old506 Posted March 3, 2013 Share Posted March 3, 2013 I have been shooting this drill for 4 Live Fire Sessions now: 3 Metrics, one to my left at 15yds (3 yards from the center line), one in front of me 3yds (on the center line) and one to my right 20yds (3 yards from the center line). On the beep, hands relaxed at sides, draw shoot each target twice, left to right, reload, shoot each target twice left to right. The first couple of days I was shooting it in the mid 6’s with a low of 5.82. I was frustrated with my speed. I was calling each shot, shooting 95% or so but I just couldn’t bust into the low 5’s or mid/low 4’s (my guess what a GM would do?). Speed Mode… Today, I go out and say “to heck with points”. I yanked the pistol and shot at each target twice with zero regard to points or calling my shots, reloaded and shot at each target again. First run was a 4.2. Boy that felt good, that felt fast! I start to feel anxious, not scared anxious, not anxiety, just this feeling that I have to get to everything faster, quicker, kind of like I need to be in a hurry. I start to feel adrenaline and I start to feel like I am “in the zone”. Next run I say to myself, “keep the speed and call the shots”. A 4.95 with 5 C’s (91% points). Next, a 4.85 with 3 D’s (85%). Ok, back it down a bit, 5.11 all A’s. Last rep was a 4.33 3C’s and 2 Delta’s. Here is where I am scratching my head…… The 5.11 all Alpha run and 4.33 run (even with 2 Delta’s) was basically the same HF, actually the 4.33 is a little higher. The question is, is it better? Is this where I want to be? Do I want to practice here? It really, really felt aggressive, felt like I was driving the gun hard but what comes first? Should I continue to practice in this mode? Should I keep driving the gun this hard ( or harder). In this mode everything was lost except I was "seeing what I needed to see" to get my hits. Now, that didn't always mean an alpha but does that matter in practice? Will the alpha's come latter? Can I drive the gun hard and wait for the hits to show up latter with dryfire, honing my vision/index/trigger prep? Frankly, I am sick and tired of losing a stage by a second or two (speed wise). In the match I stay right up there because I shoot 95% or so points but I am behind on speed by a second or so. I have to get that second back (and more). Somehow. I haven't had more then two penalties at a match in at least a year, maybe quite longer. Part of me just feels like I need to just try to crash and burn. I loved the aggressive, anxious feeling (I don't know how to explain it other then that). Don't know if I should feel it? I liked it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ben Stoeger Posted March 3, 2013 Share Posted March 3, 2013 The 5.11 all Alpha run and 4.33 run (even with 2 Delta’s) was basically the same HF, actually the 4.33 is a little higher. The question is, is it better? Is this where I want to be? Do I want to practice here? It really, really felt aggressive, felt like I was driving the gun hard but what comes first? Should I continue to practice in this mode? Should I keep driving the gun this hard ( or harder). In this mode everything was lost except I was "seeing what I needed to see" to get my hits. Now, that didn't always mean an alpha but does that matter in practice? Will the alpha's come latter? Can I drive the gun hard and wait for the hits to show up latter with dryfire, honing my vision/index/trigger prep? Frankly, I am sick and tired of losing a stage by a second or two (speed wise). In the match I stay right up there because I shoot 95% or so points but I am behind on speed by a second or so. I have to get that second back (and more). Somehow. I haven't had more then two penalties at a match in at least a year, maybe quite longer. Part of me just feels like I need to just try to crash and burn. I loved the aggressive, anxious feeling (I don't know how to explain it other then that). Don't know if I should feel it? I liked it. 1. You need to learn to be fast AND accurate. You may as well force the speed and work the accuracy, instead of what you had been doing. 2.Why not keep going? If it is new and different you are probably learning. 3.Yes. It matters in practice. You are learning and building habits. 4. The alphas wont happen by magic. You need to make them happen. You need to go fast but be unhappy if you are getting Ds. 5.Yes 6.Glad you enjoyed it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old506 Posted March 3, 2013 Author Share Posted March 3, 2013 So on #3, Should I back off or just throttle down and figure out how to get my hits? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old506 Posted March 4, 2013 Author Share Posted March 4, 2013 Today I set up the drill in the backyard and dryfired it to death. I got it down to 3.1 seconds, all A's. What I found out is that if I grip the crap out of the gun, I can get Alpha's. Hope it replicates in live fire tomorrow. I plan on just ripping the pistol out, gripping the crap of it and "see" what happens. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ben Stoeger Posted March 4, 2013 Share Posted March 4, 2013 So on #3, Should I back off or just throttle down and figure out how to get my hits? You already know how to get the hits going slow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old506 Posted March 5, 2013 Author Share Posted March 5, 2013 Tried gripping the crap out of the gun and driving it hard. Picked up a few more points here and there but I'm not finished. I think I have to focus on trigger manipulation. I'm not seeing it pre shot but I am pushing shots. I was hoping that gripping the crap out of the gun would allow me to get away with a little "slap", I have to figure out how to slap without moving the gun at mach 3. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toothguy Posted March 5, 2013 Share Posted March 5, 2013 Tried gripping the crap out of the gun and driving it hard. Picked up a few more points here and there but I'm not finished. I think I have to focus on trigger manipulation. I'm not seeing it pre shot but I am pushing shots. I was hoping that gripping the crap out of the gun would allow me to get away with a little "slap", I have to figure out how to slap without moving the gun at mach 3. These helped me & i've been shooting for a long time: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Azb3q8wOrV4 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_h9rKDEXPvM If you're not familiar with Ron or Travis just do a google search. The Najaf, Iraq video of Travis is a good one (understatement). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Anderson Posted March 7, 2013 Share Posted March 7, 2013 When speed becomes normal, all you have to do is decide to shoot Alphas. It works well to separate the two ideas. Practice can be for speed, match is for Alphas. Once you know how to shoot and call Alphas and develop the discipline to do so...you can (and should) practice Speed all you want. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old506 Posted April 4, 2013 Author Share Posted April 4, 2013 Well, it took five weeks of DF twice a day and Live Fire 2-3 X's a week but I worked it out. Time to throw up some NS's on them....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toothguy Posted April 4, 2013 Share Posted April 4, 2013 old506, could you go into more detail about how you worked it out? Grip, trigger ect. Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old506 Posted April 4, 2013 Author Share Posted April 4, 2013 I have to be able to pull the trigger straight back without moving the sights and do it really, really fast. In order to do that I have to grip the gun really, really hard. In order to grip the gun really hard I have to have a perfect draw. So, I drew the gun a kabillion times until I could get 10 perfect draws in a row or my arms were too weak to go anymore, from each position (relaxed, surrender, turn/draw, on the "x's"). Perfect in that I my weak hand had as much purchase/grip that I can get. I do this twice a day. Then I worked on transitions so that I could see my sight just about as good as I can (at this point) where my eyes are focused. I wanted my sights on the transition to catch up to my eyes, exactly where my eyes are and have my eyes focused on Alpha's. I took half a day and practiced misaligning my sights (from a bench) and shooting at all kinds of distances to see how much I could get away with to get an Alpha, what a Charlie looked like, what a Delta looked like and what a Mike looked like, out to 50. I then drew sight pics in a note pad and made notes on every sight pic. I looked at these all the time but am looking at them less now. I felt like a weanie because my arms hurt or felt "dead" so I started to do more pushups/pullups/weights and grip strengthening. Then I went to the range and I couldn't miss a thing and I wasn't shooting any Delta's and I was shaving off time on transitions and splits. It was a miracle! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toothguy Posted April 4, 2013 Share Posted April 4, 2013 Excellent, thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Links69 Posted April 9, 2013 Share Posted April 9, 2013 Great feedback there Old 506. especially for a newbie like me who's trying to find my feet. Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kylehb Posted March 29, 2014 Share Posted March 29, 2014 I like training at both extremes... trying to make my accurate a little faster, and my fast a little more accurate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eric nielsen Posted April 3, 2014 Share Posted April 3, 2014 This is a very good thread, thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lknbigfish Posted April 13, 2014 Share Posted April 13, 2014 This is a very good thread, thanks. agreed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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