back that some guns were not feeding properly.

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I asked our guys to reconfigure the feed ramp, as I was measuring some inconsistency in some of the barrels. Our ramp is steeper than factory due to the change in dwell time (which accounts in part for our acuracy).

The next production run will have the clearance cut for loaded rounds, and a gentler angle on the ramp. Most guns seemed to run fine, but I have seen about 10 reports back that some guns were not feeding properly.

Can we send in these early production barrels for a relief cut?

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I asked our guys to reconfigure the feed ramp, as I was measuring some inconsistency in some of the barrels. Our ramp is steeper than factory due to the change in dwell time (which accounts in part for our acuracy).

The next production run will have the clearance cut for loaded rounds, and a gentler angle on the ramp. Most guns seemed to run fine, but I have seen about 10 reports back that some guns were not feeding properly.

Can we send in these early production barrels for a relief cut?

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Yes. Just call our office and tell them that your barrel is not allowing the loaded rounds to eject. They will set up a work order so that once the barrel arrives it will be routed to the shop for machining.

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