Jump to content
Brian Enos's Forums... Maku mozo!
Moltke

Tips to get people to show up for match setup

Recommended Posts

Definitely interested in ideas. The local club that I am the MD for, typically sees about 100+ at our monthly matches. We use to do 8 stages, we've recently changed that to 7 stages. All stages are of a Sectional level in quality of design (props, complexity, technical, etc). In order to get those stages on the ground, the day prior, we've put a requirement of 8 volunteers to make it happen. My max capacity for setup help has been 12, but that's never been realized. The most I've gotten is 11, but it's typically between 8-10. I'm limited in how long I can use the range for setup the day prior, so having a full compliment of volunteers is imperative. In exchange for setup help, the volunteers get to shoot the match for free the following day. I'd like to offer that they shoot the match the day of setup (Saturday) and if they wanted, shoot the next day as well (maybe a different division or same division). Unfortunately, I can't regularly get 10+ to put the stages on the ground fast enough to afford them enough time to shoot after setting up. I've also tinkered with the idea of paying the setup crew, but that would have to be enticing enough to justify. For example, $50 to help setup, the match costs $25 (currently costs $20). This "pay for setup option" would mean that the setup people wouldn't shoot for free, but they could apply a portion of that $50 to the match fees. I do like the "enter into a season ending raffle" idea. That is something I'll have to put some serious consideration to the idea of a giveaway.

Is there a reason you have a max of 12 for setup? I would think the more help you got, the easier you could setup in time to shoot the day before. You may (or not) get enough help if they knew they would be able to shoot that day.

Every situation is unique & it sounds like you are under some unfortunate constraints.

12 is enough to setup 7-8 stages in 3 hours. Any more and there isn't much benefit. If I could get more than 12 (which never happens), I would definitely do shooting the same day as setup for the volunteers.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I can't help but be amazed at the people that will stand around and not help. As I have said here and in other places, we ASK people for help. From designing stages to building to ROing to tearing down. It is not easy. It is hard. you have to bite your tongue when you see a design that while it fits the rules you know is going to be gamed beyond belief. Designers, especially newer designers have to be allowed to have their designs torn apart of they will not learn. If you jump in on other than rules and safety you can lose a future star. Egos are fragile, everyone's. When people start walking the stages trying to game them while you are building, hand them a hammer and tell them to start nailing down fault lines or stapling targets or what ever else you are working on at the moment.

During the match brief Tell them, you need help, ask them, keep asking. Be free with praise.

DO NOT start giving your match away for free. It is an easy out that will eventually backfire. You get your 6-10 people and the rest now have a valid reason to stand back as they are not getting paid, 'Why should I work? they are paid to build the match, I'm here to shoot and working will ruin my game anyway."

This is of course only my opinion.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Free match fees might help if you set up on the day of the match. I do not think its much of an incentive to drive to the range set up and drive home.

I am the president of our club. I send out the emails to remind folks about set up etc. I am the MD for this weekends match. I asked for help from three friends who come up with good stages. I figured if we each had our own stage it would set up fast. It has worked well for me in the past.

The three I asked were there. Only one person showed up for set up. We discussed just going home and setting up in the AM or bagging the match.Then we remembered we were there because we wanted to shoot on Sunday.

I do not think there is a carrot to offer that will make people want to help. Its more of a reward to those that do.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

My opinion still stands, we don't pay to build or RO, HOWEVER, I am not against rewarding the builders in other ways. Annual dinner, special match that only they get to shoot etc. We just feel that paying the first X that show up tends to send the message that 'we' built the match for 'them'. Them being those that never work.

Now do keep in mind that in many cases there are some of the non-workers that work their butts off at the match you are shooting in two weeks. And there are a few that work at home, but travel several hours to shoot your match. We don't expect them to work. Funny thing is, it seems a large portion of these people are the ones that do work!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Good points Jim, well taken. I'm also of the opinion that, if you are expecting people to help outside of the normal expectation without actually asking for it, you have a false expectation set up and shouldn't be upset when that help doesn't materialize. For example, if everyone knows the expectation is to setup the stages the day prior, expecting people to step up and help is a valid expectation. If no one ever helps put the targets on the sticks or puts the sticks out the day of the match, it's hardly a valid expectation to expect shooters to put the targets out or the sticks on the bases. In those cases, I agree with Jim, ask for help and you shall receive.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

What Jim said.

Always ask for help. Always thank.

Also, I'm a firm believer in setting up on match morning.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Allow them to shoot after setup for a reduced fee (or free) so that people who can't shoot the next day can get the match in.

+1. That works for me :cheers:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

some people aren't interested in doing anything more than shooting the match.

Getting the chance to shoot the match for free, or being entered in a raffle, or any of the other ideas suggested don't come close to making up for the number of hours it takes to help with setup.

I'm willing to setup the morning of the match, but there is no way I would give up Saturday to setup, and then come back and spend Sunday shooting.

True. Really need a few dedicated souls who have the time, live near the range and are willing. :cheers:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yep. Recruit and recruit hard and often. Let people know you need help. Without help there will be no matches. Get new shooters involved quickly... helps them be part of the gang. Don't be shy asking for help... ever. Don't try to do it all.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I have lived in several different USPSA areas and seen various flavors of this dilemma.  Several options:  with large draws - Set Up crew gets slots before all others - Worked well in PA where 6 stage match would have a waiting list to get in.  GA - Set Up crew breakfast worked well plus reduced or no match fee.  AZ - Currently out west were match fees are going up at select club(s) to have a paid set up and tear down staff (which is where I think the sport is headed right or wrong).  I saw the lack of setup help first hand in GA with our small crews (3-4) getting burned out quickly.  Feel your pain as It is just a bit frustrating when the bulk of the shooters stand and wait for a few to do the rest of the work.  To that end here is a suggestion to add to the pile.  Want to just drop in shoot and scoot $40 - $50 Fee.  Set up Help is worth $10 off fee, tear down help is worth $10 off fee, stage design, $10 off fee.  Just and idea....adjust to fit needs.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

where i previously lived in southern CA they had paid stage builders and it worked great. a majority of the regular rank and file just shows up, shoots and leaves. people want to be on the builder list. get there 90 mins early, stay 60 mins after. get a free match ($40 value) and then a cut of the gate. you make about $100 for around 2.5 hours of work. i never in years saw issues with how Norco or Pala did this. Stages were always built on time, were very nice and always had a large crowd (80-100+) of shooters week and week out. Not a monthly match, but week in and week out for Norco and every other week for Pala.

no begging for help. no setting up the day before. they seemed to do better when they abandoned the volunteer model and made it more business like. incentivize it rather than play the "woe is me" card.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I run a 6 stage match with an average turnout of about 55 people. We usually have about 6-7 people for set up. We start at 7 am and the shooters meeting is at 930. We are usually set up a few mins before 9.  I send an email to all club members 1 week ahead of time looking for volunteers. To start, I send 2 people & all the needed stage props to set up stage 6. I then send 1 person with the stage props for 4 & 5, they just deliver the props. Once 6 is set up those 2 people move on to set up for 4 & 5. Next the person that delivered 4 &5 will take all of the props to 3 & set it up. Then I deliver the props for 1 &2. By this time a few more helpers have arrived & they set up 1 &2. While this is happening I set up registration. I have one person that takes care of the stage boxes & delivers them to each stage, while he is doing this he  also acts as a runner to get anything that got missed during the delivery.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I am located MD for our monthly club 3gun matches and setup help is the worst part of it all. 5% of the people do 95% of the work. It's frustrating and we have tried to get others to help. We called off the match last month when the 3 of us that showed up were just burned out! I posted on our FB page that this is a volunteer sport and without volunteers there will be no sport. Sucked!!! I am glad this thread got brought back to life and curious to hear other ideas and opinions. I like the idea of discounted or free match fees I also agree that when some find out we are shooting for "free" what little help they give during the match will be less and more people heading for the gate before teardown is even started.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

- Range ROs have practice privileges during week, from that group everyone takes a turn as MD (twice a month USPSA match has different MD each time, also alternate weekends IDPA, other stuff), or about 1x a year to be MD from Range RO group
- So different voice asking for volunteers each time
- Private Facebook group of about 600 active shooters in the region where ask is posted each USPSA match, beyond  however current MD wants to handle
- Stage design/setup (1 or 2 each stage) shoot for free
- Setup day before match, those that build as well as those that pre-register can shoot Sat after setup (about 40 ish) in less that 1/2 the time of sunday, which takes pressure off sunday (another 100), for close to 150 total competitors each match
- RO for squad shared responsibility of any of those on squad that can RO, everyone else tapes, etc.
- Still a small percentage that setup regularly of those that shoot..., but rotating MD maybe helps with fresh voice on ask each time and pulls in different folks.

Just an FYI on the system I see, set up well before my time

Edited by trgt

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

dang. 40-50 bucks for a local match entry?!??!!

And i was feeling put upon when it went from $7 to $10 last year.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, motosapiens said:

dang. 40-50 bucks for a local match entry?!??!!

And i was feeling put upon when it went from $7 to $10 last year.

No kidding! They say everything costs more in California though!

Would need to be one HELL of a match for $40. We average $15 around here and they are very good matches

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

from what I've seen the stages that are regular match ones at pala could be a sectional match at most places that charge you $10 to shoot a match. oh and you don't have to set up or tear down.

also most clubs have to rent a range to shoot matches out there. but still, norco can get an average of 80-ish shooters,  every dang weekend, every weekend of the year. pala gets that every other week. heck, even prado idpa will have a 100 people for an idpa match!

having been to both i think you're getting $40 worth for sure and you shoot against some real talent in almost any division. show up to shoot to start shooting at 9am (8am norco), shoot with almost 100 people on 6 good stages, be done by 1pm if you're a slow squad. set up done that morning, tear down done that day, electronic scoring. year round. over and over again.

Edited by rowdyb

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.


×
×
  • Create New...