cecil Posted March 31, 2013 Share Posted March 31, 2013 i think some vendors are taking advantage of the "shortages" thus we are paying for it... but one day this will iron itself out.. and the very ones that have gouged the public will reap their rewards.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dentedr Posted March 31, 2013 Share Posted March 31, 2013 I fully understand them taking down their website to catch up with orders but the price increases are killing the people who actually shoot and not hoard. Just did the math on the bullets I predominantly use and my increased cost per year is $350. There goes one major match per year. What am I going to do...still buy them. Dammit, I hate being addicted to this game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TerryO Posted March 31, 2013 Share Posted March 31, 2013 The cost of ammo or components is really a small cost when compared to everything else about this sport. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Babaganoosh Posted March 31, 2013 Share Posted March 31, 2013 The cost of ammo or components is really a small cost when compared to everything else about this sport. How do you figure? I've doubled the cost of my pistol and rig in 2 years worth of buying components. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lee blackman Posted March 31, 2013 Share Posted March 31, 2013 Yea, ammo seems to be my biggest expense in this game. In 2000 I was shooting 45acp for what I'm reloading 9mm for now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scootertheshooter Posted April 1, 2013 Share Posted April 1, 2013 Some people simply can't understand supply and demand economics. When demand is higher than supply prices go up. That is life. Pat Obviously thats not the case all the time. There are other bullet makers who haven't raised their prices...yet. That is their choice but the reality is when more people want your product than you can sell to you can raise your prices. The only thing that will bring prices down is reduced demand and that should be happening soon as people start to realize the sky is not falling. Pat So in your opinion mg is just using the increase demand to pad their pockets? I'm not saying thats wrong but is that what you think? You told me that was wrong to do , remember? You don't like what they are doing buy a different bullet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CZ85Combat Posted April 1, 2013 Share Posted April 1, 2013 (edited) well lead sold for $0.80 a lb in July 2012, in January 2013 lead sold for $1.12lb. that is about a 40% increases in cost. now we all know that fuel has gone up, so shipping cost to get the lead delivered has gone up. they are now working 7 days a week that means overtime pay for the workers. workers going from 40 hrs to 56hrs is a 40% increases in cost. you get the same amount of bullets per hr. but you pay the workers 50% more for the extra hours, but you spread the extra cost across all bullets you make. Bottom line I do not like the increases but I under stand it. Edited April 1, 2013 by CZ85Combat Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
calvinc78 Posted April 1, 2013 Share Posted April 1, 2013 The cost of ammo or components is really a small cost when compared to everything else about this sport. I guess if u only shoot once in a while but ammo is my most expensive item Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lugnut Posted April 1, 2013 Share Posted April 1, 2013 well lead sold for $0.80 a lb in July 2012, in January 2013 lead sold for $1.12lb. that is about a 40% increases in cost. now we all know that fuel has gone up, so shipping cost to get the lead delivered has gone up. they are now working 7 days a week that means overtime pay for the workers. workers going from 40 hrs to 56hrs is a 40% increases in cost. you get the same amount of bullets per hr. but you pay the workers 50% more for the extra hours, but you spread the extra cost across all bullets you make. Bottom line I do not like the increases but I under stand it. If you look at the 5 year.... you would see that lead was even higher in 2011 and 2008.... hmmmm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Babaganoosh Posted April 1, 2013 Share Posted April 1, 2013 Some people simply can't understand supply and demand economics. When demand is higher than supply prices go up. That is life. Pat Obviously thats not the case all the time. There are other bullet makers who haven't raised their prices...yet. That is their choice but the reality is when more people want your product than you can sell to you can raise your prices. The only thing that will bring prices down is reduced demand and that should be happening soon as people start to realize the sky is not falling. Pat So in your opinion mg is just using the increase demand to pad their pockets? I'm not saying thats wrong but is that what you think? You told me that was wrong to do , remember? You don't like what they are doing buy a different bullet. You were blatantly gouging. I dont buy from anyone who does that. I dont see a problem making a little profit but dont gouge. I wont be buying mg if they are keeping those prices long term. I have a guy 20 minutes from my house who casts lead. Got 1000 124 grain 9mm for 70 bucks. Anything else ya stalker? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
outerlimits Posted April 1, 2013 Share Posted April 1, 2013 well lead sold for $0.80 a lb in July 2012, in January 2013 lead sold for $1.12lb. that is about a 40% increases in cost. now we all know that fuel has gone up, so shipping cost to get the lead delivered has gone up. they are now working 7 days a week that means overtime pay for the workers. workers going from 40 hrs to 56hrs is a 40% increases in cost. you get the same amount of bullets per hr. but you pay the workers 50% more for the extra hours, but you spread the extra cost across all bullets you make. Bottom line I do not like the increases but I under stand it. If you look at the 5 year.... you would see that lead was even higher in 2011 and 2008.... hmmmm. Yep-gouging..plain and simple. And yes, I understand supply and demand. have 35 yrs in ecomonist stuff. Econ 101 is bullsh$t. A party that hikes prices doesn't have to...period. If the component price for making bullets is stable, give and take a little here or there, and labor costs certainly are less...these folks ain't union, fuel for delivery and LNG for melting stuff has been about the same as well. S why does a company decide to hike the price because there is demand for the product? Because they can. They do not have to, but they determine people want their stuff so bad, they figure they can increase the price and make more. That is called sticking the consumer. Demand can be fixed for a cost...the result is more supply. But it's all BS in the end. Like I said, us MG customers have been assimilated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neomet Posted April 1, 2013 Share Posted April 1, 2013 It is simply laissez-faire capitalism. We have enshrined this in a minimally regulated condition in this country. If the price is too high nobody will buy and the company will not prosper. The true value of something is what someone will pay for it. The same house (also a commodity) that cost $1.2M seven years ago recently sold for 675K. Did that buyer gouge the seller? We just don't like it when the value of something we buy rises. Got it. Buy or don't buy, that is how our market self-regulates. There is no set profit (or loss) margin for anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Foxbat Posted April 1, 2013 Share Posted April 1, 2013 ...but ammo is my most expensive item That is true... but... so what? This is cost of participation in the sport. The gun in your avatar cost $4-5K - plus its upkeep - also part of the cost. In reality everyone can set the limit on his expenses and live within. Sure, I would like to attend every European match... but they are outside of my reach... I just accept it and don't lose much sleep. At least the cost of bullets has not followed the curve of gas prices... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Babaganoosh Posted April 1, 2013 Share Posted April 1, 2013 It is simply laissez-faire capitalism. We have enshrined this in a minimally regulated condition in this country. If the price is too high nobody will buy and the company will not prosper. The true value of something is what someone will pay for it. The same house (also a commodity) that cost $1.2M seven years ago recently sold for 675K. Did that buyer gouge the seller? We just don't like it when the value of something we buy rises. Got it. Buy or don't buy, that is how our market self-regulates. There is no set profit (or loss) margin for anything. I think what most peoples issue is that a lot of shooters stood by MG even though they were a bit more expensive because MG stood by us as shooters. When things got bad MG didn't just raise prices because they could. As someone else pointed out MG is on every prize table. Then again they dont give out prizes out of the goodness of their hearts, it's for advertising purposes. In todays market I think its important to let the customers know whats going on and why. Things like the internet and social media need to be utilized for spreading info. Thats what customers expect out of companies now. People aren't as brand loyal as they used to be so the companies that keep their customers informed reap the benefits. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
calvinc78 Posted April 1, 2013 Share Posted April 1, 2013 ...but ammo is my most expensive item That is true... but... so what? This is cost of participation in the sport. The gun in your avatar cost $4-5K - plus its upkeep - also part of the cost. In reality everyone can set the limit on his expenses and live within. Sure, I would like to attend every European match... but they are outside of my reach... I just accept it and don't lose much sleep. At least the cost of bullets has not followed the curve of gas prices... I'm not complaining about ammo prices, I was stating about someone saying ammo was the cheapest part of this sport, for me that's not true due to the amount I try to shoot. I have no problem with the prices at this point yet.... You got to pay to play....and the manufactures know this.... 3750 bullets at $340 is ¢9 each 3750 bullets at $370 is ¢9.8 each In the big picture of things the hike is not that great. Is it wrong I don't know Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Foxbat Posted April 1, 2013 Share Posted April 1, 2013 No, you are right, and at this point I am willing to ignore the increase, but like everyone else I will be keeping an eye on the prices - hopefully they do not cross the pain threshold! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
calvinc78 Posted April 1, 2013 Share Posted April 1, 2013 Foxbat I do agree with u if ur packing a 4 to 5 thousand dollar gun on ur hip I don't think we're at the point u should be getting mad about a $30-$40 hike on 4,000 bullets lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
warpspeed Posted April 1, 2013 Share Posted April 1, 2013 Go look at the prices for Zero Bullets. MG is right in line and far below the prices for Sierra or Hornady. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lugnut Posted April 1, 2013 Share Posted April 1, 2013 There is only one company IMO that has truly done a great job keeping prices as low as possible. I will do as much as I can to push my business through them going forward. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leewongfei Posted April 1, 2013 Share Posted April 1, 2013 There is only one company IMO that has truly done a great job keeping prices as low as possible. I will do as much as I can to push my business through them going forward. What company is that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted April 1, 2013 Share Posted April 1, 2013 (edited) While I don’t like the MG price increase, I can appreciate that they made extraordinary effort to get orders filled and their bullets available and back on the market ASAP. Also, I appreciate that they support USPSA in a big way, have been fair and responsive in all of my dealings with them, and make a good product. I certainly don’t have any issues with them being able to make a profit which is enticing enough that they stay in business and don’t choose to step out of the bullet making biz and quit offering their products. Personally, I’m hoping when the ruckus calms down and they catch up with demand that their 3 case discount will be substantial and/or they roll back the prices on the cases. We’ll see. I am a little more forgiving with MG because as much as I like MG's bullets there are other less expensive options for bullets and being a consumer I can choose those options. I may throttle back my MG purchases and do a little “dollar cost averaging” using a different (less expensive bullet) where it makes sense to lower my average reloading component costs. I remember the days of saving jacketed bullets just for matches (or even saving up to buy jacketed bullets for matches!), and for me it may become that way again. What worries me most about this ruckus is when the primer market comes back….will $35-40+/k be the new norm? Now THAT would truly suck and be deserving of a whole new thread. I don’t know of any way around buying primers… unless USPSA creates a flintlock division. Edited April 1, 2013 by Bamboo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scootertheshooter Posted April 1, 2013 Share Posted April 1, 2013 Some people simply can't understand supply and demand economics. When demand is higher than supply prices go up. That is life. Pat Obviously thats not the case all the time. There are other bullet makers who haven't raised their prices...yet. That is their choice but the reality is when more people want your product than you can sell to you can raise your prices. The only thing that will bring prices down is reduced demand and that should be happening soon as people start to realize the sky is not falling. Pat So in your opinion mg is just using the increase demand to pad their pockets? I'm not saying thats wrong but is that what you think? You told me that was wrong to do , remember? You don't like what they are doing buy a different bullet. You were blatantly gouging. I dont buy from anyone who does that. I dont see a problem making a little profit but dont gouge. I wont be buying mg if they are keeping those prices long term. I have a guy 20 minutes from my house who casts lead. Got 1000 124 grain 9mm for 70 bucks. Anything else ya stalker? That's fine if you thought I was gouging. There is no need to PM me telling me off like a whining baby just don't buy the item. Even you said I was only $10 -15 more than S&W when shipped I don't feel that was gouging. Just like you think MG is gouging don't buy them. So put on your big boy pants and deal like the rest of us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neomet Posted April 2, 2013 Share Posted April 2, 2013 It is simply laissez-faire capitalism. We have enshrined this in a minimally regulated condition in this country. If the price is too high nobody will buy and the company will not prosper. The true value of something is what someone will pay for it. The same house (also a commodity) that cost $1.2M seven years ago recently sold for 675K. Did that buyer gouge the seller? We just don't like it when the value of something we buy rises. Got it. Buy or don't buy, that is how our market self-regulates. There is no set profit (or loss) margin for anything. I think what most peoples issue is that a lot of shooters stood by MG even though they were a bit more expensive because MG stood by us as shooters. When things got bad MG didn't just raise prices because they could. As someone else pointed out MG is on every prize table. Then again they dont give out prizes out of the goodness of their hearts, it's for advertising purposes. In todays market I think its important to let the customers know whats going on and why. Things like the internet and social media need to be utilized for spreading info. Thats what customers expect out of companies now. People aren't as brand loyal as they used to be so the companies that keep their customers informed reap the benefits. Gotta disagree with ya there. I've got no idea what the cost to produce is for my refrigerator, the lamp next to me or this computer. On the list of things I consider for any purchase the profit margin of the manufacture doesn't even hit my radar and frankly I have never seen it in any advertising for any product. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chowellacsbd Posted April 2, 2013 Share Posted April 2, 2013 (edited) MGs sites all jammed up again. Either people are hitting it like crazy trying to get through to place an order or their cutting edge, frame-based design is finally showing its age. Why do websites in the firearm market ALL suck...? It's 2013, not 1993... Edited April 2, 2013 by chowellacsbd Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Sahlberg Posted April 2, 2013 Share Posted April 2, 2013 All of Team Montana Gold appreciates the extra work that Montana Gold does to both sponsor 20+ shooters but also the 100s of Matches that are also sponsored by their generosity as this is their main source of advertising......and they have done this for 20+ years. Thank you Norm & Jolene! I would further suggest the spokesman behind Babaganoosh, come up to Kalispell, MT and show Norm & Jolene just how his buddy can make bullets for $70/1000, then duplicate that over the next several million bullets being made in the coming month. While he is there, lets also give him Jolene's office for a day trying to respond to phones, faxes, and emails for a week to see why they seem so slow. Bill & Adam Sahlberg, Montana Gold sponsored shooters for 15+ years Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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