Forcing IDPA Membership

[junkie]

Is this really a good idea? Our club will have 25 to 35 shooters for a local match maybe half will be IDPA members. We have a vibrant collection of shooters at these local monthly matches. Pressure is being applied to make them IDPA members, most do not see or care for the benefits being an IDPA member. As I see it, it is their choice to be members or not. If they can shoot 4 more matches a year or become an IDPA member I will take 4 more matches a year.

So does it make sense to turn people away if they are not IDPA members after 2 or 3 matches.It seems to go against the principles of freedom to be forced to join a club to shoot. But I guess that club is free to not let you shoot unless you join.

I did post this on the IDPA forum but wanted to broaden the information pool a bit.

[SirLoin]

What do you mean by "forced"? Non-IDPA members aren't allowed to shoot at your matches even if there are lots of slots left and even if they've gone through all the safety briefings/requirements/checks?

[kevin c]

Locally, non IDPA shooters get their first match free. They are asked to join if they want to continue to shoot. They pay for all subsequent matches.

[motosapiens]

I personally think it's a silly and destructive policy. fortunately it appears to be largely ignored in many areas.

I understand that IDPA is a business and someone has to make money off it, but I think requiring membership is a good way to turn away casual shooter who might only want to shoot a few matches a year. Maybe they concentrate on some other discipline, but occasionally have a free weekend and just want to shoot.

If they just charge non-members a couple more bucks, the issue would go away imho. Admittedly, then someone from the club has to send that money to idpa eventually, but it need not be done every month.

Edited February 8, 2012 by motosapiens

[open17]

From the IDPA rulebook:

NOTE: Contestants may only shoot one IDPA match as a non-

IDPA member. Competitors wishing to shoot additional matches

must become IDPA members.

Seems pretty clear--if you want to play you have to join.

[atbarr]

From the IDPA rulebook:

NOTE: Contestants may only shoot one IDPA match as a non-

IDPA member. Competitors wishing to shoot additional matches

must become IDPA members.

Seems pretty clear--if you want to play you have to join.

That's why we have more USPSA shooters than IDPA at BGSL. If they don't shoot Level II or higher, and don't care about being classified, they pay our entrance fee and enjoy the match.

Edited February 8, 2012 by atbarr

[SteveU]

From the IDPA rulebook:

NOTE: Contestants may only shoot one IDPA match as a non-

IDPA member. Competitors wishing to shoot additional matches

must become IDPA members.

Seems pretty clear--if you want to play you have to join.

That's why we have more USPSA shooters than IDPA at BGSL. If they don't shoot Level II or higher, and don't care about being classified, they pay our entrance fee and enjoy the match.

Do we? I have routinely seen 70-80 IDPA shooters at a match. Unless that's changed recently it seemed to me like IDPA was pretty darn popular.

[atbarr]

From the IDPA rulebook:

NOTE: Contestants may only shoot one IDPA match as a non-

IDPA member. Competitors wishing to shoot additional matches

must become IDPA members.

Seems pretty clear--if you want to play you have to join.

That's why we have more USPSA shooters than IDPA at BGSL. If they don't shoot Level II or higher, and don't care about being classified, they pay our entrance fee and enjoy the match.

Do we? I have routinely seen 70-80 IDPA shooters at a match. Unless that's changed recently it seemed to me like IDPA was pretty darn popular.

Well, the only time I saw anywhere near that amount was the Postal Match. Check with Tom, for the yearly count of shooters of IDPA and USPSA attendance at BGSL.

[Model19]

I'd bet it has to do with lawyers.....

[atbarr]

I'd bet it has to do with lawyers.....

I guess that USPSA, doesn't care about that. I think they hope that the shooters decide that USPSA is FUN, and will join in the future. IMO, you don't RAM down a rule, that runs off new shooters. IDPA and USPSA are games. The are NOT real life.

We want the shooter to be safe, have fun, and return next month.

Edited February 8, 2012 by atbarr

[mike l m]

IDPA allows the first time shooter to shoot a match and would like you to join. You should not force someone to join something so they can shoot the match. That is a load of crap. Sure I am a IDPA S/O Instrustor, but at a mtach I am not going to say you can not shoot the match because you are not a member of IDPA.

To join is your deal, do not make it a club issue. Pay your entry fee and go play.

Shoot straight and keep your powder dry.

Mike

[atbarr]

IDPA allows the first time shooter to shoot a match and would like you to join. You should not force someone to join something so they can shoot the match. That is a load of crap. Sure I am a IDPA S/O Instrustor, but at a mtach I am not going to say you can not shoot the match because you are not a member of IDPA.

To join is your deal, do not make it a club issue. Pay your entry fee and go play.

Shoot straight and keep your powder dry.

Mike

[peteinct]

I thought I had read here that uspca gets its dues from the club and idpa from the shooter. If you join a group, club or whatever shouldn't you follow their rules? pete

[atbarr]

I thought I had read here that uspca gets its dues from the club and idpa from the shooter. If you join a group, club or whatever shouldn't you follow their rules? pete

Why sure you follow the club's rules. And if you don't like the local club's rules, you go else where. Pretty simple.

[EkuJustice]

Thats why I will stick to USPSA. Shot my 1 IDPA match out of bordem since the weather was nice and missed alot of uspsa so went to shoot something. No interest in paying 40 bucks a year for something I may shoot locally a couple times. With the rule, I think they hurt the local clubs by turning away the occasional shooter.

[atbarr]

Thats why I will stick to USPSA. Shot my 1 IDPA match out of bordem since the weather was nice and missed alot of uspsa so went to shoot something. No interest in paying 40 bucks a year for something I may shoot locally a couple times. With the rule, I think they hurt the local clubs by turning away the occasional shooter.

Bingo!

[Joe4d]

so change the rule, right off the bat you are telling people that IDPA rules dont have to be followed. No wonder there is so much "local rule" chaos in IDPA. Maybe THAT'S what is driving off shooters and making them not want to join.

[atbarr]

so change the rule, right off the bat you are telling people that IDPA rules dont have to be followed. No wonder there is so much "local rule" chaos in IDPA. Maybe THAT'S what is driving off shooters and making them not want to join.

Who said not to follow the rules. If you don't like the rules, go shoot and spend your hard earned money else where. Pretty simple.

[Cy Soto]

I doubt that any IDPA club will turn non-IDPA members away if they showed up at the match (unless it was a Regional or State Match).

[EkuJustice]

so change the rule, right off the bat you are telling people that IDPA rules dont have to be followed. No wonder there is so much "local rule" chaos in IDPA. Maybe THAT'S what is driving off shooters and making them not want to join.

Who said not to follow the rules. If you don't like the rules, go shoot and spend your hard earned money else where. Pretty simple.

Exactly AT. If they don't want the local club to take my money then I will spend it elsewhere which I do. Its not like 40 bucks is that much especially if spread over several matches. But when your looking at shooting a couple matches a year its just not worth it.

[TacticalReload]

I don't get what the big deal is. If you want to shoot "IDPA matches", then follow their rules and join IDPA. If you don't want to pay IDPA, then don't participate in their games.

The clubs are using their name to attract shooters and have standardized classification, scoring, rules, etc.... How much sense does it make for you to hold a match that touts itself as IDPA and then doesn't follow one of their main rules? Certain people are attracted to IDPA matches because, no matter where they go or when they choose to attend a match, they know exactly what the rules are going to be ahead of time. If I want a Big Mac, I go to McDonald's. If I want a hamburger, I go anywhere that sells them. Sure, Big Macs are a subpar burger; but it's a known quantity served the same way for about the same price everywhere. Have you ever been to a so-called "match" that some guy just slapped together and was unaffiliated with anybody with no set rules or organization? Most of the time it sucks.

Furthermore, the only way IDPA can stick around is for them to get money. If no one is required to join their organization and send in their dues, then what exactly is going to keep them going? Goodwill? I'm not an IDPA apologist. There are MANY aspects of it, their rules, and their matches that I can't stand... as of the time I write this, I haven't attended an IDPA match in the past 7 years. However, I'm not going to begrudge them for requiring you to pay dues in order to participate in what they worked hard to develop, organize, and continue to run.

Seriously, there are plenty of other perfectly legitimate reasons to by upset with IDPA... why get so worked over something that's not.

[deacon12224]

This topic has already been beaten to within an inch of its life over on the IDPA Forum at IDPA.com. Seems like the reasoning for this is that dues are the only means of funding IDPA. If people don't pay dues to join IDPA, there is no other source of income to keep the organization running. In USPSA, a portion of everone's match fee is sent to USPSA whether the shooter is a member of USPSA or not. This is not the case in IDPA.

Shooting any sport is not a cheap endeavor. We spend money on gear, guns, ammo, ears, eyes, range bags, lessons, etc, etc. The list goes on. Seems like less than 80 cents a week to be a member of IDPA and shoot the matches is just about the most inexpensive part of this sport. Much ado about nothing if you ask me.

[colt]

USPSA gets $1.50 per shooter, no classifier and $3.00 per shooter with a classifier. Thats how they make there money + membership.

IDPA, when I use to shoot it makes there money by membership only and the club keeps the money from the local match.

Brent

[Hamm]

I'd bet it has to do with lawyers.....

I guess that USPSA, doesn't care about that. I think they hope that the shooters decide that USPSA is FUN, and will join in the future. IMO, you don't RAM down a rule, that

runs off new shooters. IDPA and USPSA are games. The

are NOT real life.

We want the shooter to be safe, have fun, and return next month.

AMEN

[EkuJustice]

The money situation wouldnt really change for the national organization. Those who shoot IDPA, are classified will still pay the dues to be members. Those who MIGHT shoot a match or 2 a year won't pay it either way. Thats the same boat im in with others I know who are asically USPSA members who will never shoot a major,or more than maby 1 or 2 IDPA matches a year. Shot my one match after having a couple USPSA matches canceled due to weather and just wanted to shoot something and figured that was better than nothing. Would I pay 40 bucks for a year to maby shoot another one not a chance. Would I shoot another match or 2 in the year if I didn't have to? more than likely. The local club looses out on money for those couple matches. So the national organization neither gained nor lost anything because I would have no intent of joining either way.