clutchy Posted July 27, 2012 Share Posted July 27, 2012 ok sorry I can't post links to the pics so text... So I'm relatively new to this but I purchased a Dillon machine from this site that was setup to pump out 9mm. So after getting some load data and checking my brass and powder measure to make sure it's dropping the right amount I cranked out a few rounds and then stopped for some evaluation. this is what they look like and how they are sized 1.120 this is how my test cartridge came and measured to 1.106.5 and this is a factory federal 9mm round 1.153.5 so there's somewhat of a variation between them. I started with the lowest load data in my speer manual for W231(4.4gr). I'm a little nervous about firing my test rounds because it looks like they're seated too low in the brass and I'm a little concerned about overpressure. should I be worried? Should I back of the seating die a little? I've heard alot of people seat 9mm to 1.13~ or thereabouts. Speer manual says 1.135 for the FMJ RN's. any advice for a noob? these are extreme plated bullets. I'm looking for a good solid reliable round that will feed in most firearms. Any comments and critique would be welcome. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Poppa Bear Posted July 27, 2012 Share Posted July 27, 2012 What kind of gun? A 2011 will take longer stuff than a Glock/XD/Smith. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clutchy Posted July 27, 2012 Author Share Posted July 27, 2012 What kind of gun? A 2011 will take longer stuff than a Glock/XD/Smith. glock 17/19 sig p226 do you think there's any danger in it going boom? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Poppa Bear Posted July 27, 2012 Share Posted July 27, 2012 If they are loaded to an OAL of 1.120 you should be safe considering you started at the min load. For a Glock and Sig an OAL of 1.135 is a good middle length. On my Glock 34 and 35 I can load out to 1.165 so 1.135 gives you plenty of room to fit them in the magazines. My STI handles them out to 1.203 but I load to 1.185 for that gun. (40 S&W) The first few loads you shoot are always scary. After that it becomes a piece of cake until you start pushing the envelope on MAX loads. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clutchy Posted July 27, 2012 Author Share Posted July 27, 2012 so... i switched that on accident. the cartridges I'm producing are 1.106.5.... I think I'm going to pull them and adjust the seating die. I suppose i'll have to adjust the crimp too if i adjust the seating die? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hi-Power Jack Posted July 27, 2012 Share Posted July 27, 2012 so... i switched that on accident. the cartridges I'm producing are 1.106.5.... I think I'm going to pull them and adjust the seating die. I suppose i'll have to adjust the crimp too if i adjust the seating die? Andy, no need to pull them. An OAL of 1.1" is fine, esp with such a light load. And, you have very strong guns. No need to adjust the crimp, if it works - Best procedure is to test the crimp and OAL by removing barrel from gun and drop the reloaded cartridges into the barrel - they should drop in all the way, and fall out when you turn the barrel upside down. If they don't, you have an incorrect measurement (oal or crimp, usually). If that happens, play with them until cartridges drop in and out of the barrel easily. To determine best OAL for Your gun with Your bullets, try bullets with no powder or primer, and seat them long - say 1.14", and see if they fit in the drop test. If not, seat it back to 1.13" and try again until you find the OAL and crimp that works well for you. Now load a light load, and fire them thru a chrono - check for 1. function - do they feed okay? 2. velocity - now you'll know if they're too light or too heavy 3. accuracy. Once you've found a load that works in your gun, and is reasonably accurate, then you're on the way to being a reloader Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcracco Posted July 27, 2012 Share Posted July 27, 2012 Listen to Jack... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
polizei1 Posted July 28, 2012 Share Posted July 28, 2012 (edited) The one of the left looks like a coke bottle cartridge to me. I would pull that and start over personally. Load them longer, when I test new loads I load 10-rounds at varying OAL's, like 1.12, 1.14, and 1.16. Shoot them from a rest (or sandbag) and see what is more accurate in your gun. If you have access to a chrono, I would make 10-round batches of various powder weights and see what's going to make PF. After you have the powder, then determine the OAL that's most accurate. Crimp for 9mm should be .375/.376. Granted I'm shooting a 1911, but my USPSA load is: Precision Delta 124gr FMJ Win 231 4.5gr CCI SPP #500 Mixed Brass OAL - 1.140" 135PF Edited July 28, 2012 by polizei1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clutchy Posted July 28, 2012 Author Share Posted July 28, 2012 so... i switched that on accident. the cartridges I'm producing are 1.106.5.... I think I'm going to pull them and adjust the seating die. I suppose i'll have to adjust the crimp too if i adjust the seating die? Andy, no need to pull them. An OAL of 1.1" is fine, esp with such a light load. And, you have very strong guns. No need to adjust the crimp, if it works - Best procedure is to test the crimp and OAL by removing barrel from gun and drop the reloaded cartridges into the barrel - they should drop in all the way, and fall out when you turn the barrel upside down. If they don't, you have an incorrect measurement (oal or crimp, usually). If that happens, play with them until cartridges drop in and out of the barrel easily. To determine best OAL for Your gun with Your bullets, try bullets with no powder or primer, and seat them long - say 1.14", and see if they fit in the drop test. If not, seat it back to 1.13" and try again until you find the OAL and crimp that works well for you. Now load a light load, and fire them thru a chrono - check for 1. function - do they feed okay? 2. velocity - now you'll know if they're too light or too heavy 3. accuracy. Once you've found a load that works in your gun, and is reasonably accurate, then you're on the way to being a reloader excellent! thank you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clutchy Posted July 28, 2012 Author Share Posted July 28, 2012 The one of the left looks like a coke bottle cartridge to me. I would pull that and start over personally. Load them longer, when I test new loads I load 10-rounds at varying OAL's, like 1.12, 1.14, and 1.16. Shoot them from a rest (or sandbag) and see what is more accurate in your gun. If you have access to a chrono, I would make 10-round batches of various powder weights and see what's going to make PF. After you have the powder, then determine the OAL that's most accurate. Crimp for 9mm should be .375/.376. Granted I'm shooting a 1911, but my USPSA load is: Precision Delta 124gr FMJ Win 231 4.5gr CCI SPP #500 Mixed Brass OAL - 1.140" 135PF would yoube surprised if i told you that's the test cartridge that came with my press? ordered from this site. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
polizei1 Posted July 28, 2012 Share Posted July 28, 2012 Yes, I am. There might be nothing wrong with it, but I personally wouldn't shoot it. The middle and right look good though. You don't need a lot of crimp on 9mm, just make it .375/.376. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sroe3 Posted July 28, 2012 Share Posted July 28, 2012 The coke bottle is common with Dillon and 9mm. 9mm is a tapered cartridge and neck tension is what holds the bullet in place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrumpyOne Posted July 28, 2012 Share Posted July 28, 2012 The coke bottle effect is a product of the Dillon dies, and in fact, that is the shape you want your rounds to be. As for comparing the OAL of your rounds to the OAL of factory rounds, unless you are using the same brass as factory, and the same bullet head, there is no sense in doing it. In fact, loading some bullet heads to factory OAL might cause feed issues, jam issues, and possibly kaboom issues. You should determine the max OAL for a specific bullet head in your gun, each and every time you change to a different style bullet head. For example, my Shadow uses an OAL of 1.150 with a PD 147 FMJ, but with a MG 124 JHP, I can only load to 1.085. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
polizei1 Posted July 28, 2012 Share Posted July 28, 2012 Why do the Dillon dies/press do that? I'm using a Lee LCT and Lee Dies, mine has never produced anything of that nature. Curious...looks to me like the crimp is way too much, but it's normal? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrumpyOne Posted July 28, 2012 Share Posted July 28, 2012 Why do the Dillon dies/press do that? I'm using a Lee LCT and Lee Dies, mine has never produced anything of that nature. Curious...looks to me like the crimp is way too much, but it's normal? The Dillon dies undersize the case more than other dies do. When the case comes out of the size die, it does not have the coke bottle look....it only gets that after seating a bullet. The effect holds the bullet secure, and there really isn't any crimp on the bullet...the tension alone holds the bullet in place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
polizei1 Posted July 28, 2012 Share Posted July 28, 2012 Ah ok, that makes sense. Thanks for enlightening me! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tac_driver Posted August 8, 2012 Share Posted August 8, 2012 looking at the photos the taper looks like it is too much and might be sizing the base of the bullet I would pull one of them and see if it is putting a groove in the bullet. I shoot for .377 to .378 just to remove the bell from the expanding die if you want it perfect bullet diameter + 2X case wall win case .355 + (.11*2) = .377 lead is usually .356 so .378 is better in win cases Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve RA Posted August 9, 2012 Share Posted August 9, 2012 Just crimp enough to remove the bell. Check with a straight edge - razor blade - to see that the case mouth has all the bell removed. Too much crimp is not good, especially for lead bullets and not needed when you have the "Wasp Waist" effect, which is good as it keeps the bullet from being forced further into the case when being loaded into the chamber. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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