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question about support hand grip angle


Esther
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The other day I was shooting with my friend Alex, and he gave me a few helpful suggestions. One was to rotate my support wrist forward and downward to help control muzzle rise. I had already been angling my support hand down about 30 degrees, but not forward so that my weak hand fingers wrapped around the fingers of my strong hand more.

My question is, how much do you cant your support wrist, and how much of the angling is downward versus forward (if that makes sense)?

This might just be something I need to experiment with in live fire practice and figure out, but input would help. Thanks!

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If you watch videos of people on the super squads you will seeing variations. Vogel's wrist is rotated about as much as humanely possible, and others not so much. Expect to play with subtle variations of grip alignment and grip pressure for pretty much your whole shooting career.

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Andy and Steve - Thanks! It helps to know that good shooters do different things and that subtle variations in grip pressures and alignment will be something I will be experimenting with for a while.

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The more I work on my grip the more I find I concern myself with the contact I make with the pistol rather than the actual angle. I want the heel of my support hand to have as much contact with the left hand grip panel as possible, the fingers right up tight to the fingers of my firing hand and the index finger of my support hand right to the trigger guard. The angle is achieved when those things happen.

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Thanks, Pat! It's nice to know that even seasoned shooters like you still work on your grip.

I spent some time today Googling top shooters and their grips and experimenting with getting more of my hand in contact with the pistol's surface and having my support hand as high on the gun as possible. All of this was at home, so I couldn't experience the effect of different variations on recoil and sight tracking.

Here is a picture of the grip I ended up with. My support thumb still angles up, but less than it used to. How does that look?

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I don't think grip technique should be all that different between the sexes or even people with differing hand sizes.

The goals of a good grip are twofold:

- Get as high, and contact with as much surface area as you can

- Retain comfort and avoid the controls

I posted how I grip here -> http://www.brianenos.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=167762&st=175#entry1894522

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I found that punching my index finger out in front of my middle finger severely compromised my clamping strength on the gun... and my hand started slipping off. I don't know how you do it. Weird grip for a weird gun I guess :D

Edited by DonovanM
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I found that punching my index finger out in front of my middle finger severely compromised my clamping strength on the gun... and my hand started slipping off. I don't know how you do it. Weird grip for a weird gun I guess :D

Interesting... I shall play with that. My hand doesn't slip, but I would like to see if I get more clamping action the way you describe.

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I always go back and forth on the issue of just how much cant is necessary because from a physical standpoint, grip/clamp force is extremely compromised when the wrist is angled to an extreme degree.

If you have a tool that measures grip, test it with your wrist straight and when it is canted. There is a big difference.

Lately I guess my hand/fingers just follow the angle of the front strap/front fingers as my hand grabs over them.

Yesterday I was gripping with my support hand so hard that I removed live skin from the middle knuckle area on my strong hand. :surprise:

I am gonna order a set of CoC grippers today. I think I will start with a 2, based on what I have heard (I have been into the iron game for awhile and never use straps or any assistance devices for pulls/deadlifts/etc).

Edited by JaeOne3345
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Thanks for all the suggestions, guys!

How does this look now?

JadeOne3345 - I don't have a tool to measure grip, but my friend who works in a Neuroscience lab does. :) Starting with a 2?! Sigh.. I'm working on the 100 lb trainer. But you have to start somewhere!

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I found that punching my index finger out in front of my middle finger severely compromised my clamping strength on the gun... and my hand started slipping off. I don't know how you do it. Weird grip for a weird gun I guess :D

I found the same thjng

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Thanks for all the suggestions, guys!

How does this look now?

JadeOne3345 - I don't have a tool to measure grip, but my friend who works in a Neuroscience lab does. :) Starting with a 2?! Sigh.. I'm working on the 100 lb trainer. But you have to start somewhere!

Better!

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Thanks for all the suggestions, guys!

How does this look now?

JadeOne3345 - I don't have a tool to measure grip, but my friend who works in a Neuroscience lab does. :) Starting with a 2?! Sigh.. I'm working on the 100 lb trainer. But you have to start somewhere!

Just my .02 cents, looks like in this pic, versus the first pic, you straightened your arms a little more so it looks like your wrist angle improved. Go back and look at the other pics in this post and most of the shooters have their elbows bent very little and yours looks like they're bent a lot. Not right or wrong, my elbows are bent a lot, just different. With very bent elbows, it'll be difficult to get your wrist at the 40 degree angle that was mentioned.

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Thanks for all the suggestions, guys!

How does this look now?

JadeOne3345 - I don't have a tool to measure grip, but my friend who works in a Neuroscience lab does. :) Starting with a 2?! Sigh.. I'm working on the 100 lb trainer. But you have to start somewhere!

Sort of off topic but how did you get an XDM in CA?

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Too far forward and I end up losing my grip on my strong hand. This causes my weak hand to lose contact with the gun / strong hand. I get as high and forward as possible without loosening my grip so my hands stay together.

The only way to find that spot for you is to test in live fire. Further forward feels good in dry fire but not in recoil.

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HI5-O - Thanks! I noticed that as well, that when I hold my gun like in the second picture, my elbows straighten and that feels funny. Arg. Still working on it..

d_striker - Hahaha! You have to find an FFL in California who will do a single shot exemption for you, then find an FFL in another state who has an XDM on hand or will do a private-party transfer for you. The XDM is a really sweet gun, especially with a sick trigger installed -- good luck! :D

bthoefer - Thanks! I'm still playing with it. Live-fired a bit with the XDM this weekend and think the support hand grip in the second picture is a little too far forward to be comfortable for me (as HI5-O noticed, it also has the effect of straightening my arms as well).

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d_striker - Hahaha! You have to find an FFL in California who will do a single shot exemption for you, then find an FFL in another state who has an XDM on hand or will do a private-party transfer for you. The XDM is a really sweet gun, especially with a sick trigger installed -- good luck! :D

I don't live in CA; I was just curious as I have 3 XDm's and like the platform. I didn't realize there was a work-around to getting one in CA.

Is that an airsoft XDm in that photo?

Edited by d_striker
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