Cases stuck in the chamber

[melissa5]

I've got a Gen 2 Glock 17 racegun with a Lone Wolf slide and barrel, Carver Customs 4-port comp, Carver guide rod, Wolf 12 lb spring, and a Cmore sight on an SJC mount. So far, I have not been able to find factory ammo that it will cycle reliably and have been reloading for it. Here's the recipe that I'm using: 6.6 gr HS6, 115 gr X-treme plated bullet, Federal primers, and brass that I've picked up at the range. The OAL is 1.135. I've been getting a few failures to feed and twice I've gotten cases stuck in the chamber to such an extent that they had to be bumped out with a dowel rod. To say the least, I'm very frustrated right now. Here's some of the advice that I've been given in another forum:

1. Buy an EGW U die
   
2. Buy new Starline brass
   
3. Don't use the Lee Factory Crimp die for plated bullets
   
4. Don't buy the EGW U die because it is the same as the regular Lee die
   
5. I really need a 3-port comp unless I want to load 6.9 gr.
   
6. The OAL is too long and should be 1.100.
   

So, what do ya'll suggest?

Edited to add that I have been using the LW barrel as a case gauge.

Edited September 24, 2012 by melissa5

[HI5-O]

Are you making major pf with that load?

On the failures to feed, are the rounds nose down, nose up or jammed into the feed ramp?

When they are stuck in the chamber, is it a fired case? or a loaded round?

I would try jacketed hollowpoints instead of plated bullets in an open gun setup.

I've just gotten a Lee U-die for 9mm since some of the brass I have were fired in Glocks.

As for picking up range 9mm brass, you might want to make a note if the problems you are having involve a particular brand.

[melissa5]

Are you making major pf with that load?

On the failures to feed, are the rounds nose down, nose up or jammed into the feed ramp?

When they are stuck in the chamber, is it a fired case? or a loaded round?

I would try jacketed hollowpoints instead of plated bullets in an open gun setup.

I've just gotten a Lee U-die for 9mm since some of the brass I have were fired in Glocks.

As for picking up range 9mm brass, you might want to make a note if the problems you are having involve a particular brand.

I've never chrono'd that load, so I don't know the pf. I'm not trying to make major and have only shot the gun at GSSF matches. But, I would like to start using it for USPSA if I can get my ammo figured out.

I haven't really paid attention with failures to feed and have just done the tap/rack drill and carried on.

With the last stuck case, the gun jammed and wouldn't fire and the slide wouldn't lock back. So, the RO bumped the back of the slide and then fired. Then, the case was stuck. Now, that I think about it, that's pretty much the way it happened the first time too.

Should I be separating the fired cases by headstamp?

[ProGunGuy]

i ma surprised you can not find factory ammo that will cycle it. From what you have described, i think its a combo of the tight LW barrel and your reloads. 9mm brass will vary greatly in length and longer ones with tight chambers can get stuck

[HoMiE]

I would buy a box of WWB and put a 10# recoil spring it to isolate the recoil spring. I use to run 10# shooting minor loads in a G17 open pistol with sjc comp. Your OAL should be fine unless your barrel is short chambered and then finish ream it to work with whatever OAL you decide to go with. Sorting your brass is a good idea if your having trouble with range pick up brass. You could have bulged brass if your picking up 9 major brass. I would work on finding a recoil spring that will run first with known good load, then tackle your own reloading load issues. Plated bullets should be fine for minor pf.

[1SOW]

melissa5 ,

1. Use a few "fired cases" that haven't been sized or deprimed. Find three or four that will allow your bullet to be seated by hand. Just hand seat them far enough to just stay in the case.

3. With your bbl removed, slowly push these dummy rds into your chamber until they seat fully on the case mouth. Turn the bbl up and carefully remove the rd and then measure it. THAT is the oal that contacts the rifling or cone in that bbl with that bullet. Do this a few times with more spent cases and bullets until the results are consistent.

4. Your oal needs to be approximately .012-.015" "SHORTER" than the oal that hits the rifling. This allows for press and operator variations in your reloading Any longer can still hit the rifling and cause the problems you're having..

JMO

Edited September 25, 2012 by 1SOW

[melissa5]

melissa5 ,

1. Use a few "fired cases" that haven't been sized or deprimed. Find three or four that will allow your bullet to be seated by hand. Just hand seat them far enough to just stay in the case.

3. With your bbl removed, slowly push these dummy rds into your chamber until they seat fully on the case mouth. Turn the bbl up and carefully remove the rd and then measure it. THAT is the oal that contacts the rifling or cone in that bbl with that bullet. Do this a few times with more spent cases and bullets until the results are consistent.

4. Your oal needs to be approximately .012-.015" "SHORTER" than the oal that hits the rifling. This allows for press and operator variations in your reloading Any longer can still hit the rifling and cause the problems you're having..

JMO

I tried that and it came out to 1.168. That's longer than what I've been using - 1.135.

[melissa5]

I would buy a box of WWB and put a 10# recoil spring it to isolate the recoil spring. I use to run 10# shooting minor loads in a G17 open pistol with sjc comp. Your OAL should be fine unless your barrel is short chambered and then finish ream it to work with whatever OAL you decide to go with. Sorting your brass is a good idea if your having trouble with range pick up brass. You could have bulged brass if your picking up 9 major brass. I would work on finding a recoil spring that will run first with known good load, then tackle your own reloading load issues. Plated bullets should be fine for minor pf.

The guy that put the racer together for me tested it with Winchester Q loads. I don't know what those are, but they worked fine for him with the 12 lb spring.

[Chris iliff]

So case is stuck in chamber? Extractor rips off and case stays? Have to beat it out with a rod.

First, chuck up a bore brush in a drill and clean that chamber spotless. Use some Hoppe's or other good solvent.

Chambers can get a buildup in them that is hard to describe. Kinda like a shellac. Round fires and it superheats this gunk and can cause your brass to stick to it, like superglue.

And/Or, your chamber is out of tolerance because of blowback flow and is bulging the brass.

I've suffered both, just throwing some suggestions at you. Good luck.

[FightFireJay]

...With the last stuck case, the gun jammed and wouldn't fire and the slide wouldn't lock back. So, the RO bumped the back of the slide and then fired. Then, the case was stuck....

Should I be separating the fired cases by headstamp?

You should be beating the RO for shooting your gun under a dangerous condition!

[Bob DuBois]

While I like plated bullets for 9mm minor loads suggest you purchase jacketed for major.

The standard Lee sizing die will size closer to the extractor groove than some other brands and I use Lee sizing dies in the first station of every pistol caliber I load, using Dillon 550 and 650 presses. The U die really shines in 40S@W along with 9mm. It will size the brass a thousands or two tighter than the standard Lee die. Lee's sizer also has an good design on the primer punch. I would suggest you use Dillon's one inch nuts as Lee's nuts are a little weak. I placed the lock nut on the bottom of the tool head on the 650 as Lee's threads are a little shorter. I have used both the standard Lee sizer as well as the Lee U die with good results in my 9mm Trojan and Glock 34.

Lee's seating die, you can make small adjustments with a small knob on the top of the die. I shoot heavier bullets in 9mm minor and had problems with OAL. Send the bullet your loading to Lee and for a few bucks they will send you an insert matching that bullet, OAL problem solved. I don't use Lee's factory crimp die as such just back it off and taper crimp with it.

I've seen several guns with tight chambers including a 9mm open STI that wouldn't run take off by just switching to the U die, money well spent.

9mm is a tapered wall case and can be harder to reload because brass, it varies from manufacturer. I spend a little time inspecting 9mm brass before throwing them in the hopper. Standing all the cases up on a table to inspect for splits, chigger bites or trash in the case along with berdan primers that will break your punch. 380 or other calibers that snuck into the tumbler can also be removed easily because of height. While picking them up to put in the lube pan I look at the headstamp. Any that are not quality names get chunked along with Military cases. Military cases have a smaller case volume than standard cases. My machine won't swage the primer pockets and with as much range brass that's out there it's not worth the time to swage it. Chunk it or give it to someone with a 1050. Alos look at the primers, excessive pressure rounds from an open pistol get chunked also, might not hold the primer.

The time spent inspecting saves lots of jams and makes the loading process much easier. Lube cases, makes the whole proces easier on the dies, brass, the machine and the operator. Use the least amount of lube as necessary to get the machine to run smoothly.

[melissa5]

Well, I've investigated the Winchester Q loads and have found that they are the white box fmj that come in 50-round boxes. The stock # is Q4172. Supposedly, these rounds are slightly different/better than the 100-round value packs that my gun won't cycle. So, I'm going to buy a couple of boxes and test with them. If they work without any problems, I'll buy a whole case and then start trying to duplicate them with my reloads. I've already ordered a EGW U die and some new Starline brass. Chris iliff, I will clean the barrel within an inch of it's life. Bob Dubois, I will buy some lube. FightFireJay, I will go back and smack that RO. HoMie, I will buy a 10# spring and test with it.

Thanks for all of the suggestions.

[Steve RA]

This may not be your problem, but, some 9mm steel cases look just like brass cases. If you have any of them, they will definitely "stick". Easy way to check is to run a magnet thru cases prior to loading.

[Scootertheshooter]

You say you are using the barrel as case gauge . Do the fall back out easily? Do the rounds go all the way in the barrel?

I had a similar problem and my sizing die had backed out 2turns causing fte as you described.i also drilled and tapped for a set screw to adjust tension on my extractor .

With 6.6 of HS6 you don't make major but I don't think that's what you are trying to do.

Welcome to the world of trying to make an open Glock run:)

[sroe3]

I had a similar problem a few months back. Failure to battery and/or failure to extract. Some of my brass was bulged. The case gauge I used wasn't as tight as my chamber so I wasn't finding them.

[melissa5]

You say you are using the barrel as case gauge . Do the fall back out easily? Do the rounds go all the way in the barrel?

I had a similar problem and my sizing die had backed out 2turns causing fte as you described.i also drilled and tapped for a set screw to adjust tension on my extractor .

With 6.6 of HS6 you don't make major but I don't think that's what you are trying to do.

Welcome to the world of trying to make an open Glock run:)

Some fall back out easily and some don't. The ones that don't are put aside and will fire in my stock Glocks. This may seem excessive, but I measure the length on all of my rounds. Perhaps they need to be shorter than 1.135.

I fired 100 rounds of the Winchester Q loads tonight and none of them stuck in the chamber. I did have a lot of light strikes though. Perhaps I need to put the stock firing pin spring back in. It doesn't seem to be a problem with my Federal primers.

I'm about at the end of my rope with this open gun.

[CocoBolo]

This may not be your problem, but, some 9mm steel cases look just like brass cases. If you have any of them, they will definitely "stick". Easy way to check is to run a magnet thru cases prior to loading.

ZAKLEY I was just going to add that. I learned the hard way at the Gator 2 years ago, steel cases disguised as brass, now every case is check before it goes in the case feeder, after loading and putting them in to dillon cases I check them a second time

That load of his isn't any where near major, mine was 184pf at that one. Took a jack hammer to get the brass out the aftec tore its rim off.

I don't know nothing about those tupper ware guns except I have seen a lot more that don't run than ones that do run, so not just anyone can make one run even if they can put the parts in using the instruction sheet. More complicated than putting a baby bed together.

Can anyone say Drop Check? And be pickey if it don't drop force it only over the practice bucket.

[melissa5]

I received the EGW U die yesterday and loaded up 5 rounds and then shot them without any problems, so I loaded up 50 to test at the range this weekend. While I was loading, I noticed that some of the bullets (plated) were being kind of shaved off or wrinkled around the lip of the case. So, I assume that I need to bell/flare the case a little more. Also, after seating and crimping, it looks like the where the bullet goes into the case is the widest part of the case except for the rim. Suggestions?

[lcs]

I received the EGW U die yesterday and loaded up 5 rounds and then shot them without any problems, so I loaded up 50 to test at the range this weekend. While I was loading, I noticed that some of the bullets (plated) were being kind of shaved off or wrinkled around the lip of the case. So, I assume that I need to bell/flare the case a little more. Also, after seating and crimping, it looks like the where the bullet goes into the case is the widest part of the case except for the rim. Suggestions?

Get rid of plated or FMJ bullets in open guns. When you get to 1000 to 1200 FPS, the copper plated bullets can leave copper in the chamber. You can easily break the plating and not realize it. How do I know this--Experience. Use CMJ or JHP bullets for open. FMJ have exposed bases and you melt that lead with open loads. The lead goes in your barrel.

With a U-Die, the loaded round will appear fatter than the middle of the case. Not to worry. Yes, you should bell a little more. Shaving copper is another by product of plated bullets. The copper jacket is just not as robust as CMJ or JHP.

[melissa5]

I received the EGW U die yesterday and loaded up 5 rounds and then shot them without any problems, so I loaded up 50 to test at the range this weekend. While I was loading, I noticed that some of the bullets (plated) were being kind of shaved off or wrinkled around the lip of the case. So, I assume that I need to bell/flare the case a little more. Also, after seating and crimping, it looks like the where the bullet goes into the case is the widest part of the case except for the rim. Suggestions?

Get rid of plated or FMJ bullets in open guns. When you get to 1000 to 1200 FPS, the copper plated bullets can leave copper in the chamber. You can easily break the plating and not realize it. How do I know this--Experience. Use CMJ or JHP bullets for open. FMJ have exposed bases and you melt that lead with open loads. The lead goes in your barrel.

With a U-Die, the loaded round will appear fatter than the middle of the case. Not to worry. Yes, you should bell a little more. Shaving copper is another by product of plated bullets. The copper jacket is just not as robust as CMJ or JHP.

Excellent! What bullets do you suggest? All I've ever used were plated...Berry's, Precision Delta, and X-treme. A friend uses Montana Gold, but what other bullets would be good?

Edited to add that I also reduced the OAL to 1.125.

Edited September 28, 2012 by melissa5

[melissa5]

Thanks for all of the replies. I feel like I'm finally getting closer to getting this fixed.