EngineerEli Posted January 31, 2015 Share Posted January 31, 2015 (edited) Hey all, I've been eying the Diamondback Full Size 9mm for some time now. It seemed to be a 9mm polymer pistol that had the slide of a Glock, grip of an M&P, and the fire control group from an XDM. It supposedly fit in glock holsters, utilized glock sights, and Beretta magazines. Diamondback took what they wanted from all over the industry and mixed it all in to one pretty interesting pistol. Best of all i was able to get one for $253 USD shipped! At this point, no, It is not on the approved production gun list. But I have sent emails to the manufacturer, as well as a few of the major retailers which have contacted the manufacturer on my behalf. I may try competing with the gun in some unofficial matches to see what i think and keep my fingers crossed about official USPSA approval. I brought it home from the FFL last night and here are my thoughts, which are for the most part very positive! Haven't shot it yet though so this is very preliminary. Initial Impressions: Taking my first look at the hard case the gun comes in at the gun shop one of the clips had broken all the way off and the other was hanging on by a little tab. I opened the box and took out the gun, i found the rear sight was so loose in the gun i could slide it by hand almost a half of an inch side to side. When i got home i found the set screw was just completely loose. At first look its a good looking gun. The texturing on the grip is a little cheesy but i plan to stipple it anyway. It is not quite aggressive enough for competition. The slide has very nice clean role marks, or possibly cnc wording. The cocking serrations are very sharp like on my STI's which i love! The trigger and reset felt pretty good out of the box, a little on the heavy side but not a bad starting place I plan to do a full polish and trigger job on the pistol. The gun also has the nice low bore axis of a Glock so I'm exited to shooting it and see how its 24.8 OZ handles recoil. That was on my scale though, for some reason the company advertises the gun as 21.5 OZ... Materials: I went through the whole gun with a magnet. Impressively almost everything on the gun is "metal" (magnetic) including the trigger, guide rod, and even the striker retaining plate on the back of the slide. There were two surprises though. First of all the middle set of longer slide rails and the whole metal block that the trigger is mounted in, is not magnetic and by the look of it looks like anodized aluminum, this surprised me, but i could be wrong... Also the rear section of the frame rails where the fire control group is mounted is all just part of the plastic grip. We will have to see how that all holds up. The slide is advertized and melonited stainless (like the M&P) and the barrel is mellonited ChroMolly of some sort. Features/Design: I found out at the last moment that there were apparently two versions of the gun. The first that came out came with novak sights and used a front sight dovetail, that many have said does not work well and was proprietary, so you were basically screwed. The later guns used the standard Gock style pin with a screw underneath front sight, luckily that is what I ended up with. I also want to talk about the trigger system. It is literally the simplest thing i have ever see which i very much like. The trigger bar simply has a notch on it that pulls forward a tab on the lower leg of the sear which releases the striker, as the slide recoils it pushes the trigger bar down which disconnects the striker, then when you release the trigger the bar pops back up and resets. That probably made no sense to anyone but myself, lol. Ergonomics: The grip is surprisingly pretty large, but for my medium sized hands is very comfortable and trigger placement is pretty good. The trigger reach could be a tad farther, but it is still much better than something like a single action pull from a CZ SP-01 which i feel is very short, you end up having to pull the trigger with the tip of your finger. By comparison it is actually larger than my 2011 grips, ans is it larger than the medium back and large side panels on my HK P30. It's been a while since I have handled one, but I feel like the grip feel is similar to that of a large frame EAA/Tanfoglio. In the end of the day I got this gun just to play around with. Stipple the grip, play with making holsters work, making magazines work, doing a trigger job, and it was all just so cheap! Have to go for now, but I took lots of pictures last night so I hope to post some later today or tomorrow! Sorry i was in a rush I'll try to come back later and spell check! Edited February 1, 2015 by EngineerEli Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PKT1106 Posted January 31, 2015 Share Posted January 31, 2015 Did you send an email to the company with the application for NROI approval or contact DNROI? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EngineerEli Posted January 31, 2015 Author Share Posted January 31, 2015 Did you send an email to the company with the application for NROI approval or contact DNROI? Yea, I sent a link and contact info. Haven't heard anything back from Diamondback yet... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EngineerEli Posted February 1, 2015 Author Share Posted February 1, 2015 (edited) Out of the box: Edited February 1, 2015 by EngineerEli Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B45C22 Posted February 2, 2015 Share Posted February 2, 2015 I read a review that really bashed this gun based upon accuracy. They claimed that the barrel floated around in the slide quite a bit when it was supposed to be locked up. Have you fired it for groups yet? I really do like the ergonomics of the gun, but that accuracy blurb scared me off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EngineerEli Posted February 2, 2015 Author Share Posted February 2, 2015 I read a review that really bashed this gun based upon accuracy. They claimed that the barrel floated around in the slide quite a bit when it was supposed to be locked up. Have you fired it for groups yet? I really do like the ergonomics of the gun, but that accuracy blurb scared me off. I had read that too. Mine is actually pretty tight, yet I have not shot it yet. I read some other reviews that said the accuracy was as good as anything else out there. I'm not sure if it is a quality control issue, or if some of the earlier guns, which many of the previous reviews have been using were not made as well as the current production parts. I have been pretty impressed with the manufacturing quality of the gun. Of course there are some machine marks here and there, but for the most part nothing that causes functional problems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EngineerEli Posted February 2, 2015 Author Share Posted February 2, 2015 Did a preliminary trigger polish job tonight. Honestly stock it wasn't bad at all. It is such a simple system, I really like it. It started out around 6.5 lbs, and after my polish job it dropped to about 5.5 lbs. The break is pretty good and reset isn't bad either. I basically just stoned and polished the striker and sear contact surfaces. As it is right now, you can watch the striker indicator as you pull the trigger and it does move rearward ever so slightly when pulling the trigger. Technically not a single action, but if you were to re-shape the sear, you could make it more of a single action set up. I am also researching replacement sear springs. I have found some on McMaster-Carr, but does anyone know what weight most stock, or competition sear springs are for striker fired guns? I took a ton more pictures if anyone wants to see anything in particular, let me know. Here is pictures of how everything breaks down: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmiller Posted February 2, 2015 Share Posted February 2, 2015 Please go shoot the damned thing:). I would love to know what kind of accuracy you are getting. BJ Norris did a review , if I recall correctly, it did not have great accuracy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EngineerEli Posted February 2, 2015 Author Share Posted February 2, 2015 I'm trying to, maybe tomorrow or Wednesday night! Yesterday I was lucky to get out to the grocery store. We got about 16 inches of snow in the last 36 hours here in the Chicago area! The 2015 SNOWMAGEDDON! (that didn't fizzle out) I forgot to say too, it has a 4.75" barrel, so your velocity/sight radius should be as good or better than all the SP01, and tanfo guns with 4.5" barrels. Yes accuracy is still in question, but I'll let you all know asap. BTW: If anyone has any stock Glock sights sitting around that they don't use, I would love to compare them to what came on it and confirm if I can indeed use aftermarket ones (like the Dawsons) on this gun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EngineerEli Posted February 2, 2015 Author Share Posted February 2, 2015 Just though I would update people, I just got off the phone with Diamondback's customer service, and they were surprisingly helpful and friendly, that is always a benefit to a gun owner. I was asking about the 4 packs of magazines they offer for 75 bucks, but they are out of stock for the next 6-8 weeks, so so much for that... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EngineerEli Posted February 3, 2015 Author Share Posted February 3, 2015 Last night I completed tearing the rest of the gun down. I pulled out the whole trigger, bar, and slide lock assembly. While out I polished the trigger bar, and filed back the notch that catches on the sear. This moved the trigger break point rearward slightly. By doing this the over travel was greatly reduced, and for a reason I can not quite understand the reset seams shorter! I also polished the plunger that pushes up on the bottom of the trigger bar just to make sure things were nice and smooth. I plan to go to the range tonight to see how she does **If anyone chooses to make these modifications themselves, do so at your own risk. Go very slowly and put everything back together frequently and check for function. If you go too far you WILL have to replace parts!!!** ATTENTION FOR DB9FS OWNERS: Pull the trigger pin our after removing the roll pins and main block with the slide rails. I though the trigger pin had to be removed first and when I did so, the trigger spring just fell out, after removing the two roll pins for the slide rail block and removing it, I could not be certain of how to put the trigger spring back in. If anyone would be willing to tear their gun down to this level, but not remove the trigger, and post a picture that would be great. I'll post pictures of the way I put it back in, but something about it just doesn't seem right, though it does seem to function as it did before... YouTube Video of Trigger Break and Reset: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
e-mishka Posted February 3, 2015 Share Posted February 3, 2015 Eli, how did you managed to get approval from the wife to buy a new gun? Bring it to Alpha on Wednesday for some testing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EngineerEli Posted February 3, 2015 Author Share Posted February 3, 2015 Oh... Its been in the safe for years... I just never shot it much... I'll bring it tomorrow. I am truly surprised at how much i like it for a $250 gun! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azrockcrawler Posted February 4, 2015 Share Posted February 4, 2015 (edited) My DB9FS was one of the early versions with the Novak style sights. It was a very inconsistent shooter with lots of strange fliers, after several outings I was on the fence about selling it. Pretty much assumed it was the Glock style trigger which I am not very good at manipulating. I put the gun a way and continued practicing. Both my wife and I have gotten to be really good shots with a SA trigger and can easily work our way down a dueling tree with my go to range guns: Witness Match, CZ P09 or Taurus PT111. Fast forward over a year: I pulled the DB9FS out of the safe last November figuring I'd give it a go again but had the same results - lots of fliers and horrible grouping no matter who shot it. At this point I noticed my DB9FS had the sloppiest slide to frame fit of any gun in my safe. You could shake the gun up and down and feel the slide moving. I got out some feeler gages and determined at rest there was a .020" gap between the slide and frame at the side of the muzzle. You could pull the slide /frame apart and increase the gap another .015" or push them together and eliminate the gap. So essentially the front sight could move .035" up down which totally explains our poor shooting which was mostly from a draw using a shot timer. DB tech support was pretty useless IMO. Their answer was that is was a mass produced gun and that they could not adjust the slide/frame gap. After more pushing he said he didn't think it was a warranty issue but I could send it in on my dime and they would look at it. Not wanting to sell this to someone else I bit the bullet and shipped the gun off ($75 for FedEx overnight). With these guns now selling for around $250 I was really questioning my decision. When I got the gun back about 5 weeks later it had a new slide on it with the Glock style sights. The guide rod/spring assembly and barrel were also replaced and looked different than what the original had. Frame to slide fit was now really good, almost no movement up/down, not as tight as my P09 but better than my PT111. Proof was in the groupings, first mag thru the new gun resulted in a 5" group at 15 yards with all projectiles on paper. I felt really good about that considering how little I shoot that style trigger. I went ahead and ordered some extra mags the next day and the pistol is now in our shooting rotation. It is fun to shoot, feels light and pointable when moving if that makes sense. Just wish I had gotten a good one from the start. Cliff notes - I suspect the slides with the Novak style sights are pre-production or first run. I wouldn't buy one unless you can check the slide/frame fit in person. Edited February 4, 2015 by Azrockcrawler Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EngineerEli Posted February 7, 2015 Author Share Posted February 7, 2015 Range Trip: So I made it to the range Tuesday and put about 150 rds through it. I shot a few rounds through it at my Wed match too. Didn't compete with it though. I also had everyone take a look at it, with mixed reviews. All ammo shot was minor PF 124 gr hand loads with coated lead bullets. The Good: It seems to shoot really well, it is still very comfortable and recoil is very tame, even though the gun is super light. It fed completely reliably. It's very easy to chamber rounds with the sizable slide serrations. The factory sights actually were not bad either, front post is pretty wide though and the dot is pretty big. The Bad: I did have 4 light strikes... Every round that didn't go off though, did go off after trying it again. It seems there is something with the firing pin block that is hanging up. I'm hoping if I go back and polish up the firing pin block and firing pin, the problem will go away. The ejection is quite erratic. Rounds went up left and right, some only 3-4 inches some a few feet. I may have to look at the profile of the ejector. I also had 2 instances where the gun locked back on the last round but somehow the case didn't make it out of the gun, it is out of the chamber but just resting on top of the magazine, not sure what is up with that. Extractor tension seems fine, and I polished and beveled the bottom a bit which may have contributed to the feeding reliability. The accuracy is still in question. At 35 ft, the best groups I was getting was something like 5-6 inches. The barrel lockup and slide to frame fit seems pretty good so I'm not sure where the issue is coming from. I tried the same ammo out of my STI and I was able to get about 3" groups. After thought: While the bad list is way longer than the good, I still don't think its terrible. I do need to continue evaluating the accuracy that could be the biggest issue. Compatibility: While at the gun shop/range I did some research of compatibility. I tried putting the gun in a few holsters. Glock 17 holsters are almost the same profile but the issue is the huge rail on the bottom of the dust cover. For that reason, the only holsters it would fit into was leather or hybrid holsters... I have been trying it in other holsters too. The profile looked similar to the Sig 250/320 and while it seems to be, the trigger guard is wider on the DB9FS so it wont fit. It actually came close to fitting loosely into my HK P30 holster but the P30 has a tapered trigger guard that gets narrower as you go forward, so it doesn't quite seat all the way down, but it does cover most of the trigger guard. I found the profile of the guide rod is identical to the 4.5" M&P 45. I am considering getting one of the weighted ones for an M&P Pro which has the same base, but I will just have to shorten it a about 3/8" of an inch. I got a Beretta 92 magazine and compared it to the one that came with the gun, and it looks compatible but I haven't had a chance to re cut the slot. It fits up in the gun, and the base pads are cross compatible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EngineerEli Posted February 8, 2015 Author Share Posted February 8, 2015 (edited) Quick video from the first range trip: Edited February 8, 2015 by EngineerEli Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EngineerEli Posted February 10, 2015 Author Share Posted February 10, 2015 (edited) Update on holsters - I have contacted both Bladetech and Comptac about holster availability, and they both replied nicely that they have nothing for me that they could guarantee me would work. I have a friend I shoot with who makes his own kydex holsters and pouches, so I may see if I can get an instructional session in exchange for a case of beer or something. My only other option at this point would be a leather Glock holster. Edited February 10, 2015 by EngineerEli Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EngineerEli Posted February 11, 2015 Author Share Posted February 11, 2015 So I may have found a holster that could work. Glock used to make their G 21SF with a full piccitany rail. The rail area is where the normal Glock holsters had issues, so this could work... I also found a place that does free shipping and free return shipping, so if it doesn't work, no loss. Also want to get my hands on a plastic magazine baseplate for an 18 rd CZ SP01 magazine. Supposedly people use Beretta basepads on their CZ magazines, so if that is the case, CZ basepads should fit on the Beretta magazines that work with the DB9FS. Could work to fill the gap between the grip and the normal Beretta 92FS mags. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azrockcrawler Posted February 12, 2015 Share Posted February 12, 2015 Beretta mags don't work without cutting a new slot, I scrapped one mag by being slightly off with the slot cut. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EngineerEli Posted February 12, 2015 Author Share Posted February 12, 2015 Thanks for the heads up, but I was aware of that. I feel comfortable cutting and filing a little on the mags. I don't have any Beretta I need to keep the mags cross compatible with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EngineerEli Posted March 3, 2015 Author Share Posted March 3, 2015 Interestingly my magazine that came with the gun actuall holds 16 rds and cycles no problem I actually bought a Beretta magazine to test and all the parts are interchangeable, basepads springs followers, except for the magazine catch of course. I did notice that the DB magazine has a 9 coil spring where the Beretta has an 11 coil spring which would explain why some people complain about the db magazines being too stiff near the bottom. Not an issue for me though. I'm used to loading my 20rd .40 cal SVI magazines by hand with no problems.I also borrowed the CZ basepad i was talking about from a friend at a match recently, and put it on the DB tube. It fits on the tube no problem. The problem is though that there is about a 1mm gap between the bottom of the grip and the pasepad. This allows the mag to swivel forwards and back a bit. Not a deal breaker but the front part of it where your pinky would rest is also about 2-3mm further back meaning there is a big ledge where the grip ends, then for your pinky to rest there is has to be unnaturally far back. May not be a deal breaker if it doesn't bug you but it did me. I did not get the chance to try firing the gun with the magazine with that basepad. I ended up just ordering 4 magazines directly through DB. They are only $25 a piece and the one I have has worked no problem so far. If one fails on me, Ill buy a new mecgar Beretta mag and use the tube spring and follower with the DB basepad. That would be the best of both worlds. Not sure if DB will sell the basepads by themselves but if they did that would also be an option to use with the Beretta magazines with modified slots. I can post pictures if it would help anyone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EngineerEli Posted March 3, 2015 Author Share Posted March 3, 2015 Also I got that G 21SF with a full piccitany rail holster from blade tech and it was so close to fitting, if I loosened up the holster a bunch the gun would go in and actually click pretty well, with some retention. Problem was because it was a g21 holster the slide is taller and wider so there was a bunch of extra space at the top of the holster that kept it from sliding in and out right. You had to slide it in with the top of the slide touching the holster then push the gun backwards to latch onto the trigger guard. Just seemed a little too far off, so that got sent back. Took pictures before I sent it if anyone needs visual proof. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EngineerEli Posted March 11, 2015 Author Share Posted March 11, 2015 Interestingly my magazine that came with the gun actuall holds 16 rds and cycles no problem I actually bought a Beretta magazine to test and all the parts are interchangeable, basepads springs followers, except for the magazine catch of course. I did notice that the DB magazine has a 9 coil spring where the Beretta has an 11 coil spring which would explain why some people complain about the db magazines being too stiff near the bottom. Not an issue for me though. I'm used to loading my 20rd .40 cal SVI magazines by hand with no problems. So I received my 4 additional magazines directly from DB. Turns out these ones they sent are ACT-MAG brand and blued, in contrast to the one that came with the gun which is a Checkmate magazine which has a dry film lubricant and I am pretty happy with. I am also now seeing why people were complaining about the mags being hard to load. They new ACT mags have 14 coil springs which seems like a lot! They are very tight mags. I will try loading and unloading them, and shooting them a few times, but part of me wants to just snip one coil off to make everything easier. I know this would technically increase the spring rate, but it would decrease the preload which is the biggest problem. At natural length the springs stick out of the mag tubes something like 4 inches, and about 4 coils, this seems excessive to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
racingjoe27 Posted April 19, 2015 Share Posted April 19, 2015 I had high hopes for this $250 gun. I thought it could be a good loaner for when I convince friends to go to a match. Gun is cheap and mags are cheap, heck I was contemplating campaigning one myself. Just doesn't seem reliable enough to game with, or reliable enough for a shooter that's new to the sport to safely participate with Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PD2BP253 Posted April 22, 2015 Share Posted April 22, 2015 Interestingly my magazine that came with the gun actuall holds 16 rds and cycles no problem I actually bought a Beretta magazine to test and all the parts are interchangeable, basepads springs followers, except for the magazine catch of course. I did notice that the DB magazine has a 9 coil spring where the Beretta has an 11 coil spring which would explain why some people complain about the db magazines being too stiff near the bottom. Not an issue for me though. I'm used to loading my 20rd .40 cal SVI magazines by hand with no problems. I also borrowed the CZ basepad i was talking about from a friend at a match recently, and put it on the DB tube. It fits on the tube no problem. The problem is though that there is about a 1mm gap between the bottom of the grip and the pasepad. This allows the mag to swivel forwards and back a bit. Not a deal breaker but the front part of it where your pinky would rest is also about 2-3mm further back meaning there is a big ledge where the grip ends, then for your pinky to rest there is has to be unnaturally far back. May not be a deal breaker if it doesn't bug you but it did me. I did not get the chance to try firing the gun with the magazine with that basepad. I ended up just ordering 4 magazines directly through DB. They are only $25 a piece and the one I have has worked no problem so far. If one fails on me, Ill buy a new mecgar Beretta mag and use the tube spring and follower with the DB basepad. That would be the best of both worlds. Not sure if DB will sell the basepads by themselves but if they did that would also be an option to use with the Beretta magazines with modified slots. I can post pictures if it would help anyone. I'm pretty interested in pics, post em if you got em'.... I think a standard M9 mag with the catch notch cut would work well... The low mag capacity is what has kept me away from purchasing a DB FS9 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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