niroth81 Posted June 12, 2013 Share Posted June 12, 2013 I've not been in the game long, only about 5 months, but I've heard so often that people don't like to shoot steel because its a smaller target than an IPSC classic target. A couple of the members at my club have real issues shooting falling plates and steel challenge because of it, and these guys are actually very good shots. I was watching a youtube video this evening and the guy mentioned that if you are moving between shooting positions, don't leave any steel as the last shot prior to moving positions, and cited that it's because the IPSC targets are bigger. So I'm wondering who here has the same thoughts/problems. The way I look at it, is that the steel plate, pretty much regardless of if it's a popper, falling plate or plate rack; they are all bigger than the A zone on the IPSC paper targets. Am I over simplifying it? Is there something that I haven't learned yet or figured out?? Jase Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dover0020 Posted June 12, 2013 Share Posted June 12, 2013 Shooting steel requires a slightly different and more refined trigger pull depending on the distance. As for exiting a position with the last shot being steel for me it depend on the array of targets and where I have to go next. What will change is the type of exit I will use. If I have a difficult steel to finish on I will get a make (or attempt to make) a good shot while stationary, but it it's an open paper target I may start my momentum in the direction I am exiting will firing my final shot. Just my 2 cents hope this helps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CocoBolo Posted June 12, 2013 Share Posted June 12, 2013 Shooting a steel match is great practice, well its a match but it helps you to find that balance between speed and accuracy. You may find it humbling, but as a shooter you need humbling to improve. Its all A hits, no C or D, not much movement, but excellent for draw to first shot, transition practice, and yes accuracy. You may find that a gong at 35 yards is a bit more difficult to hit at speed than the average A zone. Take the plunge got to a Steel Challenge match, get you mojo on at speed and watch the mikes pile up, then start trying to get one for one, it will make you a better shooter. Your not shoot fast until you break in to the 2's, even at 2.99 you are there, you can't get there without being able to call your shots if you look or listen for the hit you just wasted time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hi-Power Jack Posted June 12, 2013 Share Posted June 12, 2013 the guy mentioned if you are moving between shooting positions, don't leave steel as the last shot,because the IPSC targets are bigger. I usually shoot the steel first in any shooting position so I don't have to wait that extra second to see if it falls - I shoot the steel, and as I'm shooting the paper, I can see whether I have to go back and reshoot the steel - otherwise, I shoot the steel and start leaving the position, only to have to come back to the position - that wastes more time. IFF you can hear the bullet hitting steel (much more efficient than waiting to see it fall), or you are able to 100% rely on "calling the shot" - then my system doesn't matter - then you can shoot the steel 1st or last. But, I can't "hear" the steel being hit (bum ears), and I "call shots" knowing that there is a C zone backing me up - for steel, as someone mentioned, there is no back up C zone - so, I like to see the plate start to fall. That's just My Humble practice - you might want to come up with a different system that works for you:)) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark R Posted June 12, 2013 Share Posted June 12, 2013 ....A couple of the members at my club have real issues shooting falling plates and steel challenge because of it, and these guys are actually very good shots..... Sounds like these guys need to shoot some steel matches and get some practice. If they were very good shots, they wouldn't miss them, now would they? Like CocoBolo said...shooting steel matches helps with draw, transitions, and accuracy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
38supPat Posted June 12, 2013 Share Posted June 12, 2013 Cut the A zone out of a paper target and hold it up against some steel. The A zone is only 6" wide and 11" high, beside a popper the A zone looks tiny, even a mini popper has a 8" center and is 27" high and an 8" plate is 2" wider and only 3" shorter than an A zone. So really the A zone is much smaller. The problem lies in that people don't aim for the A zone on an IPSC target, they blast at the whole target so it appears bigger. Me? I'd rather shoot steel, it's huge! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
niroth81 Posted June 12, 2013 Author Share Posted June 12, 2013 That's exactly how I see it Pat. Love shooting steel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zoomy Posted June 12, 2013 Share Posted June 12, 2013 (edited) The problem I had, and sometimes revisit, is waiting to see the popper start to fall or listen for a confirmation ding before moving on to the next target.The better shooters continue shooting thru the sequence of steel and then go back to reengage any steel left standing. Steel plates still are difficult to determine at speed if hits are made. Edited June 12, 2013 by Zoomy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bikerburgess Posted June 12, 2013 Share Posted June 12, 2013 I've not been in the game long, only about 5 months, but I've heard so often that people don't like to shoot steel because its a smaller target than an IPSC classic target. A couple of the members at my club have real issues shooting falling plates and steel challenge because of it, and these guys are actually very good shots. I was watching a youtube video this evening and the guy mentioned that if you are moving between shooting positions, don't leave any steel as the last shot prior to moving positions, and cited that it's because the IPSC targets are bigger. So I'm wondering who here has the same thoughts/problems. The way I look at it, is that the steel plate, pretty much regardless of if it's a popper, falling plate or plate rack; they are all bigger than the A zone on the IPSC paper targets. Am I over simplifying it? Is there something that I haven't learned yet or figured out?? Jase the big difference between paper and steel is missing the A on paper by a little gets you a C hit and we can accept some of those but missing a piece of steel by .001" is a miss and that we cant accept. as for not leaving steel for the last target before moving that can make sense as if you call your shot as a hit and start to leave the position but you your shot call was off and the steel doesn't fall then you have to get back into position and shoot it again, where as if you call a A hit on paper but are off a little and it is a C you are still on your way to the next position. Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yelrdog Posted June 12, 2013 Share Posted June 12, 2013 My problem is that my bullet is so much smaller than the target... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vash Posted June 17, 2013 Share Posted June 17, 2013 Steel doesn't forgive, Paper does. If you consider that a piece of steel is an A zone possibly part of the C zone of a standard USPSA target think about how many shooters can hit an A every single shot at their normal speed. Plus steel is either a hit or miss. So pulling it all together, hit or miss, need to slow down, etc etc. It gets into peoples heads and steel has the reputation of being "hard". Ask the same shooters what they think of just taking a head shot on a piece of paper I bet their answer will be different than the steel answer even tho they are approx the same size. Don't let it get into your head, practice practice practice and you will learn steel isn't bad but its a target in its own class and requires its own set or methods when shooting it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benos Posted June 18, 2013 Share Posted June 18, 2013 Cut the A zone out of a paper target and hold it up against some steel. The A zone is only 6" wide and 11" high, beside a popper the A zone looks tiny, even a mini popper has a 8" center and is 27" high and an 8" plate is 2" wider and only 3" shorter than an A zone. So really the A zone is much smaller. The problem lies in that people don't aim for the A zone on an IPSC target, they blast at the whole target so it appears bigger. All true! And, the trap of shooting steel - it's easy to listen for the ding instead of properly calling the shot off what you saw when the sights lifted. If you want to learn what it takes to shoot steel - replace all the steel targets in a Steel Challenge stage with paper targets (of the same size). Then after your 5 runs, see if you have 5 hits on each paper target. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GuildSF4 Posted June 18, 2013 Share Posted June 18, 2013 If you want to learn what it takes to shoot steel - replace all the steel targets in a Steel Challenge stage with paper targets (of the same size). Then after your 5 runs, see if you have 5 hits on each paper target. I like this one Brian. Very true. Too bad I don't live in the valley anymore, Tuesday night steel was a blast. (Also too bad we don't have steel matches up here, maybe after the new range gets started... ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimmyZip Posted June 18, 2013 Share Posted June 18, 2013 When I first started practicing live fire on my own, the plate rack was my friend. I didn't have a plethora of USPSA targets I now have. In practiced primarily on plates and plates only. I have never had a steel phobia since. Steel is just another target. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jkrispies Posted June 19, 2013 Share Posted June 19, 2013 I think it's funny when I hear people complain about how hard it is to shoot steel. I'll take steel all day long. IT'S ALL MENTAL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JerZSquid Posted June 19, 2013 Share Posted June 19, 2013 I think it's funny when I hear people complain about how hard it is to shoot steel. I'll take steel all day long. IT'S ALL MENTAL. Last match I shot I did significantly better on the stages that had the most steel targets. (One stage had 21 steel ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jcarpenter82 Posted June 19, 2013 Share Posted June 19, 2013 I truely enjoyed shooting SC this past weekend despite getting rained out after 2 stages. My buddy always told me it would improve my accuracy during a uspsa match and i can see why. I quickly found out that at speed im looking too much at the f.o. dot than the topof the front sight like i should be. Had a good string on one stage and bombed the next string. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amish_rabbi Posted June 19, 2013 Share Posted June 19, 2013 I always find this odd because for me its the opposite. Steel is easy and my transitions are significantly faster on steel than paper. I assume this is because i shoot alot more steel than paper but I am working on that right now. I do like brians swap the steel for paper and will try that for sure Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevin c Posted June 20, 2013 Share Posted June 20, 2013 And, the trap of shooting steel - it's easy to listen for the ding instead of properly calling the shot off what you saw when the sights lifted. Got burned at the Nats on this - took a USP from around a barricade and heard the ding, moved on to the rest of the stage. On checking the hits I found the beastie still standing with a grease mark on the edge of the calibration circle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benos Posted June 20, 2013 Share Posted June 20, 2013 And, the trap of shooting steel - it's easy to listen for the ding instead of properly calling the shot off what you saw when the sights lifted. Got burned at the Nats on this - took a USP from around a barricade and heard the ding, moved on to the rest of the stage. On checking the hits I found the beastie still standing with a grease mark on the edge of the calibration circle. That left a mark on MANY! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shtr3 Posted June 20, 2013 Share Posted June 20, 2013 Shooting a steel match is great practice, well its a match but it helps you to find that balance between speed and accuracy. You may find it humbling, but as a shooter you need humbling to improve. Its all A hits, no C or D, not much movement, but excellent for draw to first shot, transition practice, and yes accuracy. You may find that a gong at 35 yards is a bit more difficult to hit at speed than the average A zone. Take the plunge got to a Steel Challenge match, get you mojo on at speed and watch the mikes pile up, then start trying to get one for one, it will make you a better shooter. Your not shoot fast until you break in to the 2's, even at 2.99 you are there, you can't get there without being able to call your shots if you look or listen for the hit you just wasted time. Interesting, never thought of shooting a steel match this way, but now have a different outlook on and will definitely have to get in a steel match soon, because i sucked in a stage last weekend with a 7 falling plate rack. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Phil Posted June 21, 2013 Share Posted June 21, 2013 Calling your shots on steel is the same as on paper, but, IMHO, is more crucial! If you wait to hear the "ding" you're late. If you wait to see it move, you're really late! That's why the better shooteras are on about popper or plate #5 when the 1st hits the ground. I think it takes a lot of confidence and faith to blaze on through, calling your shots and picking up the misses on the reload. More practice! Just my opinion... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chaser_2332 Posted September 24, 2013 Share Posted September 24, 2013 I had a harder time trusting and calling my shots on paper than I did steel for a long time for some reason, I have always liked shooting steel plates better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikethor Posted September 24, 2013 Share Posted September 24, 2013 I used to have a problem with steel and in fact still do from time to time and that the comment made about people just blazing away at the IPSC target without aiming at an actual spot also happens with steel. Except when you do not pick a spot to aim at on steel and miss it seems 10 x worse because you do not even shoot a c or a d you have missed completely. I'm a very new shooter to the sport but this is my observation only and what compounds the miss is what it does to your mental performance and you can end up rushing the next shot and what happens ? you miss again and you tense up and it gets worse. This is why this sport is so much fun! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bruceleroy Posted September 28, 2013 Share Posted September 28, 2013 My problem is that my bullet is so much smaller than the target... I tok have problems deciding where to put my tiny bullet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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