Powder measure throwing inconsistant charges on Square DB

[shotgunone]

I have been loading 9mm on my square deal b and have noticed that my powder charges are +/- 0.2 or 0.3 grains frequently. I have been using Titegroup. When I throw 10 charges in a row and weigh them the whole group of 10 may be off .5 grain total which isn't bad, but when weighed individually I may have one down .2 and the next one will be .3 on the high side.

Since I am starting to load for 9mm in an open gun with HS-6 and was weighing every load, I had one charge that was .4 over and that's not good. Not sure if it's my technique or something I can do to the powder measure to improve consistency.

Any suggestions would be appreciated.

Thanks

Edited September 11, 2015 by shotgunone

[dsa]

Keep the powder hopper at 2/3's full and use case lube. When I do this it greatly improves the consistency of my powder charges.

[Alan550]

Powder measures are only accurate to +/- .1 to .2 grain. Add to that error factor that the scale is probably the same tolerance level, and you can come away with +/- .2 to +/-.4 very easily if the error factor is compounded between the 2 devices. You're talking about 2/70,000ths of a pound or 1/4,375ths of an ounce. If your loads are that critical, hand weigh the powder.

YMMV

Alan~^~

[shotgunone]

Keep the powder hopper at 2/3's full and use case lube. When I do this it greatly improves the consistency of my powder charges.

I do lube all my cases when I reload and I usually run at least 1/2 full on the powder hopper.

Powder measures are only accurate to +/- .1 to .2 grain. Add to that error factor that the scale is probably the same tolerance level, and you can come away with +/- .2 to +/-.4 very easily if the error factor is compounded between the 2 devices. You're talking about 2/70,000ths of a pound or 1/4,375ths of an ounce. If your loads are that critical, hand weigh the powder.

YMMV

Alan~^~

I see your point on the tolerances and it makes sense. As for critical, it's probably not so much on my loads for IDPA which are pretty moderate. But I'm beginning to load for 9 major so I would imagine that 0.2 grain can make a big difference but I'm not really sure. Guess I it could be my scale too. It's hard to eliminate the error when you have two possible culprets. I may need to see if I can borrow somebody else's scale to check that out first.

Thanks for the idea's.

[Hi-Power Jack]

Has to be a Very Expensive scale to measure such small differences.

You are probably doing fine - just load up 20 of your Major loads, and

chrono them - see how close the velocities are for the 20 rounds.

My guess, as Alan mentioned, is that you're fine - just random error.

[Boxerglocker]

Powder measures are only accurate to +/- .1 to .2 grain. Add to that error factor that the scale is probably the same tolerance level, and you can come away with +/- .2 to +/-.4 very easily if the error factor is compounded between the 2 devices. You're talking about 2/70,000ths of a pound or 1/4,375ths of an ounce. If your loads are that critical, hand weigh the powder.

YMMV

Alan~^~

+/- .1 - .2 with Titegroup on a Dillon measure? The OP has stated as high as .3

I'm sorry but my experiences do vary. I use a a Dillon electronic scale and calibrate at every session, never had a variance greater than .1 with TG in a Dillon measure on 4 different machines. When I do get a variance, I double check and rezero usually it's the scale from getting bumped on being in a slight breeze with the door open.

I would suggest going back to the basics. Disassemble your powder measure, clean the bowl out with soap and water and thoroughly dry. Clean the powder funnel ( I use a clean plastic bristle bore brush to scrub the inner bore clean) and the powder slide (use alcohol). Reassemble and take note of making your final adjustments of the powder bar turning the nut in the clockwise direction. Also make sure you have a spent case in the #2 station when you make the fail safe rod wing bolt adjustment.

Edited September 11, 2015 by Boxerglocker

[jmorris]

I am with boxers locker, something is wrong if your swinging a half grain (-.2/+.3). My (stock) Dillon measures will drop TG at 3.2 time after time. When I fill the measure I throw the first few charges back into the hopper before I start or after I adjust the powder bar.

I am wondering what scale you are using. Can you get repeatable results if you are weighing the exact same charge more than once(remove it from the scale/pan then back)?

Edited September 11, 2015 by jmorris

[shotgunone]

Started with removing and cleaning the powder measure. I have disassembled it and hand washed it in dish soap. Rinsed it and allowing it to air dry. After I get it all back together and have some time I'll do some comparison to see if that helps. Also found that I have a crack in the plastic square piece that moves the powder bar back and forth. Dillon is sending me a new one. I'll do some more testing and see how it works.

I'm wasn't overly concerned with my IDPA loads since they were not close to maximum. However since I'm starting with some 9 major loads I want my powder charges to be fairly consistent. I can remove and replace the pan on the scales and get consistent readings. I have an older beam style RCBS scale but I am mostly using a Hornady electronic scale. With the test weight it seems accurate. Might borrow a friends scale to do some comparing.

Thanks for the help.

[JD45]

Fill itt full. Check after 200 rds again. Then load 100 more and check. If its within 3 tenths don't worry. Just don't load too close to the minimum PF. It could be partially your scale.

[jmorris]

. I have an older beam style RCBS scale but I am mostly using a Hornady electronic scale. With the test weight it seems accurate. Might borrow a friends scale to do some comparing.

Do they both agree when you weigh the charges your throwing?

As an aside hopefully you are planning on using something much slower than TG for your major 9 loads.

[9x45]

I've been running my SD for over 15 years and never seen it throw more than +/-.1 grains with TiteGroup. You need to clean the powder bar. Also TiteGroup is to hot for major 9mm, you need alot slower powder

[shotgunone]

I hope to get to do some testing tomorrow. Comparing my two scales. Especially since I have cleaned up the powder measure.

As I said at in the first post I'm using HS-6 for open loads. Titegroup is for my IDPA loads and general 9mm.

I'm hoping to get about 170 PF with for my open loads.

Thanks for all the help.

[shotgunone]

Did my testing after complete dissassembly and cleaning of the powder measure. Ran about 100 powder drops and weighed them on both my electronic Hornady scale and my old RCBS beam scale. I'd say both scales weighed the charge the same. Also all powder drops are now vary no more than +/- 0.1 gr. Did find that I had to tare my electronic scale a couple of times when it would time out and go off.

Loaded about 20 rounds and weighed ever load and it's seemed the cleaning has improved powder charge consistency.

[Bamboo]

"...Did find that I had to tare my electronic scale a couple of times when it would time out and go off."

One thing I found that helps get consistent readings is to make sure the electronic scale had had time to acclimate to the environment where I load. I keep my calipers and scales in the house, but reload in the garage. In Florida in the summer the garage can get pretty hot. I found that if I bring the scale out in the garage and let it sit for 20-30 minutes before I intend to reload I only need to hit the tare button a couple of times after start up before the scale settles down.

I see that you are in Texas and I heard it gets pretty hot there, too, so that might be a consideration if you are loading in your garage.

Also, I tried a few different scales before I found one that I liked. Some are just flaky.

[9x45]

I have an old Ohaus and a newer Gemini jewelers scale. The Gemini was like $20 and accurate to 0.015 grains. I make check weights at work on our $15,000 vacuum scientific (.00001gms) at 3-4 grains so I know the Gemini is correct.