Rock Island Hi Cap pistols

[chomorro]

The tinkerer in me wonders if you could polish the feed ramp and tube the mag lips to get it to run reliably with that 9lb spring. 
 
Is the muzzle nose diving with the 12lb spring? Tuning the spring is important for function, safety, and reliability (and longevity), but is also an important part of tuning the behavior for good return to zero...

Watched some videos and it seems. I need to watch for nose dive and also trim my recoil springs so the slide doesnt short stroke.

Looks like another trip to the range

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[OnVacation]

20 minutes ago, chomorro said:

trim my recoil springs so the slide doesnt short stroke.

You only need to trim if you are experiencing spring bind. You can check that by putting some clay inside the frame where the slide bottoms and check for contact. If it is bottoming then you aren't experiencing spring bind. If you're experiencing bind and have a shok buff you can remove that too. 

 

The videos by atlas are really good, as are the build videos by mosinvirus. There are some really good build videos on youtube still, time well invested...

[vinconco]

On 5/9/2020 at 2:28 AM, cheapskate said:

Quick question I got a aftec extractor for my 9mm hi cap do I  need to use both springs if I only use one front hole or  the rear?

 

One spring.   

The OEM extractor failed on mine at about 5k rounds. and I replaced it with the Aftec.  Two springs was too tight in mine and one was just right.

I think I put the spring in the rear hole.

[chomorro]

I was thinking about filing the Sharp edges of my safety and just using a blueing pen to cover it up.

I removed the safety and noticed it doesnt have the piece that sticks out on the right side to go under the grip. When you guys replace the factory ambi with another one are you filing that piece off? Or is there a version that drops in?

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[thormx538]

The sear pin has a little notch in it that the safety gets captured by. You pull the left side out first, then rotate the right side up and out of the notch of the sear pin and remove it.

 

I actually like that method more than the ones that are captured by the grips.

[Joe4d]

and that took me awhile to figure out, and getting back in was even worse. The pin has to be roatated around to just the right spot to get it back together. whole assembly is getting chucked on mine. Got wilson combat extended single side coming, as well as new springs and trigger parts, probably replace the extractor soon as well.
Reading this thread it just occurred to me how long ago I ordered parts from Brownell's and they still arnt here. Be glad when the world gets back to normal.

[chomorro]

The sear pin has a little notch in it that the safety gets captured by. You pull the left side out first, then rotate the right side up and out of the notch of the sear pin and remove it.
 
I actually like that method more than the ones that are captured by the grips.

Wasnt took hard to take apart and get back together but do you cut off that extensions on the second picture so it will fit the RIA? Or is there a vendor who makes an ambi safety that does not include that section.

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[thormx538]

1 hour ago, chomorro said:

Wasnt took hard to take apart and get back together but do you cut off that extensions on the second picture so it will fit the RIA? Or is there a vendor who makes an ambi safety that does not include that section.

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Not sure on whether or not anyone makes safeties with that retainer style.

 

If not, I would just replace the sear pin with a standard one (or modify yours) and then add the notch to the back of the right side grip to capture it. I think you'd have a easier time with that versus trying to retrofit a right side safety designed to be retained by the grip to be retained by the extended sear pin.

[matteekay]

I found it was easier to reshape my existing safeties than to retrofit one that's retained in a different manner.

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[Styro]

I bought a 22 TCM/9mm from them but only after finding out that gun was sold in a double-stack version :((

[chomorro]

I found it was easier to reshape my existing safeties than to retrofit one that's retained in a different manner.

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I'm thinking I might try this. Just use my file and blueing pen. Hopefully it doesnt look horrible.

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[matteekay]

I used diamond-impregnated rubber bits on my dremel. Just enough to knock down the sharpest areas (the corner and the top of the ridges).

[JayB059]

On 5/6/2020 at 12:29 AM, chomorro said:

Kind of irritated. Read this whole thread watched the videos and searched as much as possible and made the purchase on the dawson posilock mag release drilled and tapped. Even stated in the reviews it fit their rock islands from some purchasers.

 

Went to install it and this will not fit........ did I purchase the wrong one? I got the sti version, is it supposed to be the standard version?

 

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Which part # did you buy that didn't work? This one -> https://dawsonprecision.com/mag-releases-sti-2011-by-dawson-precision/ has two reviews on their site with people saying it worked fine in their RIA ... one review is from September 2018, and one is from February 2020, the latter stating he has a 10mm Pro Match Tac Ultra HC. I'm asking because I have a .40  Pro Match Ultra HC (51738) that I was looking to replace the mag release on and was interested in that Dawson. Thanks.

[chomorro]

 
Which part # did you buy that didn't work? This one -> https://dawsonprecision.com/mag-releases-sti-2011-by-dawson-precision/ has two reviews on their site with people saying it worked fine in their RIA ... one review is from September 2018, and one is from February 2020, the latter stating he has a 10mm Pro Match Tac Ultra HC. I'm asking because I have a .40  Pro Match Ultra HC (51738) that I was looking to replace the mag release on and was interested in that Dawson. Thanks.

Yes that's the one I bought because of the reviews. It does not fit. Take a picture of your mag release and compare it to mine.

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[JayB059]

45 minutes ago, chomorro said:

Yes that's the one I bought because of the reviews. It does not fit. Take a picture of your mag release and compare it to mine.

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OK, thanks for confirming that was what you got from Dawson.

 

In your picture, which one was your stock RIA and which was the Dawson? I'm guessing the top one was stock, which from your picture, appears to be wider/thicker than the other one. Do you happen to have any dimensions? I tired Googling what the standard 2011 mag release dimensions where, and I was not able to find anything other than the length the button protrudes past the frame, so I can't compare to know if the RIA one I have is thicker or not.

 

Here's some of the dimensions I took of mine ... not sure if I'm using the correct terminology or not:

overall length = 1.3085"

main body thickness (half circle) = 0.1860"

main body thickness (full circle) = 0.3080" --> I think this is the dimensions shown in your picture

 

Note that I'm trying to use STI Gen 1 mags and I'm getting some issues with them locking properly when the mags are loaded (with any number of rounds, not just full). Mags have been tuned per Dawson specs. It seems that others have successfully used the STI Gen 1 mags with this "same" RIA before, but not sure what additional measures were needed.

 

It seems that RIA makes some subtle changes here and there and not sure if those are reflected in the model #'s or not. One example of this is my rear sights are blacked out, as shown here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nh25RICs8xM ... but a review for the "same" gun from 2016 here: https://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/gun-review-rock-island-armory-pro-match-ultra-40-10mm-1911s/ shows the rear sights with two white dots. Just using that as an example to essentially say that someone else with the "same" gun might get something to work that someone else might not be able to get work (without some additional mods).

 

[chomorro]

OK, thanks for confirming that was what you got from Dawson.
 
In your picture, which one was your stock RIA and which was the Dawson? I'm guessing the top one was stock, which from your picture, appears to be wider/thicker than the other one. Do you happen to have any dimensions? I tired Googling what the standard 2011 mag release dimensions where, and I was not able to find anything other than the length the button protrudes past the frame, so I can't compare to know if the RIA one I have is thicker or not.
 
Here's some of the dimensions I took of mine ... not sure if I'm using the correct terminology or not:
overall length = 1.3085"
main body thickness (half circle) = 0.1860"
main body thickness (full circle) = 0.3080" --> I think this is the dimensions shown in your picture
 
Note that I'm trying to use STI Gen 1 mags and I'm getting some issues with them locking properly when the mags are loaded (with any number of rounds, not just full). Mags have been tuned per Dawson specs. It seems that others have successfully used the STI Gen 1 mags with this "same" RIA before, but not sure what additional measures were needed.
 
It seems that RIA makes some subtle changes here and there and not sure if those are reflected in the model #'s or not. One example of this is my rear sights are blacked out, as shown here: 

 ... but a review for the "same" gun from 2016 here: https://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/gun-review-rock-island-armory-pro-match-ultra-40-10mm-1911s/ shows the rear sights with two white dots. Just using that as an example to essentially say that someone else with the "same" gun might get something to work that someone else might not be able to get work (without some additional mods).
 

It's not the dimensions that dont fit the dawson is the same dimensions. The factory is on top on the picture. The mag release notch for the retaining screw is too far inward so it wont catch the factory slot to stay seated.

I ended up using a para mag release and it worked great, and fixed my mag seating problems.

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[JayB059]

On 4/24/2020 at 3:08 PM, OnVacation said:

Quick recap: 

Pro-match ultra showed up yesterday.  First impressions:

 

-Barrel lockup is lacking.  I already had my name on a waiting list for a KKM hybrid barrel, so no problem, but surprised how loose it was

 

-Slide to frame fit was loose.  Since this is primarily a 3-gun pistol I'll manage, but I'm thinking of accurails or peening. Thoughts? 

 

-My big hands don't work with ambidextrous safeties.  Thinking about a DAA shielded safety on the proper side only.  

 

-Holy heavy trigger pull!  It's probably 6, but feels like 10.  Lots of takeup, though not much grit.  I am planning going with an Extreme Engineering Warp speed kit, and a Dlask trigger.  Probably swap the mainspring and housing while I'm in there also.  

 

-The rear of the magwell is sharp!  Big hands don't help, but I feel like a decent training session would leave a blister or broken skin where the meat of my hand hits the rear of the magwell.  Thinking of a Hayes, Taylor Freelance or maybe a Cheely.  I really like the Cheely bighands magwell, but I'm not sure if it'll fit without significant modification.  Anyone know?

 

-Sights are nice.  Adjustable LPA are nice touches.  

 

-Pinned grip safety.  That's going to happen!

 

Thoughts on any of the above?  Looking for feedback before I start work.

Which model # do you have? I know the model #'s on their website, i.e. 51738 -> https://armscor.com/firearms/pro-series/pro-match-ultra-hc-40sw/ , are nowhere to be found on the actual gun (that I'm aware of). Did you by chance measure your trigger pull weight? I just measured mine with a Wheeler scale (https://www.wheelertools.com/gunsmithing-tools/guages-and-scales/professional-digital-trigger-gauge/710904.html#start=1) and my 10-pull average came out to be 2 lbs. 5.6 oz. I did get this gun lightly used from the forums, so not sure if anything was done to it previously ... the beaver tail safety has been deactivated, that I know, just don't know which method was used, i.e. it's not pinned, so I assume something was cut off in the inside. As I look closer at the rear of the magwell on mine, it seems that it might have been filed slightly for the same reason you mentioned ... never noticed that before

[JayB059]

6 minutes ago, chomorro said:

It's not the dimensions that dont fit the dawson is the same dimensions. The factory is on top on the picture. The mag release notch for the retaining screw is too far inward so it wont catch the factory slot to stay seated.

I ended up using a para mag release and it worked great, and fixed my mag seating problems.

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OK, gotcha ... thanks for the explanation, I see it now in your pictures ... I just automatically assumed the dimensions were the problem. I will have to look into that Para mag release you referenced from Slade Street Tactical. Thanks!

[OnVacation]

8 hours ago, JayB059 said:

Which model # do you have? I know the model #'s on their website, i.e. 51738 -> https://armscor.com/firearms/pro-series/pro-match-ultra-hc-40sw/ , are nowhere to be found on the actual gun (that I'm aware of). Did you by chance measure your trigger pull weight? I just measured mine with a Wheeler scale (https://www.wheelertools.com/gunsmithing-tools/guages-and-scales/professional-digital-trigger-gauge/710904.html#start=1) and my 10-pull average came out to be 2 lbs. 5.6 oz. I did get this gun lightly used from the forums, so not sure if anything was done to it previously ... the beaver tail safety has been deactivated, that I know, just don't know which method was used, i.e. it's not pinned, so I assume something was cut off in the inside. As I look closer at the rear of the magwell on mine, it seems that it might have been filed slightly for the same reason you mentioned ... never noticed that before

I have three 51738. I did not measure before starting work. I did see vast improvement by polishing the engagement service and tuning the spring. I still went with the new gear. The steel trigger is heavy for my liking and had a fair amount of play. The dlask trigger was a magnificent fit, once it was fit. I haven't measure the pull, but I will once I get settled at the new house.

 

I did put on the hayes magwell. I am having some issues with mags not turning straight in the funnel, but practice will fix that in due course.

[MuayThaiJJ]

Do the Dawson 2011 Ice STI Magwells fit the Rock Island A2 double stack frame?

[muncie21]

8 hours ago, MuayThaiJJ said:

Do the Dawson 2011 Ice STI Magwells fit the Rock Island A2 double stack frame?

With the grips attached the grip is too wide for the Dawson.  When the grips are removed the Dawson will easily fit over the grip, however there's nothing for the front of the magwell to 'catch' or attach to.  If one were to install the mainspring pin the front of the mawell would flop up/down because it's not secured by anything. 

 

Could you make it work?  I guess.  But you would need to add material to either the grip or magwell and it wouldn't be a quick job. 

[MuayThaiJJ]

4 hours ago, muncie21 said:

With the grips attached the grip is too wide for the Dawson.  When the grips are removed the Dawson will easily fit over the grip, however there's nothing for the front of the magwell to 'catch' or attach to.  If one were to install the mainspring pin the front of the mawell would flop up/down because it's not secured by anything. 

 

Could you make it work?  I guess.  But you would need to add material to either the grip or magwell and it wouldn't be a quick job. 

 

Thanks, damn...do you know if any other standard STI magwells will fit the RIA, with shortened grips? I’m looking at an Akai stainless steel magwell 

[muncie21]

49 minutes ago, MuayThaiJJ said:

 

Thanks, damn...do you know if any other standard STI magwells will fit the RIA, with shortened grips? I’m looking at an Akai stainless steel magwell 

2011 magwells must be standardized (some minor fitting may be required) in order to fit 2011 grips.  If the Dawson requires significant mods to fit, I expect all the others will also. 

[Platypus]

Sorry to bump up an old thread, but didn't see anything recent for the double stack rock islands. I know true 2011s are the hot things nowadays, but I just got a Pro Ultra and am excited to get shooting. This thread is a wealth of knowledge, glad to find something like this for these guns. 

 

I did want to ask if anyone has a recommendation for an extended mag with the Hayes magwell? Hayes doesn't recommend the Taylor freelance extension, just the Dawson pads that don't add rounds.

 

I have a gun craft flat trigger coming I won off gun broker, hopefully it fits as well as I'm led to believe. I'll be sure to update on that soon. 

[shred]

They are basically Para Ordnance clones, and seem to work (at least the one I messed with did).  Cheap metal-framed hicap 9mm 1911, although parts are less common these days.  Dawson used to make a full line of Para hicap basepads and magwells and so on, but I think you have to find old stock as they don't anymore.

 

Used to be Paras could get an extra round in versus STI due to the mag taper.  Get the slide milled and go rock out in LO.