El Guapo Posted December 6, 2012 Share Posted December 6, 2012 Ya see, the sandbaggers are already trying to make an argument why they should be let in. If you have sponsors you are a pro. If you have finished in the top 50 in tac optics at a major match you are a pro. Just because you have self esteem issues and "don't feel like a pro" doesn't make you an amateur. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flood Posted December 6, 2012 Author Share Posted December 6, 2012 Just to clarify, I am not concerned with whether or not a shooter is sponsored, but where they finish at the major matches. Ken Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkCO Posted December 6, 2012 Share Posted December 6, 2012 That and the "RIFLERAFFLE" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uber Posted December 6, 2012 Share Posted December 6, 2012 Ya see, the sandbaggers are already trying to make an argument why they should be let in. If you have sponsors you are a pro. If you have finished in the top 50 in tac optics at a major match you are a pro. Just because you have self esteem issues and "don't feel like a pro" doesn't make you an amateur. Hahaha... If self esteem is the determining factor, then i am a super pro. You are missing the point, and getting bent out of shape about it. The point is, the definition of pro, is doing something for a living, UNLESS some governing body defines it as something else Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flood Posted December 6, 2012 Author Share Posted December 6, 2012 That and the "RIFLERAFFLE" Gotta love Larry Wayland, 3 Gun's honorary sideshow barker! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jesse Tischauser Posted December 6, 2012 Share Posted December 6, 2012 I didn't know what the Lewis System was until now. I guess that means I'm an amateur? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ATAS Posted December 6, 2012 Share Posted December 6, 2012 I had a gun shop give me a box of ammo and a t shirt once. Does that make me a pro? My best finish was 11th out of 10 in HI at Midwest 3 Gun in 2006. I hope since 3 Gun Nation Pro and Semi Pro is TO only this match will be anything BUT TO? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkCO Posted December 6, 2012 Share Posted December 6, 2012 The point is, the definition of pro, is doing something for a living, UNLESS some governing body defines it as something else If that is the definition, then there are really only a handful of Pros. The AMU and Jerry, maybe a few others, and all of the full time trainers . That certainly won't fly as a definition. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Outsydlooknin75 Posted December 6, 2012 Share Posted December 6, 2012 I had a gun shop give me a box of ammo and a t shirt once. Does that make me a pro? My best finish was 11th out of 10 in HI at Midwest 3 Gun in 2006. I hope since 3 Gun Nation Pro and Semi Pro is TO only this match will be anything BUT TO? That would be awesome if it was anything but TO, and separate irons, and 1x. Sent from my SPH-L710 using Tapatalk 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Hostetter Posted December 6, 2012 Share Posted December 6, 2012 I alway thought the definition of a PRO was someone who did something for payment or reward. A pro poker player is a pro because he plays in tournaments that offer a prize for winning or doing well. He might also have sponsors but he is a pro because he tries ti win money by playing poker. If that same definition was applied to shooters then anyone competing in a match with a prize table is a PRO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uber Posted December 6, 2012 Share Posted December 6, 2012 The point is, the definition of pro, is doing something for a living, UNLESS some governing body defines it as something else If that is the definition, then there are really only a handful of Pros. The AMU and Jerry, maybe a few others, and all of the full time trainers . That certainly won't fly as a definition. Exactly!!! We need it clearly defined! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uber Posted December 6, 2012 Share Posted December 6, 2012 I alway thought the definition of a PRO was someone who did something for payment or reward. A pro poker player is a pro because he plays in tournaments that offer a prize for winning or doing well. He might also have sponsors but he is a pro because he tries ti win money by playing poker. If that same definition was applied to shooters then anyone competing in a match with a prize table is a PRO. I have played in poker tournaments in vegas, where you win money.... But so does everyone in vegas lol... I need to update my resume! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dcloudy777 Posted December 6, 2012 Share Posted December 6, 2012 Okay... I'm going to start a thread about a classification system in the Rules forum. DanO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
promod1385 Posted December 6, 2012 Share Posted December 6, 2012 I shot target archery for a number of years and the NFAA Worlds in Las Vegas every year is split in to a "Pro division" and an "Am division" the Am's are set up on a Lewis type system after two days of competition, on day three you are broken up in to flights of 30 based on your previous two days scores. Prizes are awarded by flight. Its a nice system and works well perhaps you could do something similar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mlmiller1 Posted December 7, 2012 Share Posted December 7, 2012 (edited) I love the idea. I have nothing against the guys that win the big matches but it would be great to have something those of us in the "middle somewhere" could feel we might somehow be competitive. The Lewis system is the great equalizer & there is no real way to "game it" so you accidentally wind up top in B class instead of bottom in A. Hope I can figure out a way to make it to this match. MLM Edited December 7, 2012 by mlmiller1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
abn-rgr Posted December 7, 2012 Share Posted December 7, 2012 Ya see, the sandbaggers are already trying to make an argument why they should be let in. If you have sponsors you are a pro. If you have finished in the top 50 in tac optics at a major match you are a pro. Just because you have self esteem issues and "don't feel like a pro" doesn't make you an amateur. I cant get on board with you here. My 13 year old daughter is sponsored and has only shot in 3 multi gun matches. Does that make her a pro?? I think it should be based on shooting ability. Refer to my earlier post. Rustin B. is not sponsored but is ranked 8th in 3GN standings. You think he is an amateur??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Guapo Posted December 7, 2012 Share Posted December 7, 2012 If you had read my entire post you would see that folks like Rustin would be taken of under the top 50 finishes part. Don't get bent out of shape I'm just trying to help the conversation by spitballing some ideas here. Another thread has been started in the rules section if you want to put in your two cents. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkCO Posted December 7, 2012 Share Posted December 7, 2012 Obvioulsy Ken and crew will make some sort of decision and there might be a small group of 10 to 15 shooters who end up feeling slighted...while life ain't fair, it sounds like they are trying to be as fair as possible. What I define as a Pro (anyone in the top 25% of a major, full time shooters, a person whose score is 75% or better at a major, etc.) is really immaterial. My personal friends who shoot 3Gun would never consider me to be a pro. However, my personal friends who don't shoot certainly consider me to be a pro. To the general population, the majority of 3Gunners are Pros. At the CO state Ruger Rimfire Challenge, we had 3 or 4 out of town "Rimfire Pros" come shoot the match. These guys, by all measures are Pros, they are sponsored, derive financial benefit from teaching and being sponsored and the majority of "rimfire" afficianaods would know their names like we know the names of our top ten or so. Match winner (and 3 of the 5 top spots overall) were 3Gunners. Yes, accomplished 3Gunners they are, but they are not top pros and most of the criteria presented herein would allow them to shoot this match. Just an alternate viewpoint. I personally know of three GM pistol shooters who plan to shoot their first 3Gun matches next year. Two of them have top 16 finishes at USPSA nationals this year. Are they going to be allowed to shoot this "Amatuer" match? We need an emoticon for "Lights firecracker and runs" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Truegent2004 Posted December 7, 2012 Share Posted December 7, 2012 All this bickering for a match that is 9 months away? Just have a match that has: A good time emphasized above all else A random draw, modest, or no even no prize table Everybody doing their part on stage reset This will act as magnet for most amateurs and a repellent for many (But not all) pros. If a big name shooter still wants to come ...fine...let them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jesse Tischauser Posted December 8, 2012 Share Posted December 8, 2012 Rustin B. is not sponsored but is ranked 8th in 3GN standings. You think he is an amateur??? Rustin is a total Amateur! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jesse Tischauser Posted December 8, 2012 Share Posted December 8, 2012 (edited) I personally know of three GM pistol shooters who plan to shoot their first 3Gun matches next year. Two of them have top 16 finishes at USPSA nationals this year. Are they going to be allowed to shoot this "Amatuer" ? Who you taking about? It's always good to see the big pistol guys seeing how green the grass is over here in 3 gun land. I shot with Matt Mink in his first 3 gun last month. He won Tac Irons at the MVSA regional match. Why don't you take applications until February 1st. If you have more applications then the number required to fill it up do a random draw with the applications. I bet it won't fill up before or after February. Does Midwest 3 him fill up every year? I never remember anybody ever having trouble getting in? Edited December 8, 2012 by Jesse Tischauser Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jesse Tischauser Posted December 8, 2012 Share Posted December 8, 2012 Since I probably won't be able to shoot Midwest 3 gun this year as a result of the inadvertent overlap with the 3GN pro series match I would love to come up and shoot this match if I'm allowed to. Put me on the Pro waiting list. If it helps get me in ill shoot with an Glock 26, Mossberg 590, and a AK74. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
outerlimits Posted December 8, 2012 Share Posted December 8, 2012 This is simple- Techwear shirt = Pro Tank Top = Amateur Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Hostetter Posted December 8, 2012 Share Posted December 8, 2012 How about a tech wear tank top? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dcloudy777 Posted December 8, 2012 Share Posted December 8, 2012 Maybe they should just swap the dates.... run the "amatuer only" match on the May weekend that conflicts with 3GN, and the CMMG match in September? DanO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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