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Alliant E3 for Newbies


Smitty79

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I want to start reloading. I am getting a 550b. The only powder I can find that might work is Alliant E3. As a new reloader, can I safely and successfully load this behind 124grain plated bullets for shooting from a CZ75 and a Glock 34. If it's much of a risk, I will just wait.

My alternative is to wait forever for 231/HP38.

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e3 is no faster than N320 as a matter of fact you can use the same load data. I use it almost exclusively in all calibers and it reaches power factor major or minor with ease and no signs of high pressures. I really wish danger! danger! would go away from e3. It's a great and very safe powder for 9mm, .40 and .45 and is probably the best I have used. I call BS on how it is listed on the burn charts.

For 124/125 grain jacketed or plated 3.6 to 3.8 will do the job for Production with 4.2 being my maximum.

For 147 grain jacketed or plated 3.0 to 3.4 does great in Minor with 3.6 being maximum.

All of these get there with less powder with lead or coated bullets. Consider it Red Dot on steroids. Use the same load data minus 10% and it will keep you far away from any trouble.

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e3 is no faster than N320 as a matter of fact you can use the same load data. I use it almost exclusively in all calibers and it reaches power factor major or minor with ease and no signs of high pressures. I really wish danger! danger! would go away from e3. It's a great and very safe powder for 9mm, .40 and .45 and is probably the best I have used. I call BS on how it is listed on the burn charts.

For 124/125 grain jacketed or plated 3.6 to 3.8 will do the job for Production with 4.2 being my maximum.

For 147 grain jacketed or plated 3.0 to 3.4 does great in Minor with 3.6 being maximum.

All of these get there with less powder with lead or coated bullets. Consider it Red Dot on steroids. Use the same load data minus 10% and it will keep you far away from any trouble.

Hogdon, Accurate, and IMR all seem to disagree with you.

Call BS on the manufacturers published data if you want, but I wouldn't make a habit out of it.

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3.7gr with 124PD jhp easily make power factor for me with E3. Soft and accurate just doesn't meter very well out of my Lee powder disk. I love the way 7625, WSF, Universal, Power Pistol and 231/hp38 meter and that order is my 9mm powders of choice.

Wish you lived around here , then I would gladly get some 231 in yours hands. Also Recobs has 7625 in 1# and you could order 4 and 5k of Winchester primers to help absorb the cost. If you call them they sometimes have powder not listed on the web site but in stock on the selves since it is hard to keep the web updated daily.

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Do you have a chrono? If you are conscientious, know how to use and pay attention to a chrono, then there is nothing wrong with using E3 so long as you follow the normal precautions about working up loads and don't get creative.

I have gotten creative with E3, and you won't see me talking about how and why in print. However, I have been using E3 in 9mm for a while now and I much prefer it to many of the other powders commonly used for 9mm.

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Maybe but it's not pressure signs that stop you with e3, it's the velocities you get that slows down a larger charge. Unlike Clays or 310 you stop adding powder long before there are any pressure signs. If it's as fast as they say this would be impossible. Besides most of the burn rate charts are all over the place and no one company agrees with other. I'm on my 16th pound of it and so far no problems. But I have used enough of it that I am in no way afraid of it, that's another thing I like about it, lot to lot it is spot on, no need to work up another load every time you empty a bottle. You guys really need to try some of this stuff I can't have all the fun.

Double charge? Yes it will fill the case full or spill over as it is very fluffy and bulky. I would also agree on 7625, it mimics N320 in cleanliness and softness and gives a large amount of headroom for an over charge. I love it for 9mm.

Edited by bowenbuilt
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3.7gr with 124PD jhp easily make power factor for me with E3. Soft and accurate just doesn't meter very well out of my Lee powder disk. I love the way 7625, WSF, Universal, Power Pistol and 231/hp38 meter and that order is my 9mm powders of choice.

Wish you lived around here , then I would gladly get some 231 in yours hands. Also Recobs has 7625 in 1# and you could order 4 and 5k of Winchester primers to help absorb the cost. If you call them they sometimes have powder not listed on the web site but in stock on the selves since it is hard to keep the web updated daily.

I have had decent luck metering E3 with my Lee Pro Auto disks, but it will not work with the adjustable charge bar at all. It shoots soft and clean but I cant work up a load to my liking with it. I have a perfect load for 9mm with 7625 so I generally stick with that. I have found E3 to work great in .45 and have a load that works perfect with my auto disks so E3 is my go to .45 powder.

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I have found E3 to work great in .45 and have a load that works perfect with my auto disks so E3 is my go to .45 powder.

Would you mind sharing your load and which Lee auto disk you use for it please.

My E3 load for .45 is 4.35gr under a 200 gr LSWC loaded to 1.25 OAL. My .66 hole lee pro auto disk throws this as a 10 throw average. In my RIA 5" 1911 I can keep this group about 1 inch at 25 yds with arms supported on a bench. No chrono data though.

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My E3 load for .45 is 4.35gr under a 200 gr LSWC loaded to 1.25 OAL. My .66 hole lee pro auto disk throws this as a 10 throw average. In my RIA 5" 1911 I can keep this group about 1 inch at 25 yds with arms supported on a bench. No chrono data though.

Thanks! I'm going to pick up some e3 the next time I'm at the LGS.

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Just to weigh in on my experiences with e3. Had tumbling issues in a cz75 with e3 behind a 147gr moly coated 9mm at minor PF. It also sounded "bad", if that makes sense to those familiar with reloading.

Tried it in 40 major behind 180gr montana gold and 200gr moly coated bayou loaded long for an svi 5in. Both loads felt hot at just under major with mildly inconsistent chrono results (~163pf), no pressure signs whatsoever in any of my tests, but one of my least favorite as far as recoil characteristics. Didn't bother to check accuracy beyond no tumbling.

Not really sure what the hype is with this powder or how anyone could compare it to clays. From my experience, it's nothing like clays. I would do more research before buying this powder if you're looking for a clays replacement (wst if you don't mind the temp sensitivity or n310 are both great).

Anyone else get the same results as far as it being a poor competitive powder choice? I see a lot of data posted but none that compare it to currently used powders.

Edited by Russellhjoy
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WST yes, N310 probably not. Loading 310 for 9mm in my experience leads to vastly inconsistent chromo results and shotgun pattern accuracy. Light recoil, but wont hit anything.

I have not loaded 310 for 40s&w, actually would not even consider 310 for 40 major………….in 45, it is a perfect replacement for clays, in my opinion, it is better.

As far as E3, I have not used it, but input from experienced shooters(that I would trust) here on BE, have noted success with it. As always with fast powders, load low and chrono. Like everything else, your experience may vary.

Edited by fastarget
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I almost scooped up some E3 the other day, probably would had if they had any primers cheaper than $35/k at the same place to save on HazMat.

I still have enough for a couple thousand rounds but I'll need to re-up in the next couple of weeks, if it's still available I'll suck it up and try it out. Only used Unique so far so I've been hesistant to swtich, but haven't seen any Unique in forever.

I have the Lee Pro Auto Disk but might be getting a Dillion press in the coming months, how does it run out of their powder measure?

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Big flake powders don't meter the best. In my 650 you have to weigh a few to get an average + or - .08 grains out of my dillon for a major load, + or -.04 in minor loads. It seems to meter the best without weight added on top of the powder column as in a powder alarm or any other devices that may compress it.

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I too have wondered at the seemingly fast placement of e3 on the burn rate charts. At first I would not consider it, but then, testing done by some of the members here and elsewhere led me to acquire some for testing when the weather permits. I must say that most of the manufacturer testing is conducted in what are called "closed bomb tests" which completely enclose the powder in a vessel and read the pressure when it is ignited. Most of us who reload have noted that different powders will react differently in various case sizes, and what is poor in one may be golden in another. To me then, the placement of e3 on the various charts is related to the way it was originally tested without regard to how it acted in various sized cartridge cases. When the powder is allowed to burn in a more conventional way it seems to be slower than the "closed bomb" type testing would indicate. At least that is how it seems to me with the limited reports we now have. As an aside, it might also make a pretty good powder for "smokeless fireworks" if the closed bomb testing is any indication.

Edited by Justsomeguy
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I've noticed that e3 is placed closer to the top of burn charts than I think it should be. I load it in 9mm,40 and 12 gauge and it seems to be a hair slower burning than Clays. After using 50lbs+ I have had one case rupture using some very old 40 brass and pushing a 172 pf. I had some brass that was springing back after sizing and not holding the bullets very tight(speer brass) and I think I had bullet setback causing the rupture. Pressure testing from Alliant showed my 40 load to be 34,750 psi making a 172 pf. This was with a 180 jhp Zero loaded to 1.20" using a small rifle primer. I have not had my 9mm loads tested but I think the pressure is low and it definately seems safe. (3.8grs with a 125gr bullet is just about perfect bulk and case fill.) I have a good 1 1/8 oz 12 gauge load at a published 1250 fps, very clean and pressure seems fine. In the 12 gauge, the charge weight is almost the same as a Clays charge for a similar speed. As far as metering goes, e3 works fine for me in my 550, 1050 and Mec reloaders.

EG

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From what little I have used it I would have to agree somewhat with it not being as fast as it is portrayed. I've worked up some .38 Short Colt loads with 160 grain RN bullets and got to 146PF before I got some slight primer flattening. For those that don't know it's a short .38 Special case, pretty radically shortened, it's basically a 9mm with a rim. I started out treating it like N310 and found that using Red Dot data to start is right on the money. Could have saved some load developement time, but this was my first foray into developing a load with zero data from the manufacturer.

It seems to meter exactly like Clays out of my 650. Not perfect, but certainly usable. I'm not using a baffle or powder check. It also seems to be happiest at a little over PF for this caliber and particular gun giving very good ES and SD so you might try running it up just a bit over the "PF line". If you want to run right on that line it may not be your powder. Of course that could very well be different in other guns or load combinations, but for the gun that I'm using it in, it is noticeably better on the chrono and the target at 136PF. I really like it so far.

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