Jump to content
Brian Enos's Forums... Maku mozo!

Fix for Shaving Lead Bullets


HOGRIDER

Recommended Posts

SISIG:

I'd think it would certainly be worth a try as it isn't very expensive and i think it would be helpful if you load lead or coated bullets.

It's $39 but shipping from Netherland is $65. In the US, no online store carries it. MidWayUSA has it backordered for about 6 months already.

Would really wanna try this but so hard to get one.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Replies 73
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

Previous time I shot, the "leading" was the whole length of the barrel. About 3/4 of the way down there were literally thing strings of lead hanging down. I shot IDPA yesterday and received several comments on the lube pelting the targets :). I shot out the rest of my .357, and have not cleaned that barrel yet. If I see the strings again, I'll try to capture a pic.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I loaded up some coated 9mm last weekend and I was getting some shaving if the bullet was not sitting straight enough when ran up the seating die.

I just adjusted the powder funnel die down a little bit to get a touch more bell. After that adjustment, no more issues.

This was with the factory Dillon powder funnel.

What are the negatives to that, and why should I spend $40-50 on a new whiz-bang powder funnel?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 1 month later...

I got the MBF/DAA funnels a couple weeks ago. It has some advantages over the stock Dillon funnel, but it did not stop the lead shaving issue.

What it helps is a better bell to manually seat the bullets. The bullets just go in so much easier with the MBF/DAA funnels, while with the stock Dillon funnel, most times I have to hold the bullets with one hand as I seat them, even when the bell mouth is already pretty big, 1/2 inch down the brass wall.

The MBF/DAA funnels, however, is very short, compared to the stock Dillon funnel. The problem with that is you cannot really make the bell go big enough even when you turn the expander die all the way down. The most bell you can get with MBF/DAA funnels on SDB is about 1/3 inch down the brass wall. As a result of that, the lead shaving issue still exists.

The real fix is to use Dillon funnel and just make a huge bell mouth.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I got the MBF/DAA funnels a couple weeks ago. It has some advantages over the stock Dillon funnel, but it did not stop the lead shaving issue.

What it helps is a better bell to manually seat the bullets. The bullets just go in so much easier with the MBF/DAA funnels, while with the stock Dillon funnel, most times I have to hold the bullets with one hand as I seat them, even when the bell mouth is already pretty big, 1/2 inch down the brass wall.

The MBF/DAA funnels, however, is very short, compared to the stock Dillon funnel. The problem with that is you cannot really make the bell go big enough even when you turn the expander die all the way down. The most bell you can get with MBF/DAA funnels on SDB is about 1/3 inch down the brass wall. As a result of that, the lead shaving issue still exists.

The real fix is to use Dillon funnel and just make a huge bell mouth.

Sounds like you are using an extremely large amount of bell.

I've loaded a lot of Bayou lead bullets, and had some shaving issues in the beginning, too... Holding the bullet straight while seating it helps... Using a Redding Competition seating die helps... Make sure the inside ridge of the cases aren't sharp... Sometimes you need to use a deburring tool to get rid of the sharp edges...

I'm using an MBF funnel and bell the case to .381 measured on the outside of the opening... What size bell are you using?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The MBF/DAA funnels, however, is very short, compared to the stock Dillon funnel. The problem with that is you cannot really make the bell go big enough even when you turn the expander die all the way down. The most bell you can get with MBF/DAA funnels on SDB is about 1/3 inch down the brass wall. As a result of that, the lead shaving issue still exists.

The real fix is to use Dillon funnel and just make a huge bell mouth.

Not sure how your figuring the MBF funnels are "very short".......

Just measured my .45acp funnels, and the results:

Dillon: 2.722" OAL

MBF: 2.850" OAL

Not able to measure the 9mm funnels as I've got the XL650 currently set up to load 147g Montana Gold CMJ, 135g and 147g Bayou Coated without changing the height of the MBF funnel/powder measure. I feel confident that with this much die height still left, I could easily over-bell any case at will:

MBF-9mm_zps4bmnla3d.jpg

Just not seeing how the MBF funnel is unable to "bell" a case mouth as much as the Dillon:

DAA%2045%20funnel_zpsjz1qivft.jpg

Edited by HOGRIDER
Link to comment
Share on other sites

The MBF/DAA funnels, however, is very short, compared to the stock Dillon funnel. The problem with that is you cannot really make the bell go big enough even when you turn the expander die all the way down. The most bell you can get with MBF/DAA funnels on SDB is about 1/3 inch down the brass wall. As a result of that, the lead shaving issue still exists.

The real fix is to use Dillon funnel and just make a huge bell mouth.

Not sure how your figuring the MBF funnels are "very short".......

Just measured my .45acp funnels, and the results:

Dillon: 2.722" OAL

MBF: 2.850" OAL

Not able to measure the 9mm funnels as I've got the XL650 currently set up to load 147g Montana Gold CMJ, 135g and 147g Bayou Coated without changing the height of the MBF funnel/powder measure. I feel confident that with this much die height still left, I could easily over-bell any case at will:

Just not seeing how the MBF funnel is unable to "bell" a case mouth as much as the Dillon:

I was too lazy to take pictures when I first received it. My fault.

However, you were using 45 funnel to assume 9mm is the same. Your fault.

Just took it apart and took the pic.

On the left it shows I have to turn my expander die all the way into the press to get even decent bell.

On the right you can see the comparison of the MBF funnel side by side with the Dillon stock funnel. You can easily tell which one is shorter.

post-56818-0-39113200-1431995299_thumb.j

Edited by MilkMyDuds
Link to comment
Share on other sites

The MBF/DAA funnels, however, is very short, compared to the stock Dillon funnel. The problem with that is you cannot really make the bell go big enough even when you turn the expander die all the way down. The most bell you can get with MBF/DAA funnels on SDB is about 1/3 inch down the brass wall. As a result of that, the lead shaving issue still exists.

The real fix is to use Dillon funnel and just make a huge bell mouth.

Not sure how your figuring the MBF funnels are "very short".......

Just measured my .45acp funnels, and the results:

Dillon: 2.722" OAL

MBF: 2.850" OAL

Not able to measure the 9mm funnels as I've got the XL650 currently set up to load 147g Montana Gold CMJ, 135g and 147g Bayou Coated without changing the height of the MBF funnel/powder measure. I feel confident that with this much die height still left, I could easily over-bell any case at will:

Just not seeing how the MBF funnel is unable to "bell" a case mouth as much as the Dillon:

I was too lazy to take pictures when I first received it. My fault.

However, you were using 45 funnel to assume 9mm is the same. Your fault.

Just took it apart and took the pic.

On the left it shows I have to turn my expander die all the way into the press to get even decent bell.

On the right you can see the comparison of the MBF funnel side by side with the Dillon stock funnel. You can easily tell which one is shorter.

No, I was not assuming the 9mm is same length as .45acp. I fully realize the 9mm MBF is shorter than the Dillon; however I was not prepared to remove the 9mm funnel for comparison. Just happened to have the .45acp funnels handy to give some comparison that not "all" MBF funnels are shorter than the Dillon's

So, I showed the pic of the 9mm die, which on MY XL650, allows all the bell/adjustment I need to successfully seat fmj or coated/lead without any scraping. My original post speaks for itself in 9mm.

Of course, YMMV.......

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I saw your pic has "0.45" on the Dillon funnel. Mine did not.

Yours are Dillon dies, while mine is SDB built-in die, though the funnel is removable. I think that's the difference. The Dillon funnel with non-SDB dies is probably shorter, while the Dillon funnel with SDB die is longer fore sure.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I saw your pic has "0.45" on the Dillon funnel. Mine did not.

Yours are Dillon dies, while mine is SDB built-in die, though the funnel is removable. I think that's the difference. The Dillon funnel with non-SDB dies is probably shorter, while the Dillon funnel with SDB die is longer fore sure.

Milk: As I'm not at all familiar with the SDB setup, I decided to pull the MBF 9mm funnel for a direct comparison with the stock Dillon funnel; and maybe help clear things up for others considering the MBF.

Note in the .45acp pic above, the Dillon funnel is on the left and the MBF is on the right with the marking. Dillon uses a letter to designate their funnels; at least for the 550/650 series.

Here's a side by side pic of the 9mm funnels; with the Dillon "F" on the left and the MBF 9mm on the right:

MBF%209mm%20Funnel_zpst4b6rvzn.jpg

I pulled out the calipers and measured the OAL of the two funnels.

Dillon: 2.870"

MBF: 2.612"

So, yes the MBF is .158" shorter than the Dillon; which is just a tad over 5/32". In my experience, this shorter length has not been an issue whatsoever.

HTH's

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I also tried the DAA funnel in my square deal and found that because of the design of the press and expander die it doesn't allow the DAA funnel to do it's job as intended. I went back to using the Dillon funnel, but now I put more of a flare in the case, and I'm more careful about lining up the bullets, especially the Bayou bullets. I certainly have to go slower with the Bayous. Cast lead isn't so much of a problem, and I crank them out as fast as I can go.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Not to beat a dead horse, but I'll throw in my +1 for the MBF funnel. I started a thread in the .45 subforum about shaving problems with my first attempt at loading coated bullets. I followed everyone's advice, got the MBF, and it worked. I'm going to order one for 9mm as well.

Seems like it would be a pretty simple change/upgrade for Dillon to make on their end, for a pretty significant improvement on the customer's end.

edit: I'm on a 550b

Edited by rev1911
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Haven't had the first problem with my Dillon funnels and coated bullets.

I load .45, .40., and 9mm and have had no shaving and am putting an almost undetectable flare on the cases.

I was loading .40 tonight and pulled the first four bullets to check the crimp and could not tell the pulled bullets from the ones in the box.

I also set my crimp so it doesn't leave any mark on the coating.

Two SDB's and a 650 I haven't even used yet.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I noticed something interesting when lead shaving happens.

I load the Bayou flat nose, and I can easily see the the circle imprint on the flat surface of the bullet nose tip, supposedly caused by the seating die when pressing down. What's interesting is for the ones that have lead shaving issue, this circle imprint is not in the center of the bullet nose tip. The ones which do not have shaving issue usually get this imprint very close to center.

This leads me to think the lead shaving issue is mostly concentricity issue - e.g. when the seating die is tilt, or maybe the base plate of the press is tilt. I have been extremely careful in placing the bullets in the dead center of the brass mouth. That did not help. In stead, I found that if I place the bullets slightly tilt towards me, the lead shaving stops. This implies either my seating die is not level, or the plate is not level on the SDB. Indeed, when I used the bubble level, I can verify my bench is level and the press base plate is also level. That leaves only a deformed, or defective?, seating die on my SDB.

BTW - just to be clear, I am using the flat nose seating die for SDB, not the round nose one.

Edited by MilkMyDuds
Link to comment
Share on other sites

i use the round nose and out of the last 1k loaded i only had 2 misshaps that occurred when the brass was shorter than the ones i used to setup the press and i didn't get a good bell. i bell to one size larger than the base of the bullet.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 1 month later...

I apologize for bumping an older thread, but thought another data point on this issue might be worth it.

I installed a DAA MBF funnel and it fixed my lead shaving issues with BBI bullets.

Thanks for the tips, everyone.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now



×
×
  • Create New...