Prone to Standing on the Clock?

[KungFuNerd]

Does this happen in a COF?

I would imagine it does in 3 Gun but wondering about IDPA/USPSA.

I've been doing "Burpees" with a Pistol in my hand

[Skydiver]

Most USPSA course designers will design their stages that may require going prone such that it's the last shooting position. Really good designers will set things up to give the shooters options to shoot that position last, or at some other time in the CoF with a good balance of risk vs. reward.

Edited February 24, 2012 by Skydiver

[jdphotoguy]

I've yet to shoot a USPSA stage that required a prone shooting position or one were a prone position would have made sense.

[Skydiver]

I've yet to shoot a USPSA stage that required a prone shooting position or one were a prone position would have made sense.

You're lucky!

One of the best stages with involved going prone that I shot was at Area 1 in 2007 where the prone shooting position was in the middle of the stage. Most people opted to work the left and right sides of the stage and finish prone in the middle. A was amazed to see a nimble young guy who shot the left side of the stage, did something almost like the splits in front of the low port in the middle, and then popped right up to finish on the right side of the stage.

I'm surprised you haven't run across the classifiers CM 99-09 Long Range Standards, CM 99-51 Single Tap Standards, or CM 08-05 Long Range Standards 2.

[jdphotoguy]

I'd love to try a stage that required a prone shooting position. No offense to anyone, but there are a large number of shooters I see at matches that would be hard pressed to go prone and get back up again given their size.

Edited February 24, 2012 by jdphotoguy

[Chris iliff]

I aint complaining, but the older I get, 44, well, it just hurts.

[Dave C]

I'd love to try a stage that required a prone shooting position. No offense to anyone, but there are a large number of shooters I see at matches that would be hard pressed to go prone and get back up again given their size.

No offense taken, but.......I am not a big guy by any means, but at 59 years of age and a with knee that has been replaced twice, I am also hard pressed to go prone and get back up again.

[38supPat]

I shot one a couple of years ago that had you go prone in the first position (right after the beep) and then shoot the rest of the course, there was no option unless you wanted to work your way down the 25 odd meters the course covered moving down range and then run all the way back up range to the start position.

[Flexmoney]

Does this happen in a COF?

No, not often. And, especially not often after a Match director runs it and realize that his "customers" don't really care for it.

Should it be that way? Maybe, maybe not. But, we really aren't testing burpees. (though we are testing "practical".)

I always thought it would be great to run 2 monthly matches at a club. One being more physical than the other.

Anyway...here is prone at the end of a cof....along with an up and down kneeling position. Oh...and I "tying your shoe" start position. While well received, this is pushing it. But, our local club is kinda known for running more elaborate courses of fire.

* Also * Be extra mindful of your shooting angles and berms when putting a shooter in a low shooting position with stage design. You don't want them even close to shooting over the berms.

[pjb45]

One year at the Tulsa Nationals, there was a low port with two maybe three close targets. As I remember TGO just did sort of bend/squat lowered his gun to below his belly button and just pointed his gun and shot.

Another year at LV Nationals I thought there were a stage or two which required going prone or taking at least a deep knee bend.

IMO: these types of stages disadvantage the taller, heavier, or less agile shooter in the match. Sort builds in a handicap for the younger, more flexible shooter, especially when going prone positions are in the middle of the COF.

This year's SMM3G had a very low port in a shotgun stage, most went prone of some type and few just stretcccccched the leg out.

[38supPat]

I shot one a couple of years ago that had you go prone in the first position (right after the beep) and then shoot the rest of the course, there was no option unless you wanted to work your way down the 25 odd meters the course covered moving down range and then run all the way back up range to the start position.

[cannot]

One of the early match shooters, Buck toddy, used to do this on the 1.5 seconds stage of the Advanced Military. This was on stopwatch timing, tho, so figure more like 1.70 seconds, on today's electronic timers. Still, for a draw, going prone and an A zone hit, faster than the average cop can even draw and fire a hip point "miss", that's fast. What is required is that you do a leg-split, and a judo break fall (onto your weak side palm and forearm) as you draw, fall forward from a low "squat" sort of position, onto your strongside arm, (as you extend it) and catch a 2 handed grip as you position your legs.

[pops1982]

IMO: these types of stages disadvantage the taller, heavier, or less agile shooter in the match. Sort builds in a handicap for the younger, more flexible shooter, especially when going prone positions are in the middle of the COF.

You know every COF I've shot favors all of the shooters that are faster and more accurate than me regardless of whether or not you must go prone.

[RaylanGivens]

I'm surprised you haven't run across the classifiers CM 99-09 Long Range Standards, CM 99-51 Single Tap Standards, or CM 08-05 Long Range Standards 2.

Those are some killer classifiers!

How does a club choose which classifiers to run each month? Can they choose whatever classifier they want, or is there a specific group of classifiers to choose from every month?

[dand38s]

I have shot a few stages with prone ports. Most of them were at area matches. First thing I learned was that if you have mags across your belly they will HURT when they get stuck between the ground and your gut. After that first time I always made sure that I planned to not have any of the mags in the front mag holders.

[Not-So-Mad Matt]

What is required is that you do a leg-split, and a judo break fall (onto your weak side palm and forearm) as you draw, fall forward from a low "squat" sort of position, onto your strongside arm, (as you extend it) and catch a 2 handed grip as you position your legs.

I'm going to need a bit more explanation.

[Skydiver]

I'm surprised you haven't run across the classifiers CM 99-09 Long Range Standards, CM 99-51 Single Tap Standards, or CM 08-05 Long Range Standards 2.

Those are some killer classifiers!

How does a club choose which classifiers to run each month? Can they choose whatever classifier they want, or is there a specific group of classifiers to choose from every month?

At our club, whoever volunteers to setup a classifier gets to pick. We do try to be nice and not pick classifiers which have been recently done at our club or any other nearby clubs so that people have a fighting chance of getting as many classifiers to count as possible.

[MikeRush]

I am prone to standing on the clock when I should be shooting on the move or reloading.

Sorry, couldn't resist after seeing the thread title.

I like the idea of having some options for a more physical match. I haven't yet had a match that required it but something feels quite practical about shooting from less than perfect positions.

[Allfat]

Out of curiosity, on those classifiers listed above where you start prone. How do you draw without breaking the 180? Wouldn't you gun be pointed to the rear in your holster, then once it clears be breaking the 180? How do they get around this?

[Skydiver]

All the start positions on those classifiers have start positions as standing. When the buzzer goes, you have to get into the position specified for that string. So that involves drawing, before getting into position.

[Allfat]

All the start positions on those classifiers have start positions as standing. When the buzzer goes, you have to get into the position specified for that string. So that involves drawing, before getting into position.

That makes sense, didn't notice that. Thanks!

[Not-So-Mad Matt]

Out of curiosity, on those classifiers listed above where you start prone. How do you draw without breaking the 180? Wouldn't you gun be pointed to the rear in your holster, then once it clears be breaking the 180? How do they get around this?

IDPA doesn't have a 180 rule, but the same concern arises, and a course might have the shooter start prone with his gun drawn, or in a box or bag, or on the ground in front him, etc.

[bradsteimel]

Does this happen in a COF?

I would imagine it does in 3 Gun but wondering about IDPA/USPSA.

I've been doing "Burpees" with a Pistol in my hand

Just shot the North Florida Sectional. One stage required prone shooting. Most everyone ended on prone to not have to get up on the clock.

WARNING! When you end in prone position and the RO say "unload and show clear. If clear hammer down and holster." DON'T HOLSTER WHILE YOU'RE PRONE. One guy did... instant DQ because he had to point his gun uprange to get in holstered.

[bradsteimel]

All the start positions on those classifiers have start positions as standing. When the buzzer goes, you have to get into the position specified for that string. So that involves drawing, before getting into position.

Just be very careful on "unload and show clear"! You can NOT reholster your gun while prone, facing down range, without being DQ'ed, for that very reason. Stand up, THEN reholster

[Tonka]

On ‎2‎/‎24‎/‎2012 at 7:33 AM, Skydiver said:

Most USPSA course designers will design their stages that may require going prone such that it's the last shooting position. Really good designers will set things up to give the shooters options to shoot that position last, or at some other time in the CoF with a good balance of risk vs. reward.

yes I agree, a good course designer will allow you to shoot a prone position at the end of the stage or those same targets from another possibly more difficult position, as I'm from the Seattle area due to rain we avoid prone in the winter.  As I saw in the last nationals those who went prone, even the pro's lost a lot of time over those who were more flexible and did not need to go down