Any Rules Preventing The Use Of Pistol Caliber Rifles?

[szhttm]

I have not yet had the opputunity to participate in an official USPSA Multi-gun match, but in looking through the USPSA Multi-gun and Rifle rules, are there any rules that prevent a participant from using a pistol caliber rifle at a match? I understand that the participant may be at some disadvantage with long distance targets due to the ballastics of a pistol calliber versus a rifle caliber, but I am just wondering if a participant should be penalized for using a pistol caliber versus a rifle caliber. For example, a participant wanting to complete using a 9mm AR.

I also understand that the Heavy Metal devision does specifically document a minimum caliber of .308/7.62x51; but, the other divisions do not seem to have a minimum caliber division stated/required.

The Minimum Power Factor documented for USPSA Multi-gun Open, Limited, and Tactical divisions is 150; which, a 9mm AR should be able to make:

• http://www.ballistic...com/9luger.html
  

The rules have have found are:

Copied from:

USPSA Rules, 2012 Edition

Multi-Gun Matches

Revised – 1/9/2012

1) MG 5.1.2:

Minimum cartridge for each firearm type in a multi-gun match is the minimum cartridge defined for the firearm, as documented.

2) MG 9.3:

A competitor’s score is calculated by identifying the highest value stipulated number of hits on each target which are of the appropriate caliber, as determined by the firearm specified for use on that target in the course instructions.

3) MG 2.1.3:

Minimum distances for any metal target in a multi-gun match are the minimum distances defined for the firearm used to engage that target, as documented in the discipline-specific rule book for that firearm type.

In the present (2008/2009) version of the rules, minimum distances for metal targets are defined as:

—Handgun: 23 Feet

—Shotgun (birdshot): 16 Feet

—Shotgun (slugs): 131 Feet

—Rifle: 164 Feet

Copied from:

USPSA Rifle Competition Rules

Revised Feb. 4, 2009

1) 5.1.1.1

A rifle is considered to be the combination of a specific caliber, barrel, stock or grip, sighting system, and fixed magazine or magazine tube if applicable. Competitors must not reconfigure any firearm (i.e., change caliber, barrel, muzzle brakes/compensator/flash hiders, butt stock, forend, sighting system (including scopes, magnifiers, etc), fixed magazine or magazine tube) during the course of a match.

2) 5.1.2

There is no minimum caliber for rifles used in USPSA matches.

Thank you!!!

Good Luck And Be Safe!!!

Edited January 4, 2013 by szhttm

[EkuJustice]

The biggest penalty is any long range targets

[Fried Chicken Blowout]

You can also look at running light bullets and then loading something as hot as you can get it to run and which should help it run flatter when going long range. You'll just need a drop compensated scope like Burris MTAC and see where those drop marks hit at different ranges. What I found was they really plummet after 100 yards and my reliability sucked compared to a gas gun. But for the ease of reloading it's nice. Just don't mix up your ammo if you come up with anything really hot and don't mix the brass in with your pistol brass. Not sure how long the 9mm brass would last if you were really pushing them hard.

[Dan Sierpina]

9MM AR's are blowback systems. They have more recoil than a .223. Not to mention the distance disadvantage. Also, a non USPSA match, may not allow pistol caliber carbines.

[Fried Chicken Blowout]

9MM AR's are blowback systems. They have more recoil than a .223. Not to mention the distance disadvantage. Also, a non USPSA match, may not allow pistol caliber carbines.

Correct about that recoil. Mine had much more than a standard gas gun, and seemed to be slow to cycle to boot.

[J-Ho]

I've been to little local matches that used them. Everything was under 100 yrds. I couldn't seen any real advantage performance wise, but it did look fun. Hell there was even a .22lr division. I'd run that for $h!t$ and giggles.

[HRider]

One regional match that I regularly attend has a rule about pistol caliber carbines. You can run one, but you must have 3 hits on paper to neutralize a (paper) target, I have not ever seen anyone use a pistol caliber carbine at a match. If that is all that you have, bring it out to play if the match allows it though.

Hurley

[MarkCO]

Certainly allowed, we have several run PCCs at our local matches. I ran a .30 carbine and a Marlin Camp 9 myself a few times. Still have to make minor if using hit factor scoring

[OPENB]

I plan on using my M1 carbine at the local matches this year. 100yds. and in.

[DaveTimm]

I would love an extra class of rimfire or pistol carbine and be able to shoot twice. It would make a fun side or extra match and make more out of the day at local matches. I think it would be fun to run my mp5 clone in an up close hosed stage :-).

[szhttm]

Thank you all for the great responses and helping me clear this up!!!

Good Luck And Be Safe!!!

[Boxer1]

How far do these guys shoot with a 9mm carbine? We shoot atleast one stage at 200+ at the monthly matches. just currious.

[ac4wordplay]

Mine holds 5 rounds in a USPSA head (almost all in the head A box) at 100 yards. Done off the bench with iron sights. Some of the local monthly matches use pistol bays (50 yards max).

[mscott]

Go for it. I've been using a 9mm Mech Tech for matches that only go out to 100 yards. It will shoot 3" at 100 yards. There is no advantage to using the carbine as the .223 AR is much smoother to shoot recoil wise. The trigger is also much better on an AR, which obviously helps. If there is an advantage, it's only carrying one style of magazine for the pistol and rifle and cost of ammo. I'll probably use it even more this year as there is obviously a bit of cool factor that goes along with not making as much noise.

[MarkCO]

I shot my camp 9 out to 200. If the targets were 8" or larger, no issues. Clays at 200 were luck.

[j28s]

I'm inclined to agree that the .223 shoots softer and can reach out further than the 9mm AR. I've put some rounds through an AR 9mm (major and minor) and the recoil is pretty harsh compared .223. Probably close to a 6.5 grendel with no muzzle brake. .223 is much easier to shoot faster (and better accuracy).

[LikesToShoot]

I used my PCC at a couple local "outlaw" two gun match's and my first local three gun match. I didn't hit the 200 yard target, or if I did the bullets didn't give a report. It wasstill a lot of fun and much cheaper shooting 100+ rounds of 9 mm vs .223.

I've developed a new load for my CX4 Storm that's dead on at 25 yrds arc's up at 50 and 75 then back on at 100 yrds. I hope to give it a try at 200 yrds sometime to see how well my Nikon P 223 BDC carbine scope measures up with the hash marks.

http://www.nikonhunting.com/products/riflescopes/p-223/3x32_BDC_Carbine/8496

The Spot On program is pretty cool and let's you customize the scope to your cartridge.

http://www.nikonhunting.com/page/spot_on

Out of the longer carbine barrel my 115 gr JHP averages 1416 FPS that's 162 PF.

[szhttm]

The new recently published USPSA 2013 MultiGun rules seem to document that the Minimum caliber/Cartridge on a rifile for some of the divisions (Open, Tactical, and Limited) is now 5.45mm x 39mm. The remaining divisions (Heavy Metal Tactical and Heavy Metal Limited) are now .308 Winchester / 7.62x51 Nato as the rifle Minimum caliber/Cartridge.

At least that is what I understand from the Appendix area of these new rules.

The new rules can be accessed here:

• http://www.brianenos...howtopic=167238
  

Good Luck And Be Safe!!!

Edited January 25, 2013 by szhttm

[szhttm]

In searching a little more through these new rules, I found the following:

* 2.1.3

** The minimum cartridge case dimension for handguns to be used in USPSA matches is 9x19 mm. The minimum bullet diameter is 9 mm (.354 inches). The minimum caliber for Rifle is 5.45mm x 39mm. Shotguns must be 20 gauge or larger. Some divisions may have a higher minimum.

The minimum Power Factor in Minor and Major for Handun, Rifle, and Shotgun seem to be documented in the Appendix A area of the new rules. I can't seem to be able to copy them here in a format that is easy to read so please check the link provided in the earlier reply.

Good Luck And Be Safe!!!