1911 FOR CCW?

[motosapiens]

For good or bad, we're all different and the best CCW gun for each of us is going to be different. Some should have a really long heavy trigger pull to hand to the jury to convince them it wasn't an accidental discharge. Most are probably well suited with striker fired designs. A very few may be best served with the cocked and locked variants.

I love the 1911 design and the 2011 updates, but they're not the best choice for concealed carry for everyone. A good carry trigger on one might be say 4.0 pounds with little pretravel and almost no overtravel. This would require a very calm person to use properly when faced with an armed miscreant or hoodlum. The danger of an accidental discharge (remember you're already cocked and locked) is very real. The ideal person for such a gun would practice regularly and perhaps have even experience with holding people at gun point (perhaps even twenty years of law enforcement experience including ten years in LA/DC/CHI/NY (or some other hell hole, excuse me, I mean a... large metropolitan city), much time on various taskforces, and a year or more in the violent street gang unit, etc. And thousands of arrest, not to mention the hundreds of hours of court time and experience. And the final best case scenario additionally would include that our good guy's adrenalin glands should not function.

Sorry it's the story of my life and the well meaning gun store clerks still offer helpful advice such as, "The 1911 (or some other nice SA only semiauto) is the absolutely worst carry choice you can make!"

Sorry, if i'm pointing a gun at someone, my intent will be to shoot that person, not just point it and hope the problem goes away.

But perhaps there is some data to suggest that 1911's have more AD's than striker fired pistols.... I think there might be a reason the condition is called 'glock-leg'. lol.

[G34 CORDY]

The cocked and locked comment I find interesting because yes the hammer is back but there is a grip safety that has to be pushed while pulling the trigger and a manual safety. All of this has to happen for it to go bang, unlike the Glock where you just pull the trigger and it goes bang also the safety is on the trigger so when you pull the trigger off goes the safety.

[chirpy]

I bought a LW Colt Officers ACP long before Ohio had CCW. The LW is recommended ,as most reliable of the Officers ACP models available, by a well known 1911 gs that I trust, Bill Laughridge. It has been lightly modified by my local gs. I used it in IDPA before Ohio CCW and now carry it and still use it to shoot IDPA. Granted it is not my only CCW pistol but it is my oldest.

FWIW

Richard

[jeffbird]

+1 for not carrying an ambi - unless you find a holster which blocks the safety up - and please post it, if you do.

The left side safety is molded into the leather on the Milt Sparks VM2, which keeps it firmly in place.

Crossbreed Supertuck allows it to shift off occasionally.

Edited June 14, 2013 by jeffbird

[jevan126]

Yes the 1911 is more than reliable enough if you have the right 1911. I have a GUNCRAFTER INDUSTRIES NO NAME and trust my life with it. If you get a quality 1911 you will have no problem, look at Les Baer, Ed Brown, Wilson Combat, Guncrafter Industries, Dan Wesson, ruger, and Colt 1911's.

[atbarr]

I would carry a Glock and its just alittle wide and not as comfortable.

I carry a G36, nice and thin. 6 + 1 is more than enough. I use an IWB Razor, I don't even know I'm carrying it.

[GreenDragon64]

Kahr makes a few different profile barrel and frame profiles and ranges in calibers up to .45. The XDS is a very nice pistol. Short pretravel and very little overtravel, along with a short reset.

[Wilson]

I would carry the one that you shoot best and is most comfortable for you. All the major brands will be reliable.

My 2 cents.

[pjb45]

I was at the shot show when SA introduced the EMP. I thought it was a pretty good idea. Bill L at C&S had developed what I thought was the prototype of the platform.

I shoot only the 1911 platform in competition, SVs to be more accurate.

When I decided I was going to get my CCW I wanted to stay on that platform, sure my PPK and BHP were good enough but I felt the EMP was the best way to go.

My newly purchased EMP was firing low and left. I called SA, sent it back with the target and the gun was returned a week or so later with the problem fixed.

My critical success factors were: reliability, familiar platform, warranty. The SA EMP fit the bill more than any other available platform.

I have a couple of great holsters for it, this makes all the difference in the world. Don't go cheap on the holster.

I used the same ammo in my CCW gun as in my competition gun. I don't buy in the 'nothing less than a number 4 in the caliber' mentality or I have to have the most super duper powerful charge either. That is just me. My local range has a BUG match the last Saturday of the month. My observation is the mega powered 45ACP in a small frame is slower on pairs-even slower on draws ( I suspect because the shooter is anticipating the recoil) I can shoot my 9mm all day without any problems.

[atbarr]

For several years, I carried a .45 Trojan in a Milt Sparks VMII. After a few weeks, I never even felt the gun. Don't go cheap on a holster, or a belt. I own two belts from http://www.thebeltman.net/, both are almost 5 years old. Neither one sags.

I recently purchased a G36. It's now my EDC. Very thin and concealable. I use a Blade-Tech IWB Razor. I forget I'm wearing it.

[Bob DuBois]

Kimber Pro Elite, 45acp. It's an older model with out the firing pin block usually in a Galco paddle holster.

Pistol has thin grips, nite sights and an arched mainspring housing along with ambi safety's.

Times when I need a pocket pistol a Seecamp in 25acp, was left to me by my Uncle worked for him and still works for me.

[4Rules]

Hey all, I have been looking at different options for a ccw gun and what comes to mind so far is a 1911 still unsure of maker, Glock 26 or 30s and something from CZ. I would like a 1911 because its slim and comfortable to carry, .45acp and I shoot the 1911 pretty good but what worries me is are they reliable enough for ccw? I hear some people love shooting the 1911 but would not carry it so thats why I turn to you guys for some advice on the 1911 to carry.

"...If you are the kind of guy that doesn’t mind tinkering with your Harley Davidson motorcycle to keep it running then you are a candidate. If however you treat your pistols like we all treat our lawnmowers then don’t get a 1911..."

[frag316]

You know, I've seen lots of people say stuff like this and it's bothered me.

Why?

People lambast the 1911 as too twitchy when they run a 1200-round tactical class and it jams when the tupperware (regardless of maker) doesn't.

Here's the problem--it's a CARRY GUN. If you're at all diligent about maintenance, you won't carry your gun (regardless of model) dirty from firing 600 rounds thru it. It'll be clean and functioning properly. If you're not diligent about maintenance, get a revolver and be done with it.

It's a bullshit argument, regardless of whether Larry Vickers makes it or Caleb Giddings or that Ham guy at 10-8 or Rob Pincus, because your EDC won't mimic the conditions which caused the gun to fail in the class.

If you're talking about carrying a 1911 as a combat gun in some place like Iraq or Afghanistan, there's more credibility to this argument, but that requires a gun with looser tolerances, too, so probably not the same gun as Joe Public CCW holder buys.

[4Rules]

If you say so.

[pawe]

I won't hesitate to carry a 1911. Yes, lint and dust and all those dirty small stuff can get trapped because of the tight tolerance but I like cleaning my guns all the time anyway...and I don't think lint will make a quality gun malfunction just like that.

Kahr pm9 during the summer.

Here's mine:

[hax]

I carry a para 1911 slim hawg. It is the smallest 1911 45 that I could find. It is smaller than the defender or the agent. In the summer I must carry iwb but its not that bad and not to hard to conceal. I have a write up of the gun under factory guns -> para. I have put over 1000 rounds through it without any hiccups. I'm very happy with the gun and it has a a lot of upgrades like a ramped barrel and so on.

[Aglifter]

and I don't think lint will make a quality gun malfunction just like that.

A surprisingly small amount of lint will render a P226 inoperable, if it gets over the firing pin.

[Nik Habicht]

You know, I've seen lots of people say stuff like this and it's bothered me.

Why?

People lambast the 1911 as too twitchy when they run a 1200-round tactical class and it jams when the tupperware (regardless of maker) doesn't.

Here's the problem--it's a CARRY GUN. If you're at all diligent about maintenance, you won't carry your gun (regardless of model) dirty from firing 600 rounds thru it. It'll be clean and functioning properly. If you're not diligent about maintenance, get a revolver and be done with it.

It's a bullshit argument, regardless of whether Larry Vickers makes it or Caleb Giddings or that Ham guy at 10-8 or Rob Pincus, because your EDC won't mimic the conditions which caused the gun to fail in the class.

If you're talking about carrying a 1911 as a combat gun in some place like Iraq or Afghanistan, there's more credibility to this argument, but that requires a gun with looser tolerances, too, so probably not the same gun as Joe Public CCW holder buys.

I certainly wouldn't trust a "just field-stripped and cleaned" gun for carry/home defense.....

[Scootertheshooter]

You know, I've seen lots of people say stuff like this and it's bothered me.

Why?

People lambast the 1911 as too twitchy when they run a 1200-round tactical class and it jams when the tupperware (regardless of maker) doesn't.

Here's the problem--it's a CARRY GUN. If you're at all diligent about maintenance, you won't carry your gun (regardless of model) dirty from firing 600 rounds thru it. It'll be clean and functioning properly. If you're not diligent about maintenance, get a revolver and be done with it.

It's a bullshit argument, regardless of whether Larry Vickers makes it or Caleb Giddings or that Ham guy at 10-8 or Rob Pincus, because your EDC won't mimic the conditions which caused the gun to fail in the class.

If you're talking about carrying a 1911 as a combat gun in some place like Iraq or Afghanistan, there's more credibility to this argument, but that requires a gun with looser tolerances, too, so probably not the same gun as Joe Public CCW holder buys.

I certainly wouldn't trust a "just field-stripped and cleaned" gun for carry/home defense.....

How often do you completely tear down your gun then as a EDC . How many rounds through it?

[frag316]

You know, I've seen lots of people say stuff like this and it's bothered me.

Why?

People lambast the 1911 as too twitchy when they run a 1200-round tactical class and it jams when the tupperware (regardless of maker) doesn't.

Here's the problem--it's a CARRY GUN. If you're at all diligent about maintenance, you won't carry your gun (regardless of model) dirty from firing 600 rounds thru it. It'll be clean and functioning properly. If you're not diligent about maintenance, get a revolver and be done with it.

It's a bullshit argument, regardless of whether Larry Vickers makes it or Caleb Giddings or that Ham guy at 10-8 or Rob Pincus, because your EDC won't mimic the conditions which caused the gun to fail in the class.

If you're talking about carrying a 1911 as a combat gun in some place like Iraq or Afghanistan, there's more credibility to this argument, but that requires a gun with looser tolerances, too, so probably not the same gun as Joe Public CCW holder buys.

I certainly wouldn't trust a "just field-stripped and cleaned" gun for carry/home defense.....

Why not? That sentence doesn't even make any sense.

I agree with the sentiment that if you don't want to maintain your CCW gun, go out and buy a plastic gun and be happy. There's nothing wrong with that.

But I shoot a 1911 style gun competitively, so I have FAR more trigger time on it than any other gun I own. Why would I handicap myself for CCW by carrying a gun I don't shoot regularly? If it's well-maintained (which doesn't mean you have to detail strip it every time it's fired), then there's no problem.

That's a bullshit statement, too.

[frag316]

You know, I've seen lots of people say stuff like this and it's bothered me. Why? People lambast the 1911 as too twitchy when they run a 1200-round tactical class and it jams when the tupperware (regardless of maker) doesn't. Here's the problem--it's a CARRY GUN. If you're at all diligent about maintenance, you won't carry your gun (regardless of model) dirty from firing 600 rounds thru it. It'll be clean and functioning properly. If you're not diligent about maintenance, get a revolver and be done with it. It's a bullshit argument, regardless of whether Larry Vickers makes it or Caleb Giddings or that Ham guy at 10-8 or Rob Pincus, because your EDC won't mimic the conditions which caused the gun to fail in the class. If you're talking about carrying a 1911 as a combat gun in some place like Iraq or Afghanistan, there's more credibility to this argument, but that requires a gun with looser tolerances, too, so probably not the same gun as Joe Public CCW holder buys.

I certainly wouldn't trust a "just field-stripped and cleaned" gun for carry/home defense.....

How often do you completely tear down your gun then as a EDC . How many rounds through it?

Personally, I shoot my EDC about once a quarter. The reason why is that I shoot a 1911 in USPSA, and the guns are almost identical. I just like to shoot my EDC occasionally, because I don't want it to get lonely.

I don't detail strip any of my 1911s but about once per year--usually before putting them up for the season (I live in Illinois, so I don't compete from November thru about March, depending on the weather). I do a function check on them when I pull them out at the beginning of the season and run a match with them to see if there's anything that needs to be done.

With my EDC, I generally detail strip it once a year, usually at the beginning of the competition season (that way I don't have to detail strip three 1911s all at once).

Other than that, I field strip and clean after each shooting session.

[frag316]

If you say so.

Yeah, that's useful. Why not expound on your argument, rather than just throwing in a comment from the side. Otherwise, why bother posting?

[motosapiens]

I certainly wouldn't trust a "just field-stripped and cleaned" gun for carry/home defense.....

Do you often put the gun together incorrectly?

I certainly *prefer* to get in one last shooting session before a match after cleaning my gun, but so far, it has never failed to work properly after I put it back together.

[thegunnerd]

I shoot 1911's and 2011s in uspsa and 3 gun. i love the 1911 platform , i really dislike shooting plastic guns......that being said: My carry gun is a G19 . Now i won't get into caliber stuff , but i will say that i chose the glock for a few reasons.

Point and shoot, no external safeties to manipulate ( save for the trigger safety but that isn't a similar type of safety to the 1911 thumb safety )

The glock ( and trust me , i can't stand the grip angle or trigger ) requires less upkeep and will function in more adverse conditions then a 1911 ( i'm generalizing ) with less lube , more grit and crud . It still goes bang

double stack ammo capacity and concealability at the same time

It will never have a 1911 trigger and it's not as ergonomically shaped . To me the grip angle will always be wrong , but i carry it because it is one of the best fighting pistols made to date. I like the m&p as well but it suffers in the capacity area when you get to the compact models , as does the ruger . I don't trust XDs anymore as i have personally broken a trigger bar and found a design flaw in it that could tank on you at the worst time ( perhaps in the middle of a match ? as it did me , or maybe when it REALLY counts )

I love my 1911s , and i mean that , i love them. But for the above reasons i carry a g19 . I know incredibly talented gunsmiths who don't carry their own guns and carry g19s . Not saying you need to get a glock 19 but just an example of a dif tool for a dif purpose

[promod1385]

I have a scandium framed S&W in commander size. Its been a great gun, I run CMC Power+ Mags and it is extremely reliable! The only change has been the addition of a 23lb Wolff spring. I like to think the heavier spring helps buffer the frame a bit, as it is scandium it will eventually fatigue and fail.