HI5-O Posted March 8, 2012 Share Posted March 8, 2012 I just installed the following Apex Tactical parts: USB Hard sear and comp spring RAM Trigger pull reduced to 3lbs 9oz, but noticeable trigger creep that feels like the sear is 'skipping' against the striker leg before it breaks. Did I miss something on the install or is it because the pull in much lighter that the creep becomes more noticeable? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
9X23Guy Posted March 8, 2012 Share Posted March 8, 2012 My guess is probably not. A striker fired gun will never have as clean a trigger as a traditional setup, ie a 1911. Its not that bad either. I shoot both platforms and there are some advantages to both. The M&P is a fine handgun but you have to approach it with some expectation management. Cons are triggers will never be as good though not bad, accuracy will be close to but not have as much potential as a well built 1911, lightweight as some prefer a steel frame and maybe looks. The pros are good trigger, cost, good ergonomics ie. different backstraps, no external safeties, cost, and it doesn't require a true gunsmith to work on. Just someone with a few punches, a little mechanical aptitude and a little patience. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
9X23Guy Posted March 8, 2012 Share Posted March 8, 2012 (edited) Forgot to mention high capacity mags, 20-23 rounds, cost half as much to build and do not require tuning. Edited March 8, 2012 by 9X23Guy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matgyver Posted March 8, 2012 Share Posted March 8, 2012 I found that I could feel more in the trigger pull after I put the apex kit in. I attributed that to less pressure on the index finger pad causing better feel which in turn may exaggerate the feel of the sear dropping down the striker face. I stoned the striker face and the feel cleaned up a bit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HI5-O Posted March 8, 2012 Author Share Posted March 8, 2012 I found that I could feel more in the trigger pull after I put the apex kit in. I attributed that to less pressure on the index finger pad causing better feel which in turn may exaggerate the feel of the sear dropping down the striker face. I stoned the striker face and the feel cleaned up a bit. That must be it. Before the sear install, I had installed the USB and the trigger pull was about 4lbs 7oz with the stock Pro sear. I'll try shooting it a bit to see if it wears in before taking a stone to it. Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcracco Posted March 10, 2012 Share Posted March 10, 2012 Did you check to see the striker block moves freely and is not binding? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RH45 Posted March 10, 2012 Share Posted March 10, 2012 I put the Apex competition kit in my Pro, and it breaks clean. A friend of mine, shot mine, and then put the kits in 2 of his M&Ps. One feels perfect, and one has some creep. Production guns are not always exactly to the same spec, so I would guess a little stoning is in order to reduce/eliminate the excess creep. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jcc7x7 Posted March 10, 2012 Share Posted March 10, 2012 Look at the back of the trigger safety (i.e plastic finger that sticks thru the trigger) is it hanging up on the frame. This happens cause the weight is lighter. you may have to polish the plastic. LOL to smooth that out or very slightly again I say very slightly cut the back of the finger a little so it clears the frame quicker, so you don't feel the drag/creep. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
9X23Guy Posted March 10, 2012 Share Posted March 10, 2012 This thread cracks me up. We are talking about stoning on a $600 plastic gun. Don't get me wrong, I'm a big M&P fan but I like them for what they are. I understand some of your frustrations though. I have two great M&Ps, a 9 and a Pro in 9. Both have been nothing but fantastic with and without mods. However, I've handled some from the factory that clearly are not the same. I hate to say it because I have a lot of S&Ws but quality control seems to be hit or miss with these guns. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sin-ster Posted March 10, 2012 Share Posted March 10, 2012 (edited) Look at the back of the trigger safety (i.e plastic finger that sticks thru the trigger) is it hanging up on the frame. This happens cause the weight is lighter. you may have to polish the plastic. LOL to smooth that out or very slightly again I say very slightly cut the back of the finger a little so it clears the frame quicker, so you don't feel the drag/creep. Honestly, I don't even notice it even more-- even without any pre-travel to speak of, after Dan worked his magic. It'll clean up quite a bit of its own accord when you shoot it as well. Edited March 10, 2012 by Sin-ster Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matgyver Posted March 10, 2012 Share Posted March 10, 2012 This thread cracks me up. We are talking about stoning on a $600 plastic gun. Don't get me wrong, I'm a big M&P fan but I like them for what they are. I understand some of your frustrations though. I have two great M&Ps, a 9 and a Pro in 9. Both have been nothing but fantastic with and without mods. However, I've handled some from the factory that clearly are not the same. I hate to say it because I have a lot of S&Ws but quality control seems to be hit or miss with these guns. So, since it's a $600 gun it shouldn't be tweaked to a user's likes and quality control isn't an issue? Thinking that way says that $1500-2500 STIs should have no quality control issues, but at the same time you have to work on them to get them running (stoning etc...)? BTW, those 2011s are kinda plastic too, just sayin'. The real issue here is putting "custom yet one-size-fits-all" parts in a factory gun and expecting more than what will result. Match the semi custom parts with some minor fitting and you have a $600 "plastic" gun with some major improvements. Its really simple. If the APEX parts didn't work and make a difference, they wouldn't sell or be as popular as they are. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HI5-O Posted March 10, 2012 Author Share Posted March 10, 2012 Look at the back of the trigger safety (i.e plastic finger that sticks thru the trigger) is it hanging up on the frame. This happens cause the weight is lighter. you may have to polish the plastic. LOL to smooth that out or very slightly again I say very slightly cut the back of the finger a little so it clears the frame quicker, so you don't feel the drag/creep. The trigger safety clears the frame with ease. Should have mentioned that I still have the factory trigger return spring and factory striker spring in the gun if that makes a difference. I'll shoot it and then try to add in the reduced power striker spring and see if the pull cleans up a little more. Yeah, I know this is a $600 plastic gun and know it won't be like my other (more expensive) single action competition guns, I just want to make it better for "me". If other owners have good tips that worked for them then I'm glad they posted it here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
9X23Guy Posted March 11, 2012 Share Posted March 11, 2012 (edited) Sarcasm is "a sharp, bitter, or cutting expression or remark; a bitter jibe or taunt",[1] usually conveyed through irony or understatement.[2] Most authorities distinguish sarcasm from irony;[3] however, others argue that sarcasm may or often does involve irony[4] or employs ambivalence.[5] Easy dudes, it seems M&P owners have thin skin here. My intent was not to offend $600 plastic gun owners or the work they do to their guns. $600 plastic gun is said as a joke, "ironic" because I have one too. I have done a bit of work to mine as well to make it shoot better. I am mostly an open shooter, I also shoot an M&P from time to time for IDPA. For me, there is no comparison between how far you can take an M&P and how far you can take an open gun like my STI. I've chased a the ideal trigger for the better part of a year now in my M&P. I've tried and shot Burwell jobs (very nice) and Apex everything. At some point I just accepted it for what it is and just shoot it. All in all it is not too bad. I run an Apex FSS and trigger with some different springs for about a 3.5 lbs trigger and a RAM, lots of polishing. Take up is short, break is decent, over travel is short, reset is short but not very tactile. I too love the great advice you can get here. Best of luck to all you thin skinned $600 plastic gun owners. (That was meant as humor) Edited March 11, 2012 by 9X23Guy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RH45 Posted March 11, 2012 Share Posted March 11, 2012 On my 1911s, and 2011s, most have a 20 ounce trigger. With just dropping in the Apex, competition kit, my 9mm Pro, went to about 36 ounces, and once you get past the takeup, very crisp, and very shootable, unlike, when it came from the factory. I've put several k through it, and haven't checked it, so it could be lighter now. As far as I'm concerned, it is light years ahead of my Glocks, as far as the trigger goes! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sin-ster Posted March 12, 2012 Share Posted March 12, 2012 If you're trying to get a 1911/2011 trigger out of a striker fired platform... I'm sure we've all got some lead sitting around that we'd love for you to turn into gold, when you're finished with the trigger project. That said, I firmly believe that of all the striker-fired options on the market, the M&P has the capacity to have the best trigger-- and it's pretty darn simple to achieve as well. Frankly, I shoot Production-- and that, as they say, is that. About as expensive/extensive as we can go is with a CZ, or a similar platform-- and I'm not about to mess with that DA pull from the holster. Unlike many, I don't see it as an "entry Division"; it's in the same category as Open in that it's very unique and can be a lot of fun. It is however on the opposite side of the spectrum-- less gun, more shooter. (Obviously not to impugn Open shooters! It's the only other Division I see myself competing in, so you know I'm not knocking it!) For those of us who feel firmly rooted in the Division, spending cash on our guns is no different than running out to have the best Open gun built that money can buy. Our equipment is restricted by the rules, but it's still just as important to us and worthy of our time, effort and concerns. In that light, taking a stone to a $600 pistol is no different than taking a stone to a finicky $2000 one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jkatz44 Posted August 9, 2012 Share Posted August 9, 2012 Is there any way to smooth out the pull on the L/Pro but keep it at like 6lbs?(IPSC production...) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmiller Posted August 9, 2012 Share Posted August 9, 2012 Send it to Dan Burwell Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jkatz44 Posted August 10, 2012 Share Posted August 10, 2012 Was hoping to do it myself... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
strikeraj Posted August 10, 2012 Share Posted August 10, 2012 Was hoping to do it myself... just google it and burwell has a nice ppt slide teaching how to do your own Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jkatz44 Posted August 10, 2012 Share Posted August 10, 2012 Yup thanks a lot. Found it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FightFireJay Posted August 10, 2012 Share Posted August 10, 2012 Is there any way to smooth out the pull on the L/Pro but keep it at like 6lbs?(IPSC production...) Apex Duty/Cary Trigger Kit 5-5.5 lbs it says. But you could probably increase that to 6 lbs by playing with springs. And I'd also highly recomend the RAM, helps a lot with reset. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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