Powder increments lead vs copper

[Peplow530]

I am new to reloading and trying different recipes for different guns. I just got some BBI 135 and 147 gr 9mm, but can't really seem to find much load data for them. Through comparing the different data I have compiled I was able to figure out a load for the 135 (although I haven't chronographed yet). I only loaded 15 of them to test fire, they ran good other than one stovepipe.

So here is my question, If a certain powder called for 3.5gr for a 147 copper bullet and 4.0gr for a 135 copper bullet, would that .5 charge increase also apply to lead? If 3.0gr was used for a 147 lead, could I assume that 3.5 would be needed for a 135 lead? (These numbers are just used as an example).

Edited March 10, 2015 by Peplow530

[noylj]

Never assume.

Start at the lowest starting load you can find and work up--this is the safest way.

If you can't find data, use data for the next heaviest bullet--of the same type (lead for lead/plated and jacketed for jacketed).

Load data in a manual is based ONLY on what they got with their gun and their exact lot numbers of components.

Let's take one example: 135gr vs 147gr bullets using 231/HP38 (as a common powder).

Looking at my compilation, I have one load for 135gr lead bullets: 3.5gr start and 4.5gr MAX. For 147gr, I have start loads ranging from 2.2-3.3gr and MAX loads ranging from 3.5-4.0gr. With only one manual referencing a 135gr lead bullet load, I would tend to start with the 147gr start load. I would rather "waste" some components then find my assumed starting load was actually a MAX or over-MAX with my mix of components.

[Peplow530]

I'm looking for info on 147 gr lead SWC 9mm loaded with CFE Pistol. I guess since CFE is so new there is just not too much info available, I believe they only offer one lead round in their data chart. How on earth do people work up loads for data that isn't out there?

[gng4life]

Are they copper jacketed bullets or copper washed/plated bullets?

Generally, you can use the same load data for lead/coated/plated bullets and true jacketed bullets are a little different.

I saw some CFE loads on here, I'll try looking for them. I worked up some 9Major loads with CFE and it felt like WAC to me. I just like HS6 so sticking with that...anyway, back to searching...

[Peplow530]

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Edited March 11, 2015 by Peplow530

[Peplow530]

Are they copper jacketed bullets or copper washed/plated bullets?

Generally, you can use the same load data for lead/coated/plated bullets and true jacketed bullets are a little different.

I saw some CFE loads on here, I'll try looking for them. I worked up some 9Major loads with CFE and it felt like WAC to me. I just like HS6 so sticking with that...anyway, back to searching...

Thanks fng4life,

I am trying to figure out some loads for BBI coated 135 gr RN and 147 gr SWC 9mm. As for powders have 9 lbs CFE Pistol, 8 lbs Bullseye, 1 lbs Red Dot, 3 lbs Longshot, 2 lbs 800-X, 1 lbs Win 231, 1 lbs SR 7625.

I am trying to work up a good minor competition load so making it happen with CFE or Bullseye would be ideal so I could continue to load them for awhile, although I was planning on using the Bulseye for .45 acp loads. Or if there are any suggestions on major loads with what I have I'm open to that too.

[dauntedfuture]

Loads for lead in general require less powder then a true jacketed bullet. Plated and coated bullets load more like lead then jacketed bullets. If you cant find 135g data for what you want to load then look at 125g and 147g loads, a 135 would be somewhere in the middle. If you start closer to the 147g load you will be on the less powder side.

I would not say that a load with a failure rate of 1 in 15 stovepipe "ran good." Stovepipes can be an indication of many things to include too little powder.

[gng4life]

What firearm are you using? What spring weights are you using? Does it run good with factory ammo?

After researching and reading from others, like most of us probably suspected that the CFE is not that great with heavy bullets and Minor loads. There is usually a trade off between bullet weight and velocity with relation to powders. Most of the time for Minor, you want a heavy bullet with a fast/medium powder. If you use a light bullet, you want a slow powder. One post said that they loaded up CFE with 147 and had a lot of residue. This reminded me of when I loaded up a bunch of 147 with HS6 and tried to run that Minor but had quite a bit of residue. So you can try working up a load with CFE and the 147 but it might have a lot of unburned powder and/or residue. I have heard of using Magnum or Rifle primers to burn the powder better in loads like this but that's just a band-aid, I wouldn't recommend this. The 135 might be a better fit since it's a mid weight and you can run the charge up some. There were some loads with a 125 at 4.4 of CFE so if you started around 3.8-4.0, it should be a good point to figure out where you need to load. My Major rounds were with a MG 124 JHP loaded between 6.6 - 7.4 and I got up to 180 PF with very little pressure signs. The dot moved a lot so it's not ideal for me but it would work if needed.

In response to your original question, powder charges and velocities are not linear so no, it's not a general rule that you can apply linear type increments for powder charges. Some peak much faster than others and they react differently as pressure rises. Like it was mentioned, don't ever assume with reloading. It's generally safe but that's only as good as the operation. Always start low and work up slow with a chronograph watching for pressure signs and problems .

Let us know how it works out...

[Peplow530]

Thanks for the info You helped kind of answer my question. And for the record I was only asking about comparing one powder to different bullets, not one powder to another powder.