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joelaz

Short M1A for Standard/Tactical divison?

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Are the Scout Squad MIA and SOCOM MIA fully legal in USPSA Rifle Standard Div, or will mods have to be made?

Thanks,

Joel

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You should be ok if the comp meets the measurement requirements - which I think it does but I have not actually measured one. But I doubt you'll be competitive under current scoring.

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The standard comp is 0.037" too long. I really don't think any of the AR guys would care that it's a tad too long.

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The standard comp is 0.037" too long. I really don't think any of the AR guys would care that it's a tad too long.

You wait until one of those AR guys looses to the guy with the comp .037" too long! It will make a difference then!

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If you are concerned with .037, give it a couple of swipes with a file and spray paint it so you can't tell, it won't make any difference.

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The SOCOM 16 comp looks like it'll make it easily, but the Squad Scout doesn't. The other concern is will it make major and still be shootable?

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I sure hope Pat Kelley reads this thread so he'll know that he can't clean everyone's clock with his M1A shorty. Stop the madness! :rolleyes:

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Both the Scout Squad and the SOCOM are very shootable!!!. I have put some rounds through both and feel they out handle and have less recoil related effects than the M1A standard rifle. One of the points they have over AR is that the sights are closer to the bore making this 308 more pointable. Can you say close and fast?

We will see if I can apply any of this at SMM3Gun.

Damn, it always comes down to the shooter!

PK

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Pat,

This wasn't supposed to be incentive.

You were supposed to get discouraged and quit this M1A nonsense altogether. A factory gun with surplus ball ammo cannot be competitive in this game. Don't get me started about how the recoil slows you down. You should know that by now.

It's a sad day when the E-class shooter has to tutor the Master, but it is a cross I shall bear.

;)

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And bear it you will grasshopper as I require much tutoring.

PK

I give graduate classes in IPA imbibing. You are cordially invited to attend. (The rest of y'all can come too if ya like. :) )

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I agree with Mr Kelly, up close, because of the sights, an M1A is every bit as fast as an AR. It is the mid range stuff ( 25-75 yards) that kills you with the M1A. I have used mine in several local 3-gun matches and have won over all using it, and befor you think thats just local, there were guys like Blaine West, Eddie Rhodes, Eric Miller, and Jimmie Holdsworth there. At last years Rocky Mountain 3-gun We had a stage that you rammed a door and then proceeded to 3 more "buildings". The fastest AR ran around 42 seconds ( open ) and I ran it with my M1A with Lake City Ball ammo in 45 seconds. the 12 pistol shots at the end were what killed my time as I was using a single stack gun w/ 8 round mags and boy that mag well is small. More practice?? I didn't shoot for score as I was helping put the match on, but the time speaks for it'self. Could an M1A user beat Taran w/ his AR across the board? probably not, but I bet a stage or two could be won. KURTM

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Both the Scout Squad and the SOCOM are very shootable!!!.  I have put some rounds through both and  feel they out handle and have less recoil related effects than the M1A standard rifle.

PK,

With the longer shots (200-400 yards) how were the shorties compared to the full-length M1A? Does the sight radius of the SOCOM and Scout make them noticeable less easier to shoot 200-400 yard targets?

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Yes! Is it that big a deal? That depend on the match. If I were shooting an M1A at Raton, you can bet it would be a full sized one. North Amercian Tactical? Hand me a SOCOM.

Plus the SOCOM has an outrageously over-sized front sight.

Since I've put an extended front sight on my AR, I've really noticed the difference. Sight radius is your friend!

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I am with KellyN on the issue of sight radius, more is good! That said the Scout Squad sight radius is slightly longer than a stock 20" AR. Cheek weld has been more of a problem for me with most of the variations M1A.

PK

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I have an 18" Bush and have found it to be the (nearly) perfect M1A option for me. We don't have any really long range targets at matches around here but I suspect it will be the eyes, not the rifle, that will cause me problems at distance.

P.E. -I have solved my M1A cheekweld problems with USGI fiberglass stocks, bondo to appropriate height, and camo rattle cans from WalMart. The solution works and looks good. I plan to raise the comb on a M1A wood stock with an insert but that project is very back burner now.

BTW the Smith Enterprise muzzle break on my Bush rifle is the grits. It allows a much faster second shot than the USGI on a 22".

Dave

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I use an 18" Bush rifle with E2 stock & Smith Enterprise muzzle break. Very little recoil and easy to shoot. I've recently added an Alley Supply Globe front sight and I find it to be more accurate than the earred front sight.

221405.JPG

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Coulter6,

Fine looking rifle!

I've never shot an E2 stocked rifle. I always thought the comb area looked too low. How's the cheekweld on that setup?

I Googled Alley Supply to check out their Globe front sight and came up blank. Can you recommend a source?

I just added a Smith Ent. quick bolt release to mine. It's very handy but not a must have item.

Good looking sling.

Thanks for the pic.

Dave

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Airedale,

The cheek weld is right on for me, not much different from a standard stock.

I just put on a Smith Ent. quick bolt release on mine too, I think it's great! Very quick to get the bolt closed, no need to remove the right hand from the firing position. Especially helpful with the E2 stock.

Steve Alley is the owner of Alley Supply in NV. You'll need to call him about the sight, he also has a few taller sights left he made special for 18" length barrels. I believe Brownells sells the too, just search on Globe Sights on the Brownell site. Here's a link to Alley's contact web page:

Alley Supply

C6

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Coulter6,

Thanks, I'll contact Alley Supply today.

Dave

Edited to add: I ordered one and it will be shipped today.

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I have a Springield Scout/Squad rifle.

The factory break is 1/8 th of an inch too long for USPSA.

there is enough metal on the front to remove to make it legal and not effect the comp/break any.

I myself have a second gen. break on mine developed by springfield while they were working on the SOCOM. Let me give you a brief over view of how they test their breaks.

they install them on a fully funtional M14 and fire it on full auto.....

they then watch the muzzle for climb.

the standard flash hider seen on M1a does help vs. no break ect.

The standard break that comes on the Scout squad allows muzzle climb but at a slower rate.

The break that I have holds the gun pretty much level

The break on the SOCOM drives the muzzle down.

I use a red dot on mine on the forward scope mount and can run with the AR shooters until the targets get so far out the dot covers them up and I cant see them.

Note on the running with ARs..... when I don't have to reload <_<

hope that helps, I really enjoy mine and don't even consider shooting one of the little whimpy mouse guns ;)

Hopalong

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If you are concerned with .037, give it a couple of swipes with a file and spray paint it so you can't tell, it won't make any difference.

The Smith Ent. brake is shorter and is suposed to work better anyhow.

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I plan on using my M1A Scout at the Rocky MT 3-gun in August. I ended up putting a Vortex flashhider on it. I didn't like the factory comp because when I went prone in dirt or sandy conditions and starting shooting, the comp blew dirt and sand up since it has holes all the way around the circumferance of the comp. I was able to get good hits at 300 yards with this rifle. That's the furthest I've ever shot it, but I'm comfortable with it's performance.

Of course, if I get my new DPMS .308 in time, I just may shoot that instead. The 16" barrel length will probably be a disadvatage, but I don't care. It'll be fun.

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Note on the running with ARs..... when I don't have to reload  ;)

Beta C is coming out with a version for the M1A1 early 2006. Of course I asked if they needed any field testers. :D

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Beta C is coming out with a version for the M1A1 early 2006.  Of course I asked if they needed any field testers. :D

Considering that a fully-loaded Beta w/ .223 weighs 4.6 lbs, I'm gonna guess a Beta loaded w/ .308 is going to be close to 8 or more pounds! Of course, most people only load 40 or so rounds in their Beta for 3-Gun, so a .308 Beta might be do-able weight wise if it is downloaded.

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