mcb Posted June 28, 2015 Share Posted June 28, 2015 (edited) Subject line basically covers it. Why do nearly all new S&W revolvers have the internal hammer locks (excluding only a very few J-frame models) but as I understand it none of the Ruger revolvers come with an internal hammer lock. Both are selling to basically the same markets, aren't they? Is there a market that requires the internal lock that S&W does business in and Ruger does not? Did S&W get sued or some other legal action that required and/or made them over react? With all the negative feelings towards that internal lock from S&W customers there has got to be a pretty good reason for S&W to stay with the lock that is no doubt costing them sales. Maybe revolvers are not a large enough part of the S&W revenue stream any more to care? It just seems there has to be some compelling reasons behind such an unpopular feature. Does a lawyer need to retire before S&W can retire the internal lock? Edited June 28, 2015 by mcb Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seanc Posted June 28, 2015 Share Posted June 28, 2015 The story i heard was that in the early 2000's, essentially, a holding company that sold gun locks purchased S&W. A fallout from that was basically building the lock into the gun as a means for the holding company to incease lock sales...you can't not buy it. The holding company later divested S&W in the late 2k's, but part of that deal was the locks stay in the guns so said lock company makes out after the fact through presumably some kind of license or agreement... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcb Posted June 28, 2015 Author Share Posted June 28, 2015 (edited) Oh that makes sense in a twisted American business way. How many good products get lost, or corrupted due to some onerous business deal? If true I wonder how long S&W will have that monkey on their back. Edited June 28, 2015 by mcb Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aandabooks Posted June 28, 2015 Share Posted June 28, 2015 I always just figured it was because S&W is a Massachusetts (slave state) company and Ruger (free state) company. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnRodriguez Posted June 28, 2015 Share Posted June 28, 2015 Massachusetts gun law. it is one of the reasons all S&W revo's come with a 12.5# + trigger. look up there gun laws, very interesting reading. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Screwball Posted June 28, 2015 Share Posted June 28, 2015 Ruger revolvers have internal locks... just they hide them inside the grip. If you wanted to utilize it, they make an indent in the inside of the grip panel, which you drill out for access. My New Vaquero Convertible has it... not that I'll ever use it. The LCR has that, as well. Just unsure on modification to allow it to be done without pulling the grips. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrDanCheck Posted June 28, 2015 Share Posted June 28, 2015 Its The Communist state of Massachusetts. They also have to have a round indicator on all the guns. Think the hole on the top of the barrels of the bottom feeders. I'm not sure why the revolvers don't have to have them. Especially my New York State assault revolvers with 8 rounds Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
underlug Posted June 28, 2015 Share Posted June 28, 2015 Subject line basically covers it. Why do nearly all new S&W revolvers have the internal hammer locks (excluding only a very few J-frame models) but as I understand it none of the Ruger revolvers come with an internal hammer lock. Both are selling to basically the same markets, aren't they? Is there a market that requires the internal lock that S&W does business in and Ruger does not? Did S&W get sued or some other legal action that required and/or made them over react? With all the negative feelings towards that internal lock from S&W customers there has got to be a pretty good reason for S&W to stay with the lock that is no doubt costing them sales. Maybe revolvers are not a large enough part of the S&W revenue stream any more to care? It just seems there has to be some compelling reasons behind such an unpopular feature. Does a lawyer need to retire before S&W can retire the internal lock? Ruger kissed enough ass with their magazine policy in the late 80s Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bountyhunter Posted June 29, 2015 Share Posted June 29, 2015 Subject line basically covers it. Why do nearly all new S&W revolvers have the internal hammer locks (excluding only a very few J-frame models) but as I understand it none of the Ruger revolvers come with an internal hammer lock. SW caved in and got scared that the government was going to start "regulating" guns so they started putting in lawyer proofing features before they were required. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AusPPC Posted June 29, 2015 Share Posted June 29, 2015 Ruger revolvers have internal locks... just they hide them inside the grip. If you wanted to utilize it, they make an indent in the inside of the grip panel, which you drill out for access. My New Vaquero Convertible has it... not that I'll ever use it. I recently bought a matched pair of SASS Vaquero's, and they did not come with the internal lock. My understanding is that they have now deleted them from the Vaquero line, though earlier ones did have them. The instruction manuals were updated at a particular version number to reflect this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jhgtyre Posted June 29, 2015 Share Posted June 29, 2015 If we keep adding political talk into the mix this thread will be closed without further notice. Larry DrakeThe Moderating Team Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcb Posted June 29, 2015 Author Share Posted June 29, 2015 Ruger revolvers have internal locks... just they hide them inside the grip. If you wanted to utilize it, they make an indent in the inside of the grip panel, which you drill out for access. My New Vaquero Convertible has it... not that I'll ever use it. The LCR has that, as well. Just unsure on modification to allow it to be done without pulling the grips. Interesting, did not know that. I will have to pull the grips off my Ruger Blackhawk convertible and see if it has some sort of lock mechanism in the grip frame. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FWSixgunner Posted June 29, 2015 Share Posted June 29, 2015 Oh that makes sense in a twisted American business way Don't blame us Yanks! It was the British holding company Tomkins that owned S&W and cut the deal with the Clinton Administration (that's not political comment but fact.) and nearly destroyed the company. The stock dropped like a ton of bricks due to consumer backlash. That's what allowed Saf T Hammer to buy it for around 10% of it's pre-political-deal value. It had nothing to do with being in Massachusetts. When Lear-Siegler sold to Tomkins in the late 80s,, they became the third in a series of holding companies that knew nothing about the firearms industry. Ruger made a bid at that time as well. I was not aware Saf T had sold the company and mandated continued use of the locks. The continued inclusion of the locks makes much more sense now. I had always assumed the stock holders were afraid due to the negative publicity. I saw a comment about a 12.5 lb trigger. First, that's not bad for a stock out of the box revolver if it's smooth & doesn't stack. The Bangor Punta guns of 70s were much worse, IMO. The MIM parts are much more consistent. than those "hand fitted" parts the purists pine away for. A lot of hand fitting is code for loose manufacturing tolerances. Second, there probably is no production DA that will have a satisfactory trigger out of the box. They pretty much all need some tuning, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcb Posted June 30, 2015 Author Share Posted June 30, 2015 Ruger revolvers have internal locks... just they hide them inside the grip. If you wanted to utilize it, they make an indent in the inside of the grip panel, which you drill out for access. My New Vaquero Convertible has it... not that I'll ever use it. The LCR has that, as well. Just unsure on modification to allow it to be done without pulling the grips. Interesting, did not know that. I will have to pull the grips off my Ruger Blackhawk convertible and see if it has some sort of lock mechanism in the grip frame. Not that it matters a whole lot but my Ruger Blackhawk Convertable 357/38 to 9mm bough new in early 2003 does not have any hammer lock under the grip. So does that make it worth more? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now