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Looking at Lee Classic Turret for first press


StraightSh00ter

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I have a freind who started 3 gunning 1.5 year ago and has been using a Lee Turret press to load his 9mm ammo for himself AND his two sons who also shoot 3 gun. He was loading his 223 on a Dillon and new, so he was afraid to alter the Dillon to load pistol.

He has worn out the little plastic part that indexes the press and the priming system more than once. Lee would send the parts for free but it would take a couple of weeks so he orders the inexpensive parts and pays more for shipping than the parts.

Long story short, he is switching over to all Dillon. Now I know that is more expensive, BUT, with the round count your talking about you will be buying a Dillon or a Lock n Load sooner or later.

I also want to echo the previous posters that I run the Lee 4 Die sets on my tool heads also.

Your going to spend $209 for a deluxe Lee kit at midway (Not bad) and need dies or $439 for the Dillon and need dies and a scale. I would save the $209 and invest in the better tool instead.

Good luck with your decision either way, we have all been there :cheers:

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Another shooter from Ashville! That's good to know, I think about moving there quite a bit....

I haven't looked at the Hornady press all that much - maybe I should pay a little more attention to it. My thought is to go from the LCT ($188 from FSR) to the 650 ($570+ from BEnos). I've watched some more videos on the 650 and am pretty happy with the decision to get comfortable reloading on the LCT. I don't mind spending the extra time to really get to understand what I'm doing and develop an eye and feel for quality reloads.

I will order extra ratchet squares - I read about them too. I think that's really the only weak spot and I don't know that its necessarily a problem for most people. But I was thinking I could also cut a couple out of some carbon fiber laminate I have laying around - that should last quite a bit longer and be pretty easy to do.

Edited by StraightSh00ter
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Another shooter from Ashville! That's good to know, I think about moving there quite a bit....

I haven't looked at the Hornady press all that much - maybe I should pay a little more attention to it. My thought is to go from the LCT ($188 from FSR) to the 650 ($570+ from BEnos). I've watched some more videos on the 650 and am pretty happy with the decision to get comfortable reloading on the LCT. I don't mind spending the extra time to really get to understand what I'm doing and develop an eye and feel for quality reloads.

I will order extra ratchet squares - I read about them too. I think that's really the only weak spot and I don't know that its necessarily a problem for most people. But I was thinking I could also cut a couple out of some carbon fiber laminate I have laying around - that should last quite a bit longer and be pretty easy to do.

Asheville is a nice place to live. The traffic is getting bad though and you need a marketable skill to say the least.

I think there is a weakness in the priming system too but you could have spare parts on hand. I have a 2 spare parts kit for my Dillon.

As far as the dollar figure you quoted for a 650, do not even consider one without a case feeder. The reason I have a 650 is because a friend lent me one to try. I bought a case feeder for the borrowed press the ergos were so bad but I knew I would get a 650 after running one. I had some 550's and but have a 650 now. I like the 650 much better but I only use it to load my high volume competition rounds. Remember with the 550 you can load only one round at a time if you want until you have a complete grasp of the process (not long).

I have no experience with the Lock and Load but have 2 friends that have them. They are cheaper and both owners that I know are happy. There are numerous threads about it of course.

If you have gotten into competitive shooting I would definitely read the threads on which Dillon to buy. Not that you should not get the Lee, but it may give you something to think about perspective wise.

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The little ratchet squares will hardly every wear out if you don't try to turn the turret with the index rod in place and the ratchet in the spiral section of the rod. Raise the ram all the way to the top before you turn the turret and they'll last a long time. I haven't changed one in over five years and thousands of rounds.

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I think there is a weakness in the priming system too but you could have spare parts on hand. I have a 2 spare parts kit for my Dillon.

Priming systems are frequently the Achilles heel of a reloading system and it really pays to have replacement parts on hand.

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The priming system is OK and not great, but probably as good or better than a lot of them. The biggest "secret" is to get the Auto Prime arm lined up perfectly with the little metal cup of the seater when it's at the top of the stroke. Then, the technique has to be just right. There are days when I have a good feel for it and every primer loads perfectly and then there are days when about one out of four drops on the floor and I have to load it by hand. What I do like about the system is that the primers are stored edge to edge in the circular tray and not top to bottom like some other systems.

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I had a Lee Classic turret. It worked great for large pistol primer, but I never could get the small primer to work well. Would take me over two hours to load 100 rounds of 9mm. It almost ruined reloading for me. If I had to do over, I wish I could have started with a single stage, like was recommended to me and learned the whole process.

You can load on a 550 one round at a time. I did while learning mine. It is a much nicer machine, and for the cost it should be! However, everything about it is more expensive. Where a lee die set comes with your shell plate, the 550 requires a shell plate and buttons for additional ~30 dollars. Which is why I wish I had a single stage occasionally.

I am glad I had the Lee to learn on, but wish I would have believed more in myself and just started with what I knew I wanted, a 550.

Edited by soundlzrd
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I have to say, this has been a very helpful thread and I'm impressed that we're 3 pages deep without bashing or criticism. Obviously there are different approaches and preferences, but you are all very respectful of each other and I appreciate that.

I personally don't find the 550 very appealing - it seems 'busy' with having to load a case, feed a bullet, and manually turn the disk between each pull of the handle. I understand it's a lot faster doing 4 rounds simultaneously but the process sounds less enjoyable to me than the other presses. That is totally a personal taste/preference and not a criticism.

My understanding (please correct me if I'm wrong) is that the 650 comes with a 'case feeder' but not a 'case collator', where the stock setup has you fill a tube with cases and they are automatically loaded in the tray. So after filling the tube, there is one operation (feeding bullets) between lever pulls for 20 rounds. Having spare tubes to load would make refills quick, and a Mini Mr Bullet Feeder for $140 would eliminate any process steps between lever pulls while there are cases in the feed tube. To me, this sounds like an ideal start to a progressive press, and the auto case feeder/collator can be added as a future expense.

I don't understand why you cant run any of these presses (650, Hornady LNL) with just one case at a time.

Hornady LNL is on sale for $400 right now and you get 500 free bullets. But cases are fed manually, no way around that without buying the $230 collator or making your own feeder out of Lee parts and a homemade fixture. I don't want my press to be full of projects just to get it running the way it's designed to be run, so I guess that moves the LNL to the bottom of the list.

One thing I've learned in my 38 years of taking the 'fast track' is that the holes left in the foundation are forever noticed. Recently I have been taking the opposite approach, and while it generally takes more time and money, the process and end result is much more rewarding. 3-4 years ago I would have just bought the 650 from the start, but learned too many lessons the hard way. Especially since we're talking about explosives and ballistics, I'm much less inclined to take that path.

A side note: I read the Lyman Reloading Handbook yesterday and learned that gun powder has some interesting similarities to rocket fuel. I took a class in rocket propulsion where we studied different configurations and combustion performance of solid fuels, and was thinking there might be some relevance when determining powder configuration, burn rate, and fill volume of future reloads. I was pretty excited about reloading when I learned there can be some chemistry involved.

Edited by StraightSh00ter
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The 650 does not come with a casefeeder. It's an additional almost 300 bucks. I opted not to get the casefeeder. I instead bought a 5 dollar piece of pvc pipe and cut bit in half to use as a case feeder. I can fit 75 in one and 60 in the other. The bulletfeeders seem nice but it's not really a big deal to use your free left hand to sit a bullet on the cartridge.

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Joe,

Why don't you stop by this weekend? You can run my 650 and I'll show you all the pros and cons. If nothing else it may prove to not be the way for you to go. I'm pretty familiar with 550 as well.

You are more than welcome to come by. I'll help you all I can if you like

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Maybe I used the wrong terminology - again, please let me know if I'm missing something with all this:

The stock 650 w/caliber conversion comes with case feed tubes (manually filled) and pivot block, and automatically places cases on the shell plate. The 'Casefeeder' is $220 option to automatically fill the case feed tubes.

I think this important. I've read in several places that the 650 shouldn't be bought w/o the casefeeder. This is like hearing "The $560 press is actually useless without spending another $220 on an 'optional' part." In other words, "the 650 press really cost $780"

From Brian's Dillon page:

Although not technically a "drawback," the case feeder for the 650 is optional, meaning add another 180 bucks to the base price of the machine. (Don’t even think of buying a 650 without the casefeeder.)'

I had tossed the 650 from my early list of press options because of the extra $220 casefeeder that was 'required'. But the reality is, the 650 cost $120 more than the 550 and adds auto indexing and an 'automatic shell plate loader' out of the box. That's 2 less things to do between handle pulls.

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Joe,

Why don't you stop by this weekend? You can run my 650 and I'll show you all the pros and cons. If nothing else it may prove to not be the way for you to go. I'm pretty familiar with 550 as well.

You are more than welcome to come by. I'll help you all I can if you like

I would like that! I'll send you an email.

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I personally don't find the 550 very appealing - it seems 'busy' with having to load a case, feed a bullet, and manually turn the disk between each pull of the handle. I understand it's a lot faster doing 4 rounds simultaneously but the process sounds less enjoyable to me than the other presses. That is totally a personal taste/preference and not a criticism.

One of the most important things to learn about reloading is to develop a rhythm and work without distractions. When I first got a 550, it seemed awkward, but after a few hundred rounds I found the rhythm and now feel like I'm a part of the machine.

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I got to see Sarge's 650 yesterday. He's got a pretty nice setup. Having seen a Dillon in person and talked to him a little, I better understand the process, and the 'rhythm' or process steps involved with the 550 and 650. The 550 wouldn't be as bad as I thought considering how compact the machine is and how easy they are to run. But I personally would hold out for the 650.

I like nice stuff, and it's hard not to want a blue (650) press after seeing one. As said around the forum, with someone around to show you the ropes on a 650 it isn't the worst place to start. There is a LOT more feel than I thought there would be, even with all 5 steps going on. You can really feel when a primer isn't seating right, if a case is taking more energy to straighten, etc. But to get there, you need to know and understand a few things which I would never have known without someone showing me.

I spent today looking at powder, primers, and bullets. I came up with a cost of $542.26 for 4000rds. I would have to spend $908.80 to buy that much factory ammo. With a difference of $366.54, that pays for the Lee Turret setup and pretty close to everything else needed to get started. Or I'd have to shoot ~8000rds to offset the cost of a 650.

The Lee is simple and much less expensive. I need to spend a little more time understanding the costs and supply chain. I also don't have brass so I guess I'll re-stock for the next few contests - maybe it makes sense to get the brass handling equipment, and wait on the press until I have over 1000rds of brass. I'll have more money to blow then :)

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I got to see Sarge's 650 yesterday. He's got a pretty nice setup. Having seen a Dillon in person and talked to him a little, I better understand the process, and the 'rhythm' or process steps involved with the 550 and 650. The 550 wouldn't be as bad as I thought considering how compact the machine is and how easy they are to run. But I personally would hold out for the 650.

I like nice stuff, and it's hard not to want a blue (650) press after seeing one. As said around the forum, with someone around to show you the ropes on a 650 it isn't the worst place to start. There is a LOT more feel than I thought there would be, even with all 5 steps going on. You can really feel when a primer isn't seating right, if a case is taking more energy to straighten, etc. But to get there, you need to know and understand a few things which I would never have known without someone showing me.

I spent today looking at powder, primers, and bullets. I came up with a cost of $542.26 for 4000rds. I would have to spend $908.80 to buy that much factory ammo. With a difference of $366.54, that pays for the Lee Turret setup and pretty close to everything else needed to get started. Or I'd have to shoot ~8000rds to offset the cost of a 650.

The Lee is simple and much less expensive. I need to spend a little more time understanding the costs and supply chain. I also don't have brass so I guess I'll re-stock for the next few contests - maybe it makes sense to get the brass handling equipment, and wait on the press until I have over 1000rds of brass. I'll have more money to blow then :)

If you get in the competitive arena, the brass will come and (I find) I have to buy very little now. For 9mm, I am saving about $120 per thousand over Winchester white box and what I am shooting is far superior. I save a lot more on my 223 match rifle rounds per thousand. I bring this up because I kind of assuming you are talking about strictly loading pistol rounds.

If your not shooting just pistol, there are some other things the progressive do well, like power trimming.

And another point as to strictly cost is there are other benefits and it's one of those intangible things. The ammo you make can be bulk uber cheap blasting ammo or it can be custom made ammo to the specs you need. For example the 38 super Open guys can't buy that ammo, they have to make it, same for 9mm major (not advocating for that one), the cowboy action guys shoot really soft loads I think, I shoot 147 gr 9mm at 130 PF for 3 gun and you can't buy that either.

Also (you seem intelligent) I hope you are looking at online prices for your components, if not the price reduction will be more marked. It is hard to match the price of bullets and propellant sourced from online vendors.

I am sure whatever choice you make it will serve you well and it may turn into the first of many presses.

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Yeah there was a lot of online research that went into that figure! :) I looked at a few different places and also looked at bullet weights and what powders to start with (that was for Alliant Power Pistol - Lyman manual says that should be accurate, and it is relatively inexpensive and available). Shipping/Hazmat was included in there too. I will check one or two local places to see if they are competitive.

I know there is more to reloading than cost savings - I'm just looking at how much I need to shell out up front. I will feel better about gradually getting components as opposed to buying the press, equipment, AND powder/bullets/primers all in one shot. But you bring up a good point - that price comparison is against the cheapest ammo I can find online - I keep forgetting about that. Once I've got enough brass to sort, I am expecting to have better accuracy and reliability than the $10.99 boxes.

This is all for 9mm. Once I am reloading and have been shooting for some time, I'll consider getting myself a .40.

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i love how this went from lee press to the .......Moon!!!

get some lee dies, get a single stage or better yet get a turret, a mic, bullet pulller, start making practice rounds. start small get your feet wet... jump in the water is fine.... (i may have a lee hand press in storage)

(maybe someone here has something collecting dust)

(check craigs list) ( i already checked cinncinati craigs list) i'd bet you'd get a decent return on investment when its time to upgrade (but chances are you'll keep it)

when its time to jump in the deep end you'll know and be better off for it by starting small and learning the process, it will all low you to make even more intelligent decisions, not to mention speeding up the learning curve.

the time for action has arrived for you......

with all due respect....... shut up and start loading ( making practice rounds) ....... (respectfully bashing)

"if you spend too much time thinking about a thing you'll never get it done"--- bruce lee

when you get dies and press, mic en route, I will send you a small box of brass and bullets to practice with!!!!!! (this offer expires in 15 days)

(now i'm going back to the reloading)

Edited by biglou13
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If you don't want to wait until you collect 1000 pieces of range brass, you can find a number of people selling 9mm brass on just about every forum. The going rate for 1000 cases is generally about $30-35 so it isn't much of an investment. Once you buy those to start with you can go about picking up the range brass.

Don't forget to check out local gun shows for components. Sometimes you can find powder and primers at decent prices and avoid the hazmat fee and sometimes the stuff is way overpriced.

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Thanks :)

Tumbler, media, scale, and dies are on order. I'm out of ammo - I had to buy a case of that, too :sick:.

I guess at this point I'm just trying to decide between the 'classic' press (cast iron) vs the standard press (aluminum base). If I piece together the pro auto disk + riser, safety prime, and the older aluminum press it's $155 shipped. $185 to substitute the classic press but $199 for the classic kit, so it's either the old press separates or the classic kit. I guess the classic kit has better resale (works for rifle cartridges, has scale, etc).

Edited by StraightSh00ter
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I wouldn't even consider the aluminum base press. In addition to the cast being much stronger, it has a tube that catches all of the spent primers as you pop them out. The aluminum press doesn't so you'll be popping them all over the place. Some people cut a hole in their table and tape or otherwise attach a receptacle underneath to catch them.

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I just went through the same thing as you over the past few months; first time reloader starting on a turret press. Everything I read said to go with the Classic Turret Press. I think the cheaper one is only for pistol calibers? I'll probably start reloading .223 sometime soon so wanted a press that can do that as well. Didn't realize the cheaper one doesn't have the spent primer tube; you definitely want that, it works really well.

If you don't have brass as others said you can buy some for $30-40 per k. You should be able to find brass already cleaned if you don't want to buy the tumbler right away.

In addition to what you mentioned you'll also need a media separator, bullet puller and calipers. I also got a chrono which has been extremely helpful in working up loads, or maybe you can borrow someone's locally.

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Here's a nine minute video of the differences between the Lee standard and classic press. It has quite a few of the differences listed. Also, I believe the diameter of the ram is larger on the classic. Looks like it in the video, but I only have the classic and nothing to compare.

The little plastic square piece that the twisted square rod goes into is a good part to add to your spares list. Easy to replace when the time comes and only a buck or two.

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