jedmyers Posted November 17, 2012 Share Posted November 17, 2012 I'm contemplating building a new limited gun in .40 and I'm curious which is better. I know the reputation sti has they have been around for a while and they are excellent guns. I've heard lately that you can build a pretty good Caspian for limited as well, or a Para which from what I hear doesn't have the good reputation as an STI does, but anything could be made better. So I'm just looking for some extra wisdom please. Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ParaGunner Posted November 17, 2012 Share Posted November 17, 2012 Your going to get a billion different opinions. I personally prefer Para because the frame feels best in my hands. I suggest you try to shoot one of each and make a decision. You can make a great limited gun out of any one of these brands, it's just a personal preference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jedmyers Posted November 17, 2012 Author Share Posted November 17, 2012 Yes sir, thank you very much for the idea. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattYvip Posted November 17, 2012 Share Posted November 17, 2012 I have 2 limited guns. one is a para and the other a custom built sti. I personally like the sti frame better. Parts are slightly easier to find and magazines are easier to find tuned up. That being said, you can't go wrong with para or sti. I've never shot a caspian framed gun so I can't speak to them, but I was under the impression mags are hard to find for them... I could be way wrong that though. So thats my opinion, good luck with your choice! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jedmyers Posted November 17, 2012 Author Share Posted November 17, 2012 Hey thanks I really appreciate all the help! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaxshooter Posted November 17, 2012 Share Posted November 17, 2012 Hi cap mags for Caspians are readily available. If I was building a Limited gun it would be on a Caspian or STI frame. My current Limited gun is an STI framed gun. I am considering a Caspian for my next build. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Religious Shooter Posted November 17, 2012 Share Posted November 17, 2012 I have two SVI framed "Limited" guns and three Para based "Limited" guns. I'd go for an STI/SVI. The Para frames are cast. STI/SVI frames are forged. Forged frames tend to retain their slide to fram fit better than cast frames. Though they hold less and cost more, the STI/SVI tubes are generally better finished/built than the Para mags. The plastic STI grips are also easier to hack and modify to fit your hand. The only real reason I built three Para guns is I live in Kalipornia. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob DuBois Posted November 17, 2012 Share Posted November 17, 2012 Shot Para's for years before going to the plastic framed S-I pistols. Really don't care for the newer Para extractor, seen two newer Para's built up in 9mm and the extractor has been an issue. Replacing a tube and extractor to get the guns to run. By the time you get all the extra's on a Para your close to an STI Eagle. Have a five inch built SVI like an Eagle and a Tripp built Edge. I like the recoil inpuls of the short dust cover gun better, it's quicker to recover from recoil. Quicker splits. One of the most accurate pistols I've owned was a earlier Para in 40 with a fitted KKM barrel and Gun Craft mag well. Hate I let it get away. Another plus for the S-I guns, better magazine design, especially in 9mm. It's the old Ford Chevy thing but then I drive a Dodge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Extremo Posted November 17, 2012 Share Posted November 17, 2012 I like the modular system with the 2011 (SVI, STI). It gives more options and more parts to choose from. Para and BUL are based on the same, or at least used to. Can't say were Caspian fits in there but quality wise they've always been good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jedmyers Posted November 17, 2012 Author Share Posted November 17, 2012 So basically an sti would be the better, or possibly a caspian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RIIID Posted November 18, 2012 Share Posted November 18, 2012 My choice would be Caspian-Springfield-SV w/metal grip-Tanfoglio. The Para and STI are now basically in the same group for a custom gun build, you keep the frame and slide and possibly the barrel and replace everything else. Rich Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HI5-O Posted November 18, 2012 Share Posted November 18, 2012 If you can wait, Freedom Gun Works are testing a S_I like frame and probably will have metal grips too. That platform has a lot going for it (lots of parts; max cap mags) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jedmyers Posted November 18, 2012 Author Share Posted November 18, 2012 I appreciate it. Thank you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ltdmstr Posted November 18, 2012 Share Posted November 18, 2012 I have two SVI framed "Limited" guns and three Para based "Limited" guns. I'd go for an STI/SVI. The Para frames are cast. STI/SVI frames are forged. Forged frames tend to retain their slide to fram fit better than cast frames. This is not correct. SV frames are machined from bar stock, not forged. Not sure how STI is making their stuff these days, but I'm pretty sure they aren't forged either. In terms of quality, the SV is head and shoulders above STI. It's not even a close comparison. If you have the money, SV is the first choice. If you can't afford an SV, save your money until you can. If you're set on choosing between Caspian, STI and Para, I would say Caspian is the best. But it is a cast frame and I have seen them break. Even if that's covered under warranty you still have to have someone rebuilt the gun, which is time and money. Para is also cast, and I don't know how the quality is these days but I've seen many with problems like the frame machined incorrectly, hammer and sear holes drilled off center, etc. I have also seen some real crap work from STI and stopped using their stuff a long time ago as a result. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aircooled6racer Posted November 18, 2012 Share Posted November 18, 2012 Hello: Trying all three in your hands is the place to start. They all feel different. The Caspian feels the largest to me and when you add grips it is huge. The Para is a little more narrow but more square feeling to me. The STI feels the best but I modify the grip to fit my hand. As for mags they all can be made to hold 20 rounds with a couple of them being able to hold 21. I would also try shooting them to see if you like the heavier frames or the lighter STI. All of the parts will last 10's of thousands of rounds since they are all good parts. Thanks, Eric Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jedmyers Posted November 18, 2012 Author Share Posted November 18, 2012 I appreciate all the advice guys, I'll round some up and shoot them and see which one feel the best to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Religious Shooter Posted November 18, 2012 Share Posted November 18, 2012 (edited) This is not correct. SV frames are machined from bar stock, not forged. I could have sworn their frames and slides were machined from forged barstock or forgings. Are you saying the 4140 bar stock that they use isn't forged? In any case the point I was trying to make was the steel that Para uses is more porous than the steel that SVI/STI uses. I've had a Para slide and a frame crack and break on me. No frames or slides from STI/SVI have failed me. Edited November 18, 2012 by Religious Shooter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ltdmstr Posted November 18, 2012 Share Posted November 18, 2012 Bar stock is usually stamped and rolled through a series of dies to make it square, round or whatever shape and size it's going to end up at. Frames machined from bar stock start with a chunk of steel (or aluminum, etc.) and the machining cuts to finished shape. With a forged frame, the piece of steel is heated and then essentially pounded into a rough shape in a pair of dies. This pounding to rough shape is what gives it extra strength and superior properties. So they are two different processes. Clearly a frame machined from bar stock is far superior to a casting. As for bar stock vs. forged, there are a lot of variable involved. I would expect that a bar stock frame from a high strength steel could easily be superior to a forged frame from another material. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob DuBois Posted November 18, 2012 Share Posted November 18, 2012 While Caspian parts are top notch, they left us high and dry during the last crime bill on magazines or magazine parts, might consider that before making purchase. I moved away from Para to S-I years back. Do the S-I guns shoot any better, hold a better group, no. But it's easier to build a tighter pistol in the S-I format. Plus S-I quality parts once completed to your specks last. Plastic grip is easier to form to your grip and if you mess the grip up your out a hundred bucks for a new one. Mounting a dot sight, plenty of meat on the dust cover, same for a thumb rest. The S-I guns I have don't group any better but feed and run better than the Para's I had due to the magazine design. It's a hard decision and a lot of money any way you go. None would bad but S-I may be better in the long run. Don't know a quality builder look hard at an Eagle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jedmyers Posted November 18, 2012 Author Share Posted November 18, 2012 Thank you. I appreciate the advice Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Religious Shooter Posted November 18, 2012 Share Posted November 18, 2012 Bar stock is usually stamped and rolled through a series of dies to make it square, round or whatever shape and size it's going to end up at. Frames machined from bar stock start with a chunk of steel (or aluminum, etc.) and the machining cuts to finished shape. With a forged frame, the piece of steel is heated and then essentially pounded into a rough shape in a pair of dies. This pounding to rough shape is what gives it extra strength and superior properties. So they are two different processes. Clearly a frame machined from bar stock is far superior to a casting. As for bar stock vs. forged, there are a lot of variable involved. I would expect that a bar stock frame from a high strength steel could easily be superior to a forged frame from another material. You know you can get forged bar stock? That you can then machine? Google forged bar stock and you can see multiple vendors that sell them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ltdmstr Posted November 18, 2012 Share Posted November 18, 2012 That's not the same as a forged part. But it doesn't really matter for this discussion. Bar stock is more than adequate for a 1911 style pistol frame. Cast frames are a different story. They will build a good gun, but they will not have anywhere near the durability or lifespan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Religious Shooter Posted November 18, 2012 Share Posted November 18, 2012 You know you can have cast bar stock? There are different types of bar stock. I'd rather have my frames made from forged bar stock. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jedmyers Posted November 23, 2012 Author Share Posted November 23, 2012 I appreciate all the advice. I'm just trying to get away from shooting my glocks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aircooled6racer Posted November 23, 2012 Share Posted November 23, 2012 Hello: As I stated above try them all in your hand to see what feels right to you. As for the parts they are all very good if built correctly. Thanks, Eric Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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