CZ 75B cocked and locked legal in Production?

[Esther]

I'm a new shooter looking to compete with a 9mm CZ 75B in Production. Can I start with the gun cocked and locked (hammer back, manual safety on)? I met an experienced IPSC shooter who told me that I would need to fire the first shoot in DA mode. That surprises me because the CZ has no decocker lever, so firing a first shot in DA would be not only annoying but unsafe.

If he's right, then can I get my CZ modified to SA only (or buy a SA-only competition version) that is Production legal?

Thanks!!

[DWFAN]

No. 1st shot must be DA.

Carefully and slowly, manually lower the hammer.

[Esther]

Thanks! Is that because IPSC has a general rule that ALL DA/SA guns must be fired DA first?

And, can I modify my CZ in such a way or get an SA only version that is still Production legal?

[ChuckS]

Thanks! Is that because IPSC has a general rule that ALL DA/SA guns must be fired DA first?

And, can I modify my CZ in such a way or get an SA only version that is still Production legal?

Nope. You should probably visit this webpage: http://www.uspsa.org/uspsa-rules.php

Oh yeah: Welcome to the the forum!

Edited October 30, 2012 by ChuckS

[DWFAN]

can I modify my CZ in such a way or get an SA only version that is still Production legal?

If first shot must be DA, then how would a SA only version be Production legal ?

[Outsydlooknin75]

can I modify my CZ in such a way or get an SA only version that is still Production legal?

If first shot must be DA, then how would a SA only version be Production legal ?

Single action onlys are not production legal.

Sent from my PG06100 using Tapatalk 2

[forddriver]

You could always just limited or limited 10.

[motosapiens]

as previously stated, the production class is not open to SA-only pistols. You can shoot a DAO gun, DA/SA (first shot must be DA), or crappy plastic gun with a 'safe-action' trigger.

Decocking a cz is safe and easy to do, but since accidents do happen, do NOT point the pistol at your cat, tv, wife, car or neighbor when decocking. Point it only at things you wouldn't mind shooting.

I've decocked my cz 1000's of times without issue, but for a while I would go outside in the back yard to do it at home (carry gun).

Note that cz does make decocker versions of many of their guns, and they are nice guns, but slightly more complicated to do trigger work on. If you refuse to manually decock, and you insist on shooting production, then a 75bd is a good choice. as an added bonus, you get to start from half-cock then, since that's where the decocker puts the hammer.

[Esther]

Wow you guys are awesome! Thanks for the fast replies!

So follow-up question: If I shoot best with the CZ but have trouble managing even one good shot using DA (I'm a lady and haven't that much grip strength), would you recommend starting in Limited or Limited 10 instead of Production? What are the advantages/disadvantages of beginning in each?

Thanks again for helping a total newb!

[a.roberts]

If grip strength is an issue, get some Captain of Crush grip trainers. They've helped me control recoil better. Barring that, I'd say Limited so you don't have to worry about reloads and can focus on the actual shooting and movement.

[lumpygravy]

Welcome to the BEnoverse and to the sport.

I'm not very familiar with the CZ, but either Limited or L10 seem like they would be the good division choices for you if you want to shoot it SA. The decision would depend on the magazines you have. If > 10 rounds = shoot Limited otherwise shoot L10. Note that you can shoot L10 with > 10 round magazines as long as you don't load > 10.

Where do you shoot? There are a number of clubs in the Bay Area and I've always found everyone to be very generous and helpful with information to get a newbie off to a good start.

Personally, I shoot at Richmond Rod & Gun. The Richmond HotShots conducts practice every Saturday and host a variety of matches, one on nearly every Sunday. There are many shooters in all of the divisions, some of which shoot the CZ and I'm sure would be happy to share information with you.

[motosapiens]

So follow-up question: If I shoot best with the CZ but have trouble managing even one good shot using DA (I'm a lady and haven't that much grip strength), would you recommend starting in Limited or Limited 10 instead of Production? What are the advantages/disadvantages of beginning in each?

I would recommend learning to shoot better.....

Okay, that was a flippant reply, but most folks suck at shooting DA at first, especially trying to do it fast. I suck alot less than I did a year ago. Here are things I did that helped:

1. dryfire. during football commercials, i focus the sights on an electrical socket, and just dryfire in DA, trying to keep the sights on the socket.

2. lighter main spring. CZ's generally come with a 20lb or so mainspring. that's what you're fighting against when you are pulling the trigger in DA. switching to a 15 or 13lb mainspring is easy and cheap, reduces the pull noticeably, and should still light off most any primer.

3. dryfire some more. I do a minute or two several mornings a week, just practicing on smoothly pulling the trigger without letting the sights wobble all over.

The disadvantages of limited or l10 is that the majority of shooters will be scoring major, so missing the A-zone costs you more than it costs them. If you hit all A's, then no biggie.

I shot limited for a few matches so I didn't have to worry about reloads. In retrospect, I don't know what point there was in putting it off. I should have just started in production and started learning.

[DWFAN]

If you have an all stock 75b, you would benefit greatly from a trigger job, or at least a lighter mainspring. That would reduce the DA trigger pull weight a ton.

Advantages of Lim/Lim 10:

Start single action

Disadvantages:

Magazine capacity (unless you buy extended base pads)

Minor Scoring (9mm can't make major in Lim/Lim10)

[sperman]

as previously stated, the production class is not open to SA-only pistols. You can shoot a DAO gun, DA/SA (first shot must be DA), or crappy plastic gun with a 'safe-action' trigger.

Mark,

I'll give the newbies a break, but you've been around long enough to know better.

Production Division.

[Esther]

Thanks for all the helpful tips! I really appreciate them!

Jon - wait, are we even allowed to shoot mags with more than 10 rounds for Limited in California? I would have thought that there is essentially no difference between Limited and Limited 10 in our state.

I normally shoot at Reed's Indoor Range in Sunnyvale. I've been eying IPSC ever since shooting my first round several months ago (it looks like so much fun!), and Richmond and Chabot seem to be the closest ranges that offer competitions in the Bay Area.

Edited October 30, 2012 by Esther

[gmg]

My recommendation would be to send it to Shay at Akai custom and let him work the trigger over. When he finishes with it the DA pull will be around #5 and the single action pull will be around #2.5. Well worth the money which is not much for him to do a trigger job

[Bunchies95]

as previously stated, the production class is not open to SA-only pistols. You can shoot a DAO gun, DA/SA (first shot must be DA), or crappy plastic gun with a 'safe-action' trigger.

Note that cz does make decocker versions of many of their guns, and they are nice guns, but slightly more complicated to do trigger work on. If you refuse to manually decock, and you insist on shooting production, then a 75bd is a good choice. as an added bonus, you get to start from half-cock then, since that's where the decocker puts the hammer.

You cannot start at half cock in Production. That is a good way to move to open...or not start the stage.

App D4:

Special conditions:

— Handguns with external hammers must be fully decocked at the start signal.

[DWFAN]

as previously stated, the production class is not open to SA-only pistols. You can shoot a DAO gun, DA/SA (first shot must be DA), or crappy plastic gun with a 'safe-action' trigger.

Note that cz does make decocker versions of many of their guns, and they are nice guns, but slightly more complicated to do trigger work on. If you refuse to manually decock, and you insist on shooting production, then a 75bd is a good choice. as an added bonus, you get to start from half-cock then, since that's where the decocker puts the hammer.

You cannot start at half cock in Production. That is a good way to move to open...or not start the stage.

App D4:

Special conditions:

— Handguns with external hammers must be fully decocked at the start signal.

You can start wherever the deckocker (if equipped) put the hammer.

http://www.USPSA.org/uspsa-NROI-ruling-details.php?indx=30

Edited October 30, 2012 by DWFAN

[lumpygravy]

...

Jon - wait, are we even allowed to shoot mags with more than 10 rounds for Limited in California? I would have thought that there is essentially no difference between Limited and Limited 10 in our state.

...

pm sent...

[motosapiens]

You can start wherever the deckocker (if equipped) put the hammer.

http://www.USPSA.org/uspsa-NROI-ruling-details.php?indx=30

Correct, and a decocker-equipped cz drops the hammer to half-cock. Some people think there's a significant difference in shooting between halfcocked and fully down. but back to back testing of my 75bd and my 75b (no decocker) shows no measurable difference in time to first shot for me.

[bassmankai]

You could also get a reduced mainspring kit from Cajun Gun Works or send it to CZ Custom for a trigger job. I believe CGW reduced kit can get DA pulls of around 5lbs, which is almost as light as an untuned SA pull on on a CZ-75. That's of course if you want to shoot production.

[bassmankai]

http://www.cajungunworks.com/ultra-lite.html

[Bunchies95]

as previously stated, the production class is not open to SA-only pistols. You can shoot a DAO gun, DA/SA (first shot must be DA), or crappy plastic gun with a 'safe-action' trigger.

Note that cz does make decocker versions of many of their guns, and they are nice guns, but slightly more complicated to do trigger work on. If you refuse to manually decock, and you insist on shooting production, then a 75bd is a good choice. as an added bonus, you get to start from half-cock then, since that's where the decocker puts the hammer.

You cannot start at half cock in Production. That is a good way to move to open...or not start the stage.

App D4:

Special conditions:

— Handguns with external hammers must be fully decocked at the start signal.

You can start wherever the deckocker (if equipped) put the hammer.

http://www.USPSA.org/uspsa-NROI-ruling-details.php?indx=30

I'm starting to think we need a new release of the rule book to take into account all of the rulings to date. I keep forgetting to check the NROI site to look at the various intrepretations.

[JGus]

I use a Sig P226 USPSA model DA/SA model in Production, and before that I used a Baby Desert Eagle II DA/SA in Production. I tried the XDm9 5.25" (striker fired) for awhile, and it was a great gun, but I much prefer my Sig USPSA so that's what I've gone back to.

Trust me, once you get enough trigger time with the DA first shot and pretty soon it becomes second nature. Don't be scared off from a gun that is DA/SA. And I can assure you, as it did for me, learning to master the DA part will make you a much more steady, consistent shooter overall. You have so much more room for unneccesary movement on the DA (flinching, wrist pull, hand squeeze, etc) that once you have it mastered your shooting overall will be rock solid.

[Trini]

Being in Kali I'm sure you can find someone locally. Shipping to Fl. will cost over $100 (RT). Ask at your clubs they can probably give a name or two.