mas Posted August 16, 2004 Share Posted August 16, 2004 I have three guns that I shoot regularly: a stock Series I Kimber Gold Combat, a Glock 30, and a Glock 19. I have only been shooting stock pistols that I carry and use Federal factory loads. Some have suggested I go to 200 gr rounds in .45, but I want to be able to shoot well with the factory loadings. I'm stubborn that way. I have not done anything to my springs.... When shooting the 19, I pull off fast splits and the gun is a flat shooter....being that it's 9mm, it's not surprising. When I shoot the 30, I shoot nearly as fast and accurately (ranges from .18 to .20), but it takes a bit more in the grip/wrist department to pull off. When I shoot the 1911, which is what I'd like to compete with in the future, my splits are somewhat inconsistent (e.g., on one string of four shots, my splits included a .21, a .19, and a .16, not necessarily in that order.....) and it seems to me that I've got to "chase" the front sight from shot to shot.....it seems to do this almost regardless of tension level. I'm wondering if the increased weight of the 1911 slide may be partly responsible. Maybe I'm too frail to manage the weight of the pistol parts during recoil. I'm kind of at that point where I need to choose a platform and stick with it, and although my heart is with the 1911 platform, my performance seems to side with Glock. Before I just say goodbye to the 1911 for good, I'm hoping that someone may have something to normalize my woes and can give me suggestions for getting on track. Also, it's harder for me to quickly and easily grip the 1911, given it's narrow grip circumference and I am hoping that someone may have a suggestion about what grips to purchase that might be slightly thicker than normal....The grips on a Les Baer feel pretty good. Thanks for taking the time to read this and thanks in advance for any suggestions you may have! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
.40AET Posted August 16, 2004 Share Posted August 16, 2004 I want to be able to shoot well with the factory loadings. I'm stubborn that way STOP being stubborn that way. Try some lower recoil loads. I chronographed a friends Glock with Winchester white box in .45 and the power factor was over 200. If you want to compete, the power factor is currently 165 and you will appreciate the lower recoil in your Kimber. If you really need to be stubborn, then abandond the high power .45 loads and shoot the Glock 17 in production. It's cheaper to get started, and after a year, you will have a better idea of what direction you want to take your shooting in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mas Posted August 16, 2004 Author Share Posted August 16, 2004 I had no idea that some of the factory loads are so high! I've shot with some people, like a friend who is a member of a SWAT team, that shoots so darn fast and accurately using factory ball in 230 grain loadings....not that I'm thinking of becoming a SWAT wannabe or tactical ninja, but it showed me that it's possible to do it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mas Posted August 16, 2004 Author Share Posted August 16, 2004 oh yeah, I forgot to say thanks....Perhaps I will just start in competition using a 17. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
.40AET Posted August 16, 2004 Share Posted August 16, 2004 I wish that I had gotten my feet wet the first year with a production gun. I could have saved a ton of foolish money. Since you have a 17, you might as well start there. Hell, you might go straight to Open from production. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mas Posted August 16, 2004 Author Share Posted August 16, 2004 to be honest, I want to eventually compete in IDPA with *exactly* what I'd carry on the street (minus defensive hollow points). I most often carry a .45 ACP. For the time being, I am not interested in Open type shooting...I'm sure it'll be a matter of time, however. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rhino Posted August 16, 2004 Share Posted August 16, 2004 There's nothing wrong with full power factory ammo, but you have to understand that there are consequences (in terms of the competition) to using it (increased recoil and muzzle flip). If you can accept them, then you're fine. I shoot factory ammo too. I could shoot a lot better with ammo loaded to 165.000001 PF, but I choose to not do that. I know it slows me down, but I accept that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mas Posted August 16, 2004 Author Share Posted August 16, 2004 Yeah, I guess that's the reality of it.....I'll just have to bust my butt to shoot the gun at hyperspeed. Just curious: what kind of splits are you pulling with factory loads on a Bill Drill at close (e.g., 7yds) range? My goal would be to shoot in the .15 to .18 range with factory loads, but perhaps that's unrealistic? Maybe not... I don't know *why* this is such a goal for me...there are other things that are as important, if not more important, than split times.....but it's just one of those things.....guess it's just something I want to accomplish for myself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benny hill Posted August 16, 2004 Share Posted August 16, 2004 Forget about fast splits. Anything around .18 to .25 will win most matches if you do everything else right. Two A's at .25 is better than a .15 split w/ an A & D hit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flexmoney Posted August 17, 2004 Share Posted August 17, 2004 mas, Get your butt shooting matches. You will learn abouit 1000x faster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rhino Posted August 17, 2004 Share Posted August 17, 2004 Just curious: what kind of splits are you pulling with factory loads on a Bill Drill at close (e.g., 7yds) range? My goal would be to shoot in the .15 to .18 range with factory loads, but perhaps that's unrealistic? Maybe not... I don't know! I don't do much of anything with a timer outside of a match and I never check that. I am learning to press the trigger as soon as the front sight comes back into the notch, so it doesn't matter to me what the actual time is as long as I am doing it as fast as I can and still see the front sight where it needs to be. On super close stuff when I point shoot, I know I can go below 0.15, but that is meaningless in this context. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mas Posted August 17, 2004 Author Share Posted August 17, 2004 I'll definitely start shooting matches in the near future, but I want to work on smoothing out a couple of things....my draw needs help and I need a little more work on transitions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rhino Posted August 17, 2004 Share Posted August 17, 2004 Shooting matches will help with those! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DogmaDog Posted August 17, 2004 Share Posted August 17, 2004 I find shooting Glocks unnatural to me, because the angle of the grip is different than on a 1911...the sight naturally returns too high for me. Because of that I doubt that the problems you have are the result of anything to do with the wieght of a 1911 slide, or the PF of the ammo (is a Glock slide really lighter than a 1911 slide?) I think you're just not used to a 1911, and your sights don't naturally come back to alignment like they do with a Glock. If you still want to shoot .45, that's fine...but start reloading! Factory .45 is insanely expensive. You'll recoup the cost of reloading equipment in about 1 year (maybe 2) of shooting if you load all your own .45. DogmaDog Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
diehli Posted August 17, 2004 Share Posted August 17, 2004 I'll definitely start shooting matches in the near future, but I want to work on smoothing out a couple of things....my draw needs help and I need a little more work on transitions. I agree with rhino... hell, how do you even know that that's where you should be spending your time without shooting matches? If you want to shoot the 1911, go for it. If the G19 works best for you, go for it. Whatever the case: "Pick one and practice." © Steve Anderson Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chp5 Posted August 17, 2004 Share Posted August 17, 2004 to be honest, I want to eventually compete in IDPA with *exactly* what I'd carry on the street (minus defensive hollow points). I most often carry a .45 ACP. If you shoot the Glock better, then maybe you should carry the Glock! A 9mm Glock is a great first competition pistol (either USPSA or IDPA) - especially if you don't reload. I shoot a 40 cal Glock in USPSA and have Glocks for personal protection as well. My competition Glock is not the same as my defensive Glocks, but the manual of arms, grip angle, etc are all the same. Glocks can also be shot well at a high level of competition - just look at fellow board members like Matthew Mink, Flexmoney, Turtle, etc. P.S. - also listen to Benny's advice. He knows a thing or two Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mas Posted August 17, 2004 Author Share Posted August 17, 2004 Yeah, I'll go ahead and start with a 9mm....in fact, looks like I may enter a match in a couple of weeks. There's a local one that runs almost weekly....but I STILL want to shoot a 1911 at that rate of speed just for the sake of *personal* accomplishment.....that particular goal has little to do with competition and more to do with a personal goal. I'll just keep chugging away at the range....I'm just glad I can now *see* what's going on at my current speed. That alone is a personal accomplishment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flexmoney Posted August 17, 2004 Share Posted August 17, 2004 I'll definitely start shooting matches in the near future, but I want to work on smoothing out a couple of things....my draw needs help and I need a little more work on transitions. Everybody needs work on the draw and their transition. It don't matter. Get to a match. You WILL learn faster by shooting matches. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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