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New Pro 5" .40 S&W shoots low...


FightFireJay

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I purchased my M&P Pro 5" for use in Limited / ESP. Unfortunately with 2 different hand loads and 1 factory load all are shooting about 5-6 inches low at 15 yards.

Here's my options (I think).

- File down the front sight(doesn't seem like a good idea on OEM FO front)

- Buy a taller rear (do they even make them?)

- Buy an adjustable rear (although it may not be able to adjust low enough, therefore over compensating, making buy taller front)

- Screw it, buy a whole new set of sights (I'm cheap!)

- Send it back to S&W so they can tell me it groups fine and I just need to aim higher.

Mostly I am hoping to get away with only purchasing an adjustable rear. The only problem is... how tall are they?

Is anyone willing to measure the height of their adjustable sight at it's lowest setting??

(Stock front sight looks to be about .190" high and the rear is about .245" tall when measured from the back of the slide.)

Thanks in advance,

Jeremy

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My Buddy had the same issue. If you search the forum you'll find gobs of other threads discussing the same thing. Suck it up and buy a Dawson adjustable rear sight and a fiber optic front, or something similar. If you want to compete in Limited, and you're anything like the other 99% of us shooting matches, it won't be your final upgrade :blink:

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You might take a look at the Dawson Precision adjustable rear sight for the M&P: http://www.dawsonprecision.com/ProductDetail.jsp?LISTID=80000998-1231195463 If you need more information call Dawson Precision and ask for Daniel.

Unfortunately it doesn't say how much taller the adjustable is than the stock sight. I do like the style of those compared to the Novak adjustable.

The other thing I am thinking is the adjustable sight has a narrower notch, necessitating a narrower (and taller) front sight.

Thanks for the replies... any other thoughts?

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Give it up. I tried several different front sights and some were close but none were perfect. Little high a little low. Dawson recommends a .305 front which is what I ended up with and it is tall but no problems. I think you could likely get by with a .285 which is what I would get if I had a do-over. I don't know why they can't make the Dawson rear a bit lower but they likely have a good reason. As I recall the left right adjustment for a Novak is a hammer. Some adjustable. The Dawson rear is sweet. Get a set and be done or spend a hundred on trying to make something else work like I did being cheap then buy the set from Dawson anyway. I sure have been happy with mine.

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Had the same issue with FO sights on my 9 Pro 5". Was tempted to do Dawson adjustable but the front was so high it didn't make sense to me on what is supposed to be a combat gun. Installed Trijicon SA37's and could not be happier. Gun shoots point of aim.

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(Stock front sight looks to be about .190" high and the rear is about .245" tall when measured from the back of the slide.)

Jeremy. Changed mine out for the Pro 5" in 9mm. Shooting minor power factor in USPSA. I went with the Dawson Precision adjustable rear. I had a Dawson .240 on the front which is shorter than what they recommend. I had the rear sight cranked way up to make it work. Didn't like it that far up and didn't like the tall front sight. I just replaced it with Dawson's .210 in the front. It works but I had to crank the rear sight down to its absolute lower limit. Irritating. However, it works for me. Good luck.

MHearn

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I purchased my M&P Pro 5" for use in Limited / ESP. Unfortunately with 2 different hand loads and 1 factory load all are shooting about 5-6 inches low at 15 yards.

Here's my options (I think).

- File down the front sight(doesn't seem like a good idea on OEM FO front)

- Buy a taller rear (do they even make them?)

- Buy an adjustable rear (although it may not be able to adjust low enough, therefore over compensating, making buy taller front)

- Screw it, buy a whole new set of sights (I'm cheap!)

- Send it back to S&W so they can tell me it groups fine and I just need to aim higher.

Mostly I am hoping to get away with only purchasing an adjustable rear. The only problem is... how tall are they?

Is anyone willing to measure the height of their adjustable sight at it's lowest setting??

(Stock front sight looks to be about .190" high and the rear is about .245" tall when measured from the back of the slide.)

Thanks in advance,

Jeremy

Not what you want to hear but I'd just bite the bullet and convert to the Dawson adjustable and their matching front sight. Down the road you can get a KKM 9mm conversion barrel and shoot it cheaper in ESP or Limited minor (with 9mm mags). You'll be able to adjust the sights for any load changes you decide to make.

My Dawson front is .265" and the top of the rear is .345". When I switch from 40SW to 9mm I turn it down 6 and right 2. YMMV

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...My Dawson front is .265" and the top of the rear is .345". When I switch from 40SW to 9mm I turn it down 6 and right 2. YMMV

Great info from all... And I hadn't thought that my conversion barrel (in the mail!) may have a different POI.

My tentative plan is this...

-wait until my KKM 9mm convo barrel comes in

-check POI and if it's similar to stock .40 barrel, then I will purchase a Dawson Precision .150" tall front.

-if they are different, then I'll be picking up an adjustable rear (prefer the Dawson)

Next question... Anybody have experience or even seen the adjustable Williams Gunsight "Firesight"?

http://www.williamsgunsight.com/gunsights/pistol.htm

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You might take a look at the Dawson Precision adjustable rear sight for the M&P: http://www.dawsonprecision.com/ProductDetail.jsp?LISTID=80000998-1231195463 If you need more information call Dawson Precision and ask for Daniel.

I just put the Dawson adjustable rear and .100 wide FO front on mine and you'll have to use the .305" front (.305 Tall x .100 Wide #021065) which to me is really high and hard for me to get used to. I most likely will go back to fixed rear and a lower front and sell these. Would be great with a suppressor ;')

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...My Dawson front is .265" and the top of the rear is .345". When I switch from 40SW to 9mm I turn it down 6 and right 2. YMMV

Great info from all... And I hadn't thought that my conversion barrel (in the mail!) may have a different POI.

My tentative plan is this...

-wait until my KKM 9mm convo barrel comes in

-check POI and if it's similar to stock .40 barrel, then I will purchase a Dawson Precision .150" tall front.

-if they are different, then I'll be picking up an adjustable rear (prefer the Dawson)

Next question... Anybody have experience or even seen the adjustable Williams Gunsight "Firesight"?

http://www.williamsgunsight.com/gunsights/pistol.htm

Off the subject sorry... but as I understand the conversion barrels are illegal in IDPA and Production correct?

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I went to a shorter front sight on mine, with the factory rear, I think .02" lower. Dawson swore I was "wrong", but it produces POI right at the top edge of the front blade from 5-20 yards. A bit higher at 30+ yards, but I like that. I can see more of the steel at distance, and then point-shoot close paper.

JeffWard

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...My Dawson front is .265" and the top of the rear is .345". When I switch from 40SW to 9mm I turn it down 6 and right 2. YMMV

Great info from all... And I hadn't thought that my conversion barrel (in the mail!) may have a different POI.

My tentative plan is this...

-wait until my KKM 9mm convo barrel comes in

-check POI and if it's similar to stock .40 barrel, then I will purchase a Dawson Precision .150" tall front.

-if they are different, then I'll be picking up an adjustable rear (prefer the Dawson)

Next question... Anybody have experience or even seen the adjustable Williams Gunsight "Firesight"?

http://www.williamsgunsight.com/gunsights/pistol.htm

Off the subject sorry... but as I understand the conversion barrels are illegal in IDPA and Production correct?

You are correct in being illegal for Production and SSP but, I WILL be corrected if I'm wrong, but I don't see why you couldn't use a conversion when shooting ESP.

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Jeff... You would be wrong (as Dawson says) IF your gun had the correct POA/POI from the factory. But I fear like mine, it is off and there is not much to be done to correct it other than a shorter front sight.

Regarding IDPA SSP and USPSA Production, yes conversion makes it "illegal" (but legal in ESP and Limited). The good news is I can load 180gr .40 down to 130 PF with TrailBoss or WST and run stock barrel for SSP or Production. But the bad news is, I don't believe 5" .40 pro is legal for SSP (I could be wrong)

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Jeff... You would be wrong (as Dawson says) IF your gun had the correct POA/POI from the factory. But I fear like mine, it is off and there is not much to be done to correct it other than a shorter front sight.

Regarding IDPA SSP and USPSA Production, yes conversion makes it "illegal" (but legal in ESP and Limited). The good news is I can load 180gr .40 down to 130 PF with TrailBoss or WST and run stock barrel for SSP or Production. But the bad news is, I don't believe 5" .40 pro is legal for SSP (I could be wrong)

It's fine for SSP, it's not (yet) approved for production.

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Jeff... You would be wrong (as Dawson says) IF your gun had the correct POA/POI from the factory. But I fear like mine, it is off and there is not much to be done to correct it other than a shorter front sight.

Regarding IDPA SSP and USPSA Production, yes conversion makes it "illegal" (but legal in ESP and Limited). The good news is I can load 180gr .40 down to 130 PF with TrailBoss or WST and run stock barrel for SSP or Production. But the bad news is, I don't believe 5" .40 pro is legal for SSP (I could be wrong)

It's fine for SSP, it's not (yet) approved for production.

Under SSP Rules:

EXCLUDED Modifications (NON-Inclusive list):

1. Externally visible modifications other than grips or sights.

2. Robar style grip reduction.

3. Add-on magazine well opening.

4. Guide rods made of a material different from the factory part it replaces.

5. Seattle Slug Grip Plug and similar weighted products. 20

6. A barrel of another caliber that is not offered in the original factory model.

7. Slide lightening (see “slide, lightening” in glossary for further information).

8. Checkering and stippling.

9. Refer to Appendix ONE-A. Firearms-Non-IDPA-Legal Modifications.

Please clarify as this seems to indicate that if your weapons serial number does not match the caliber it was offered in the original factory model then it is illegal. So a conversion from 40 to 9 would be illegal.

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Jeff... You would be wrong (as Dawson says) IF your gun had the correct POA/POI from the factory. But I fear like mine, it is off and there is not much to be done to correct it other than a shorter front sight.

Regarding IDPA SSP and USPSA Production, yes conversion makes it "illegal" (but legal in ESP and Limited). The good news is I can load 180gr .40 down to 130 PF with TrailBoss or WST and run stock barrel for SSP or Production. But the bad news is, I don't believe 5" .40 pro is legal for SSP (I could be wrong)

It's fine for SSP, it's not (yet) approved for production.

Under SSP Rules:

EXCLUDED Modifications (NON-Inclusive list):

1. Externally visible modifications other than grips or sights.

2. Robar style grip reduction.

3. Add-on magazine well opening.

4. Guide rods made of a material different from the factory part it replaces.

5. Seattle Slug Grip Plug and similar weighted products. 20

6. A barrel of another caliber that is not offered in the original factory model.

7. Slide lightening (see “slide, lightening” in glossary for further information).

8. Checkering and stippling.

9. Refer to Appendix ONE-A. Firearms-Non-IDPA-Legal Modifications.

Please clarify as this seems to indicate that if your weapons serial number does not match the caliber it was offered in the original factory model then it is illegal. So a conversion from 40 to 9 would be illegal.

I read it that he was planning on shooting his M&P 40 Pro with 40 loaded minor, not using a conversion barrel.

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Jeff... You would be wrong (as Dawson says) IF your gun had the correct POA/POI from the factory. But I fear like mine, it is off and there is not much to be done to correct it other than a shorter front sight.

Regarding IDPA SSP and USPSA Production, yes conversion makes it "illegal" (but legal in ESP and Limited). The good news is I can load 180gr .40 down to 130 PF with TrailBoss or WST and run stock barrel for SSP or Production. But the bad news is, I don't believe 5" .40 pro is legal for SSP (I could be wrong)

It's fine for SSP, it's not (yet) approved for production.

Under SSP Rules:

EXCLUDED Modifications (NON-Inclusive list):

1. Externally visible modifications other than grips or sights.

2. Robar style grip reduction.

3. Add-on magazine well opening.

4. Guide rods made of a material different from the factory part it replaces.

5. Seattle Slug Grip Plug and similar weighted products. 20

6. A barrel of another caliber that is not offered in the original factory model.

7. Slide lightening (see “slide, lightening” in glossary for further information).

8. Checkering and stippling.

9. Refer to Appendix ONE-A. Firearms-Non-IDPA-Legal Modifications.

Please clarify as this seems to indicate that if your weapons serial number does not match the caliber it was offered in the original factory model then it is illegal. So a conversion from 40 to 9 would be illegal.

I read it that he was planning on shooting his M&P 40 Pro with 40 loaded minor, not using a conversion barrel.

Right, for SSP I would shoot the stock .40 barrel with light loaded ammo.

For ESP, I would shoot the 9mm conversion barrel.

Thanks for the clarification (wrong info on my part lol) on M&P Pro 40 being able to be used in SSP but not in Production.

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Jeff... You would be wrong (as Dawson says) IF your gun had the correct POA/POI from the factory. But I fear like mine, it is off and there is not much to be done to correct it other than a shorter front sight.

Regarding IDPA SSP and USPSA Production, yes conversion makes it "illegal" (but legal in ESP and Limited). The good news is I can load 180gr .40 down to 130 PF with TrailBoss or WST and run stock barrel for SSP or Production. But the bad news is, I don't believe 5" .40 pro is legal for SSP (I could be wrong)

It's fine for SSP, it's not (yet) approved for production.

Under SSP Rules:

EXCLUDED Modifications (NON-Inclusive list):

1. Externally visible modifications other than grips or sights.

2. Robar style grip reduction.

3. Add-on magazine well opening.

4. Guide rods made of a material different from the factory part it replaces.

5. Seattle Slug Grip Plug and similar weighted products. 20

6. A barrel of another caliber that is not offered in the original factory model.

7. Slide lightening (see “slide, lightening” in glossary for further information).

8. Checkering and stippling.

9. Refer to Appendix ONE-A. Firearms-Non-IDPA-Legal Modifications.

Please clarify as this seems to indicate that if your weapons serial number does not match the caliber it was offered in the original factory model then it is illegal. So a conversion from 40 to 9 would be illegal.

I read it that he was planning on shooting his M&P 40 Pro with 40 loaded minor, not using a conversion barrel.

Right, for SSP I would shoot the stock .40 barrel with light loaded ammo.

For ESP, I would shoot the 9mm conversion barrel.

Thanks for the clarification (wrong info on my part lol) on M&P Pro 40 being able to be used in SSP but not in Production.

I was not meaning to imply anything I was just inquiring as I too was considering a conversion 40 to 9 barrel or a 9 to 357 and was not sure what I could do with them per the rules.

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I was not meaning to imply anything I was just inquiring as I too was considering a conversion 40 to 9 barrel or a 9 to 357 and was not sure what I could do with them per the rules.

FYI: 40 or 357 sig to 9 mm listed but nothing for ".. a 9 to 357" .

http://www.kkmprecision.com/custom_pistol_barrels/home.php?cat=39

OOOPS Typed that wrong meant 40 to 9 or 357. Thanks

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