Open Glock Kaboom

[glocklover]

9MAJOR can and is loaded multiple times. No need to use it once and toss it. Threads like this cause that rumor to spread like wild fire! I think you stuffed a 147 where it should not have been. It's longer so it was pressed in deeper. You still tried to run it at MAJOR PF with 7 grains of powder. Also looks like nickle plated brass which gets more brittle than standard brass.

You can not just substitute a much heavier bullet and "guess" at the powder charge. Recipe for disaster.

Glad you are OK. No way I would try to make MAJOR in 9mm with a 147.

Before this I used 8grs of hs6 with a 124gr MG. Wouldn't using less powder 7grs with a 147gr bullet be the same chamber pressure?

So you are saying you chronoed the load that blew your gun apart? I am in no way trying to be a wise ass but your last two sentences make it clear you don't understand a few basic concepts of load development. There is no way you could know what the pressure is going to be by adding a 23 grain heavier bullet and dropping a charge by one grain! Pressure does not work that way. You can develop a load that barely makes minor PF that still exhibits extremely high pressure signs.

I started with 5grs of hs6 and worked my way up to 7grs to make major and I did not see any signs of the chamber pressure being to high. There were no signs of the primer being blown out nor did the brass show signs of bulging. How do you devlop your loads?

[Rick88]

Sounds like bad brass did you run them through a case gauge? bulged brass wont go into battery but can still be fired in a glock. Oh and go back to 124s.

Edit to add let them lay after 3 reloads, minor guys will thank you for the still good brass and you wont have to worry about a blow out.

Edited February 13, 2013 by Rick88

[Sarge]

Sounds like you did do a methodical load development. Your only mistake is the assumptions regarding pressure. I think a 147 at major PF is going to cause problems.

[glocklover]

Sounds like bad brass did you run them through a case gauge? bulged brass wont go into battery but can still be fired in a glock. Oh and go back to 124s.

Edit to add let them lay after 3 reloads, minor guys will thank you for the still good brass and you wont have to worry about a blow out.

Thanks, I'll go back to the 124s. I think I need to load my bullets longer.

[Poppa Bear]

Get a good case gauge. Be careful when you size the brass. If you feel any extra resistance in the sizing operation inspect the brass to make sure it is not damaged. Most brass hitting the end of its useful life exhibits signs of its impending failure at this stage.

One of our local shooters buys once fired brass from the range by the roughly 5,000 count box for the scrap brass price. He drops his fired brass into the garbage just to make sure nobody else tries to reload it.

[superdude]

Sounds like you did do a methodical load development. Your only mistake is the assumptions regarding pressure. I think a 147 at major PF is going to cause problems.

I'm not sure why a 147 grain bullet would be a problem. The general trend in load data is that heavier bullets tend to achieve a higher power factor than light bullets when loaded to the same pressure with the same gunpowder. Thus, all else being equal, a 147 grain bullet should generate less pressure than a lighter bullet when loaded to the same powder factor.

Wrong I do believe

Holding all other factors equal, a heaver bullet will generate higher pressure. It takes more time to get a 147g moving than a 124g. Added time means more pressure develops in the chamber.

You are correct that, at the same pressure, a 147 will have a higher PF than a 124, but you would use less powder behind the 147 to get the same pressure as the 124. If you use the same amount of powder in both loads, you will have higher pressure with the 147. All other factors held constant such a seating depth, bullet type, etc. Comparing a plated 147 to a jacketed 124 or having one setting deeper in the case changes everything.

Sounds like you did do a methodical load development. Your only mistake is the assumptions regarding pressure. I think a 147 at major PF is going to cause problems.

I'm not sure why a 147 grain bullet would be a problem. The general trend in load data is that heavier bullets tend to achieve a higher power factor than light bullets when loaded to the same pressure with the same gunpowder. Thus, all else being equal, a 147 grain bullet should generate less pressure than a lighter bullet when loaded to the same powder power factor.

Edited because I initially spelled power as powder. This might have cause confusion. Sorry. That said, there is no such thing as powder factor.

Edited February 13, 2013 by superdude

[dskinsler83]

Sounds like you did do a methodical load development. Your only mistake is the assumptions regarding pressure. I think a 147 at major PF is going to cause problems.

I'm not sure why a 147 grain bullet would be a problem. The general trend in load data is that heavier bullets tend to achieve a higher power factor than light bullets when loaded to the same pressure with the same gunpowder. Thus, all else being equal, a 147 grain bullet should generate less pressure than a lighter bullet when loaded to the same powder factor.

Wrong I do believe

[jlamphere]

Holding all other factors equal, a heaver bullet will generate higher pressure. It takes more time to get a 147g moving than a 124g. Added time means more pressure develops in the chamber.

You are correct that, at the same pressure, a 147 will have a higher PF than a 124, but you would use less powder behind the 147 to get the same pressure as the 124. If you use the same amount of powder in both loads, you will have higher pressure with the 147. All other factors held constant such a seating depth, bullet type, etc. Comparing a plated 147 to a jacketed 124 or having one setting deeper in the case changes everything.

Edited February 13, 2013 by jlamphere

[superdude]

Holding all other factors equal, a heaver bullet will generate higher pressure. It takes more time to get a 147g moving than a 124g. Added time means more pressure develops in the chamber.

You are correct that, at the same pressure, a 147 will have a higher PF than a 124, but you would use less powder behind the 147 to get the same pressure as the 124. If you use the same amount of powder in both loads, you will have higher pressure with the 147. All other factors held constant such a seating depth, bullet type, etc. Comparing a plated 147 to a jacketed 124 or having one setting deeper in the case changes everything.

That was what I said.

Sounds like you did do a methodical load development. Your only mistake is the assumptions regarding pressure. I think a 147 at major PF is going to cause problems.

I'm not sure why a 147 grain bullet would be a problem. The general trend in load data is that heavier bullets tend to achieve a higher power factor than light bullets when loaded to the same pressure with the same gunpowder. Thus, all else being equal, a 147 grain bullet should generate less pressure than a lighter bullet when loaded to the same powder factor.

Wrong I do believe

My suggestion is supported by load data from Ramshot for 9mm and 38 Super with both True Blue and Silhouette for jacketed and lead bullets.

the manual can be downloaded from here: http://www.ramshot.com/load-data/

Edited February 13, 2013 by superdude

[pyrrhic3gun]

OAL?

Don't know what the max is in a Glock, but I wouldn't suggest trying major at standard 9x19 lengths. Just looked at Hodgdon's loading info and the max is 5.0 of HS6 under a 147...that's a long way from 7.

Did you check to make sure the bullet wasn't jammed into the lands when it first chambered? That'll jump the pressure a bunch.

Also, you have to have a fully supported chamber, no deep ramping.

[glocklover]

OAL?

Don't know what the max is in a Glock, but I wouldn't suggest trying major at standard 9x19 lengths. Just looked at Hodgdon's loading info and the max is 5.0 of HS6 under a 147...that's a long way from 7.

Did you check to make sure the bullet wasn't jammed into the lands when it first chambered? That'll jump the pressure a bunch.

Also, you have to have a fully supported chamber, no deep ramping.

I checked my Oal. It was 1.07. Way to short.

[glocklover]

If I went to a 115gr bullet it would be safer than a 124gr bullet?

[glocklover]

If I went to a 115gr bullet I would have to throw the bullet 1450 fps. Wow.

[Poppa Bear]

If you are shooting out of a Glock you should be using an OAL of around 1.155" up to maybe 1.160". That is the general max length that will fit inside a Glock mag. If I were shooting 9 Major I would NOT load anything at less than 1.145"

[superdude]

A lighter bullet will usually require higher pressure to make major than a heavy bullet, based on published load data and pressures.

Your OAL for the 147 grain load was really short. Is that because the bullet could not be loaded longer and still fit in your chamber?

If so, maybe you just need a different bullet - which can still be 147 grains. The general rule for keeping pressure low is to load as long as possible. In the case of a Glock 9mm, you would want a bullet loaded to around the 1.169" max OAL that will still fit in the magazine. If your barrel has a short throat, this might be difficult. But you can look for a bullet with a long nose.

[Yardbird]

A lighter bullet will usually require higher pressure to make major than a heavy bullet, based on published load data and pressures.

Your OAL for the 147 grain load was really short. Is that because the bullet could not be loaded longer and still fit in your chamber?

If so, maybe you just need a different bullet - which can still be 147 grains. The general rule for keeping pressure low is to load as long as possible. In the case of a Glock 9mm, you would want a bullet loaded to around the 1.169" max OAL that will still fit in the magazine. If your barrel has a short throat, this might be difficult. But you can look for a bullet with a long nose.

A heavier bullet will create more pressure with the same/ similar powder charge.

1.160 is about max in a Glock magazine.

[superdude]

A heavier bullet will create more pressure with the same/ similar powder charge.

1.160 is about max in a Glock magazine.

Yes, a heavier bullet will create more pressure with the same powder charge. But we're talking about making the same power factor. A heavier bullet will require less gunpowder to make the same power factor. That, in itself, does not say anything about the pressure required to make the same power factor, but published data suggests that the heavier bullet will be able to make the same power factor with less pressure when using the same gunpowder.

[glocklover]

I loaded a round out to 1.60 and it fit the mag and my barrel. But I'm still confused.

[glocklover]

A lighter bullet will usually require higher pressure to make major than a heavy bullet, based on published load data and pressures.

Your OAL for the 147 grain load was really short. Is that because the bullet could not be loaded longer and still fit in your chamber?

If so, maybe you just need a different bullet - which can still be 147 grains. The general rule for keeping pressure low is to load as long as possible. In the case of a Glock 9mm, you would want a bullet loaded to around the 1.169" max OAL that will still fit in the magazine. If your barrel has a short throat, this might be difficult. But you can look for a bullet with a long nose.

A heavier bullet will create more pressure with the same/ similar powder charge.

1.160 is about max in a Glock magazine.

In order to be at 165 power factor I either need to have a light bullet with more powder or a heavier bullet with less powder. Whats safer? Which one is the chamber pressure lower? Or are they the same?

[glocklover]

A heavier bullet will create more pressure with the same/ similar powder charge.

1.160 is about max in a Glock magazine.

Yes, a heavier bullet will create more pressure with the same powder charge. But we're talking about making the same power factor. A heavier bullet will require less gunpowder to make the same power factor. That, in itself, does not say anything about the pressure required to make the same power factor, but published data suggests that the heavier bullet will be able to make the same power factor

with less pressure when using the same gunpowder.

So, a heavier bullet is safer than a light bullet?

[Poppa Bear]

Since 9 Major is an Open gun load you want a lighter bullet with more powder. You are relying on the gasses to make the comp work. A lighter bullet moves quicker and opens up the area between the case and the bullet quicker so even as the pressure is coming up the overall area is increasing which helps to flatten out the pressure curve. These excess gasses then exhaust out the comp and help keep the muzzle down.

[Poppa Bear]

A heavier bullet will create more pressure with the same/ similar powder charge.

1.160 is about max in a Glock magazine.

Yes, a heavier bullet will create more pressure with the same powder charge. But we're talking about making the same power factor. A heavier bullet will require less gunpowder to make the same power factor. That, in itself, does not say anything about the pressure required to make the same power factor, but published data suggests that the heavier bullet will be able to make the same power factor

with less pressure when using the same gunpowder.

So, a heavier bullet is safer than a light bullet?

There is a reason that most shooters use 115 or 124 gr bullets for 9 Major. We are NOT talking 9mm Luger here.

[latech15]

Take this as a wake up call and quit it with the open glock. Even with the right load, it still isn't going to be anywhere near a real open gun.

I haven't seen anywhere where you actually answered yes or no to the chrono question. Do you have one and are you using it to develop loads? Some of the statements that you are making lead me to believe that you are relatively new to reloading. 9major isn't rocket science, but it certainly isn't for the new reloader without an experienced reloader nearby to use as training wheels.

Take the open stuff off and shoot production. Learn to reload, then get a real open gun.

[UW Mitch]

FWIW, I load once fired for my 9Major, but the once I shoot it, I throw that brass in another pile to build regular 9mm practice ammo. Glad to hear you're alright.

[glocklover]

Take this as a wake up call and quit it with the open glock. Even with the right load, it still isn't going to be anywhere near a real open gun.

I haven't seen anywhere where you actually answered yes or no to the chrono question. Do you have one and are you using it to develop loads? Some of the statements that you are making lead me to believe that you are relatively new to reloading. 9major isn't rocket science, but it certainly isn't for the new reloader without an experienced reloader nearby to use as training wheels.

Take the open stuff off and shoot production. Learn to reload, then get a real open gun.

So, JJ Racaza is not a real shooter. You must be really good to beat him. Are you a GM with sponsors?