650 swager

[Steve RA]

If you have 10 gallons to go thru, I'd get a swager. The Dillon one is fairly quick, you can rig it up with a spring or big rubber band to make it even faster. Several vids around to show the results.

[Nimitz]

But that's my point ... I'm trying to get a feel from those that have been doing this for a while whether in their experience at using range pick up 223 how prevalent mil brass is. Since no one probably has a secret place they get their brass from and all brass around the country comes from the same manufacturers, the distribution of that brass around the country is in general probably similar. Therefore, if folk's experience at picking up range 223 is that 500 out of 1000 are mil I should expect a similar distribution.

Assuming that it is not on the order of 500/1000 I may avoid swaging initially by separating brass and it

just seems to me that using headstand to ID would be quicker than looking for the crimp, maybe not ....

Now all this may be moot if the device this thread is about works since it appears for adding about $95 I can setup to process in a single pass ...

[Outsydlooknin75]

There is a LOT of surplus mil brass that is shot. I sort out LC, PMC, WW,Winchester, FC, and Rem for the most part, after that it all goes into the odds and ends pile.

LC,WW, and the odds and ends pile gets swaged. The rest usually gets sold in group lots to guys without a swager.

[Steve RA]

Lake City is very uniform and once the crimp is removed it's good to go after that. You just have to decide what you want to do, but, I'd advise picking one "flavor" of brass and going with it exclusively.

[Nimitz]

By flavor do you mean brass requiring swager versus not?

[Nimitz]

Since I have 2 50g buckets of brass I guess I'll just start sorting and see where I am. I hav no intent to buy 223 brass and I'm probably not going to shoot more than a few thousand rounds a year so we'll see what it looks like.

So PMC, Winchester, FCC and Remington do NOT need to be swaged, right?

Edited November 17, 2013 by Nimitz

[Steve RA]

Some Federal is military, remember, ATK owns Federal and has many military contracts. In fact, they have a new contract to run Lake City.

[Steve RA]

In regard to what I said about "flavor" - I meant pick one brand of brass and use it only. This way your loads will be more consistent. Pick one, sort the brass and sell the rest.

[Nimitz]

if I have enough of one type that is a great plan ... we'll see

[Outsydlooknin75]

I just went thru a 5 gallon bucket of rifle brass. Out of that bucket I had 1300 reloadable pieces of LC, 300 pieces of FC, 350 pieces of PMC and not sure on the other counts as I didn't count them. The LC got processed and traded to a man for a stainless steel tumbler set up. I was hoping for 2k of LC but that didn't happen.

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[StealthyBlagga]

I get once fired military brass and run it 100% through my Dillon Super Swage 600. I then use this brass exclusively to load long-range ammo for 3-gunning. I shoot a couple of matches each month, plus a couple of majors. If I consumed 1000 rounds of this long-range ammo a year I'd be surprised.

I get a lot more mixed brass as range pickings from major and local matches. I find the majority (maybe 90%) is not crimped, because it is reloaded or commercial ammo. I simply prep this brass as usual without swaging, then use it to load my close-range hoser ammo (of which I must burn several thousand rounds each year). During the final loading steps, I pay close attention to the feel of the priming step. If I encounter any meaningful resistance, I stop and inspect the brass. If crimped, I use a hand-reamer to remove the crimp, then prime and resume loading. Given that probably less than 10% of the mixed brass is crimped, this approach does not slow me down too much.

[Chills1994]

Since I have 2 50g buckets of brass I guess I'll just start sorting and see where I am. I hav no intent to buy 223 brass and I'm probably not going to shoot more than a few thousand rounds a year so we'll see what it looks like.

So PMC, Winchester, FCC and Remington do NOT need to be swaged, right?

Was that a typo?

Do you mean 5 gallons?

Or 50 gallons?

If 50 gallons, then:

This guy has got it going on with his tricked out Dillon 600 swager:

I've just been buying factory commercial ammo, and then saving that (uncrimped) brass to reload with. Any crimped in primer stuff that I find goes in a box that I have had for years.

I have one of the RCBS tools that gets chucked in their prep center. I've also heard that a chamfering/deburring tool normally used on the mouths of the cases, will ream out the crimp too. I just figure I will chuck the deburring tool in my handheld corded drill, clamp the drill in a vise, and then lock the trigger down. I plan on having an "inbox" on the bench, of still crimped brass. and then a 5 gallon bucket as my "outbox" sitting on the floor. I would think it would go pretty quickly.

[Nimitz]

Thx all, that is the kind of data pts I was looking for and yes it was 5 gal buckets not 50 gal ...

I guess my choices are to either: sort my brass and see if i have enough that doesn't need swaging or get a swager and just swage everything and not worry about it

[Chills1994]

How are you trimming cases?

If you don't have anything yet for trimming, then I'd recommend the possum hollow trimmer with its tool holder. The trimmer part is on the far left. The holder is in the middle:

The holder, in the middle, will also fit and tightly hold onto one of these:

the last pic is from here:

http://www.ar15.com/archive/topic.html?b=6&f=42&t=391503

[Guest]

Chills, Thanks for posting that vid, that is the best 600 swager mod I I've seen yet!

I've done the rubber band and string mod and it woks OK, but I think that one is actually more of a labor saver.

Plus it is way cool that it tosses the brass into a box!

Loading .223 is a piece of cake compared to processing it, and no matter how you cut it processing 223 is a PITA.

Getting somebody else to do it is the easiest!

[Travtastik]

At one of the ranges I frequent I average 1 out of 3 pieces of 223 brass I pick up is crimped. It's out in the middle of nowhere. Another range about 45 minutes away I get about 10pcs per 1000 I pickup. Both are public ranges with no military tie in.

I now sort out why needs extra work when I sort all my pick ups. I don't want to go through another 5g bucket of brass searching for crimps. I now have a bin labeled 223 and a 223C.

[Chills1994]

Does that Federal XM193 stuff that I am now seeing in the WalMart ammo case have crimps?

[hpnewby]

Thread drift, anybody?

How does the little trick part work? What part of the stroke is the pocket actually swaged?

[Outsydlooknin75]

Does that Federal XM193 stuff that I am now seeing in the WalMart ammo case have crimps?

Yup

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[Outsydlooknin75]

Thread drift, anybody?

How does the little trick part work? What part of the stroke is the pocket actually swaged?

Pull the handle down and it works a cam that pushes the swager into the primer pocket.

[jmorris]

hpnewby, on 17 Nov 2013 - 11:16 PM, said:

Thread drift, anybody?

How does the little trick part work? What part of the stroke is the pocket actually swaged?

Pull the handle down and it works a cam that pushes the swager into the primer pocket.

That is incorrect. The unit I linked to above replaces the primer seating anvil. So when you push forward on the handle instead of seating a primer it swages the pocket.

[Lopro]

Hello all, I bought the system ( 650 swager ) a couple of months ago with their shell plate , once I had it setup it worked great no issues very light push is all it took , I use the Sizer Deprimer die # 1 , then the swager # 2 works like a charm .

1. Tumble

2. Lube

3. Deprime

4. Swage

5. check for trim length clean primer hole.

6. load

7. Re Tumble

8. done

[gigs]

With random 223/5.56 brass, 40-60% will be crimped depending on what people have been shooting. Nearly all WCC, LC, 50% of FC and 50% of PMC are crimped.

I haven't gotten my 650 swager from the eBay guy yet, but once I get it I can post a detailed review.

I also wonder how long his ram part lasts. I know I get about 30,000-50,000 cases out of a dillon 1050 rod before it's worn to the point where it no longer swages effectively (that sounds like a lot, but that means I wind up changing the rod about once every 2 weeks or so).

[Nimitz]

I'd like to know your setup to be able to process in one pass as well. Although I shoot 25,000/yr of 9mm that same amount of 223 would probably be 2 lifetimes for me given my current shooting ... . That being said I'm all for making the 223 processing as simple as possible because maybe I'll shoot more if I make more ...

So, can you setup a single toolhead on a 650 to FL resize, deprime, swage & trim? I'd be using a Dillion RT-1200 for trimming ...

[Chills1994]

Get the rcbs X sizer die, so you won't have to trim every time.

You just have to keep track of your X-die'ed brass. I use a magic marker to stripe the cases. When the just fired round's case gets ejected out of my AR, when I go to pick up brass, I have a zip lock bag for the striped brass, and other bag for other "from parts unknown" brass.

Once you get the X-die (with its mandrel screwed down) you can treat that .223 brass like straight wall semi-auto brass (9,.40, .45 etc.).