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Physical fitness level


lawboy

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Speed. Power. Accuracy. We all know what the last two are. Its the first one thats the problem. In this sport, we define speed by the time it takes to run the COF. If you move slow and shoot blazing fast, you could be equal to the guy who moves like a speed demon but then takes the time to settle the gun after each shot shooting very methodically. Both are good options. But the fact remains: If two guys who shoot to the same skill level (i.e., their splits and transitions are identical as is their accuracy) the guy who weighs 30lbs less and moves better/faster will win. How can people actually argue this? :mellow: Yes, slower rounder people have done better and been very successful. If you watch tho, every time it happens, its always a tremendous shooter driving the gun so they can make up for a lack of a little foot speed.

Moral of the story: If you're content to be out of shape and carry some extra weight, you had better be practicing your shooting skills, a lot. If you spend hours in the gym but no time on the range or dryfiring, expect to have the fastest times and a ton of penalties for misses b/c you can't shoot. You have to find the right combo of both that works for YOU.

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It's a little disappointing some people don't want to believe that overall healthy living won't enhance your life in many ways,if not all ways.

A good shooter with a weak body and weak mind will lose against one who has the physical ability to crush him, and the mental ability to do it repeatedly"

-Kyle Defoor
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In this sport, we define speed by the time it takes to run the COF.

Exactly, we define speed by the time it takes to run the COF. Since the course of fire consists of a few dozen very, very short sprints, with plenty of smooth acceleration and deceleration, that kind of agility is the kind of fitness a shooter wants and needs. If you're totally out of shape and not-at-all agile, improving your fitness can speed you up quite a bit. If you're already in decent shape, improving your fitness will have less effect. On the other hand, if you're already a fantastic shooter, even a little fitness boost will probably up your speed more than additional shooting practice.

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If it wasn't for the slower and overweight shooters the RO's would never get a break. That said its time to get serious.

Yea most of us could stand to drop a pound or two. Maybe more. Being healthier is going to benefit your shooting skills without a doubt. How much is up for debate and wholly dependent upon the individual's skill level across all aspects of shooting a COF. Physical fitness increases the efficiency of lung and heart function which have a direct bearing on your shooting skills. So given that a few tenths of a second can mean the difference between winning and losing it would only seem logical that a physical fitness routine should be part of every shooters practice schedule if their goal is to win. If your goal is just to have fun I would still suggest a fitness routine so you would enjoy the sport more and for a longer period of time.

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After ~7 months of Crossfit and minus 75 pounds I've gained about 15% on my match scores. I've made significant gains in speed, power, and accuracy. My accuracy has improved as my wobble has lessened and I dont get gassed, transitions are also more accurate now as it's easier to swing the gun around.

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After ~7 months of Crossfit and minus 75 pounds I've gained about 15% on my match scores.

Wow! Awesome job, BlueOvalBruin. So, are you now asking yourself, why didn't I do this earlier?

Yeah, definitely. I wish I had started 3 years ago when I first heard about it. The Crossfit Director of Training shoots USPSA with us and he’s been very helpful through the whole process.

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  • 8 months later...

Getting in to better shape will help you out.

As someone that also dropped 50 pounds, not only do I feel better physically, but mentally as well.

I agree on the Plyometrics and if crossfit does it for you then great. But be careful, to many times crossfit take a dump on proper form and you can really jack your self up.

Case and point. When you see someone doing this in the gym you will cringe.

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I am, now, a firm believer in yoga - at least, yoga when taught as an exercise program, but by someone w. a knowledge of anatomy, not as "magic."

I haven't shot enough recently (works gone nuts), but I have noticed a significant improvement in my control while moving, and my stability in odd positions.

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  • 3 months later...

I took up cycling a few years ago just to get healthier. I lost 44 pounds in the process. I was not really over weight. At least I didn't think I was. I was pretty shocked that I even had 44 pounds to lose. I noticed two things. The first is that my brain and body felt 20 years younger. I was lighter on my feet and I could think more clearly. I felt great. Nothing hurt. The second is that none of my pants fit. I had to go out and get new pants. I was happy. My wife was happy too...

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crossfit + plyometrics = explosive speed and an improved quality of life

dude ...really ??? & niether your nor e-dog metioned you were crossfitters ???? thats just wrong ...hahahaaa

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I don't think that the discussion has to revolve around whether live fire drills or fitness will have a greater direct effect on your scores. It's not like running two miles a couple of times a week or doing some grip/shoulder work is going to take all of your time and make practice impossible. Overall health is more important in the long run, in my opinion, than taking 3 hundredths off of my draw. If you watch TV, or spend a lot of time on here, etc there is no reason you can't adjust a little and workout and practice.

I dropped 25 lbs this last year (but only 2" off my waist, I lost a lot of muscle) and while I wasn't really that "overweight" (205, 6'0") it has made a world of difference in being able to move through stages quickly. I still have a lot of improvement to make in footwork but I feel like I can just glide and my hits while moving have improved substantially. Changing direction is much easier too. I would work out whether I am shooting or not, and it doesn't take a ton of time to get noticeable results.

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There is no doubt that with everything else being equal, the fitter person "should" win. Those who shot the 2013 Cowtown Classic will testify to this fact. There were many HUGE stages with lots of movement. I ended several courses of fire gasping for air!!

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Shooting?

Forget shooting.

Being an overweight person who can't move sucks PERIOD. Being fit and healthy is just, well...HEALTHY, regardless of the activity.

There are no cons to being in shape, whatsoever. NONE.

I vow to never again have my stomach hanging over my belt. Eff that.

Take care of yourself. Eat right. Move your body.

Every time at a major match I have some RO tell me "Boy, I wish I was lean and fit like you are. It all changes when you get married and have kids."

Bullshit. You got lazy. You let yourself go. Period. If you want it bad enough you can do it. If you can make time to get to the range, you can make time to plan your meals and do some physically exhausting exercise a few times a week. It's a choice.

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Getting in to better shape will help you out.

As someone that also dropped 50 pounds, not only do I feel better physically, but mentally as well.

I agree on the Plyometrics and if crossfit does it for you then great. But be careful, to many times crossfit take a dump on proper form and you can really jack your self up.

Case and point. When you see someone doing this in the gym you will cringe.

What does that GIF have to do with "proper form?"
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There is no doubt that with everything else being equal, the fitter person "should" win. Those who shot the 2013 Cowtown Classic will testify to this fact. There were many HUGE stages with lots of movement. I ended several courses of fire gasping for air!!

Agreed, but "everything else being equal" isn't reality. The reality is that all that really matters is the shooting ability. When I go to a match I'm not worried about any one else's fitness level, I'm worried about their shooting ability.

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Has anyone noticed that their current level of physical fitness has any positive or negative impact on their mental game? I have noticed that I am mentally more confident when I am in shape, and I believe I can do things physically better than I can when I am out of shape. I think being fit enables me to take chances physically on the course of fire that I don't/won't take when I feel out of shape.

Anyone else experience this?

This was my post that started this thread on 2/1/2012. It has morphed into a debate about physical fitness v. shooting ability -- and that is fine. But my initial question was were people finding that their physical fitness level had a direct impact on their mental game? We are more than a year removed from my initial post and I have some insights of my own in that regard. I have maintained a pretty high level of physical fitness during the past 14 months and it definitely has had a positive impact on my mental game. I feel better, I notice concrete differences in what I am capable of doing and all of it has been mentioned by posters in this thread. I can get into and out of ackward positions more easily and more quickly, and positions that used to be uncomfortable are no longer uncomfortable. I can draw my gun more easily and with no body motion because I do not have a roll of fat in the way. I can keep my center of gravity lower because I am lighter, my legs are stronger, and thus my weight to strength ratio is greatly improved. I do not get winded. Because I do not get winded, my gun stays steadier when I am shooting. All of these things boost my mental confidence because they give me better tools in my bag to use at the match.

Another thing I noticed,which I did not anticipate, is that being in better physical condition has greatly increased my motivation to practice. I have more energy, I feel more capable of improving and doing better, and I WANT to see just how good I can get. Where as a year ago I NEVER used to dry fire practice or live fire practice USPSA skills, today I dry fire TWICE EVERY DAY 15-30 minutes each session. I have built light weight moveable walls that I use in my backyard to make stages to dry fire. I also get in live fire practice periodically having gotten myself authorized to use pistol bays and all props at two different ranges. The result is that I am seeing the biggest gains in my game that I have ever seen. My draws, reloads, transitions, splits, movement into and out of shooting positions, even my stage planning are all much better than they were on 2/1/2012 when I started the thread. Again, all this improved my mental game even more and it just feeds on itself. So, I have answered my own question. YES, physical fitness has had a substantial positive impact on my mental game and also on my physical game!

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lawboy,

Thanks for bringing your thread back on track, and the personal update. NICE WORK!

My feeling - Since the physical and mental realms are not different (from each other), they must influence each other.

be

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There is no doubt that with everything else being equal, the fitter person "should" win. Those who shot the 2013 Cowtown Classic will testify to this fact. There were many HUGE stages with lots of movement. I ended several courses of fire gasping for air!!

Agreed, but "everything else being equal" isn't reality. The reality is that all that really matters is the shooting ability. When I go to a match I'm not worried about any one else's fitness level, I'm worried about their shooting ability.

Then why don't you gain 50 pounds and see if you still perform as well as you do today.... :goof:

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Wait - so if I lost weight I could shoot better? Hmm - but I love food!!

I think both Trace and Andy have valid points - shooting ability is def #1 - however being in shape helps with movement around a stage - and after all hit factor is calculated by both HITS and TIME

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Wait - so if I lost weight I could shoot better? Hmm - but I love food!!

I think both Trace and Andy have valid points - shooting ability is def #1 - however being in shape helps with movement around a stage - and after all hit factor is calculated by both HITS and TIME

Exactly. Most field stages have a lot more moving than shooting. So, IMHO, if you can move quickly/efficiently and you shoot well too or at least as good as the heavier/slower shooters, then the faster shooters should have the advantage. I'm not nearly as smart or fast or as good a shooter as Andy, but this simply makes sense to me... :-)

Edited to add, when I say fast or faster, I mean "foot speed".

Edited by SV-COP
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I am beyond out of shape. I am usually one of the bigger guys at a match. I can do OK on a stand and shoot stage. I loose seconds on anything with movement. I may be at the extreme, but there is a difference.

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Has anyone noticed that their current level of physical fitness has any positive or negative impact on their mental game? I have noticed that I am mentally more confident when I am in shape, and I believe I can do things physically better than I can when I am out of shape. I think being fit enables me to take chances physically on the course of fire that I don't/won't take when I feel out of shape.

Anyone else experience this?

This was my post that started this thread on 2/1/2012. It has morphed into a debate about physical fitness v. shooting ability -- and that is fine. But my initial question was were people finding that their physical fitness level had a direct impact on their mental game? We are more than a year removed from my initial post and I have some insights of my own in that regard. I have maintained a pretty high level of physical fitness during the past 14 months and it definitely has had a positive impact on my mental game. I feel better, I notice concrete differences in what I am capable of doing and all of it has been mentioned by posters in this thread. I can get into and out of ackward positions more easily and more quickly, and positions that used to be uncomfortable are no longer uncomfortable. I can draw my gun more easily and with no body motion because I do not have a roll of fat in the way. I can keep my center of gravity lower because I am lighter, my legs are stronger, and thus my weight to strength ratio is greatly improved. I do not get winded. Because I do not get winded, my gun stays steadier when I am shooting. All of these things boost my mental confidence because they give me better tools in my bag to use at the match.

Another thing I noticed,which I did not anticipate, is that being in better physical condition has greatly increased my motivation to practice. I have more energy, I feel more capable of improving and doing better, and I WANT to see just how good I can get. Where as a year ago I NEVER used to dry fire practice or live fire practice USPSA skills, today I dry fire TWICE EVERY DAY 15-30 minutes each session. I have built light weight moveable walls that I use in my backyard to make stages to dry fire. I also get in live fire practice periodically having gotten myself authorized to use pistol bays and all props at two different ranges. The result is that I am seeing the biggest gains in my game that I have ever seen. My draws, reloads, transitions, splits, movement into and out of shooting positions, even my stage planning are all much better than they were on 2/1/2012 when I started the thread. Again, all this improved my mental game even more and it just feeds on itself. So, I have answered my own question. YES, physical fitness has had a substantial positive impact on my mental game and also on my physical game!

One of the things I got from your update was your confidence level is higher overall. Physical fitness has increased your energy levels and your ability to focus on the technical aspects of your shooting, rather than how you're feeling. It has also given you more energy to practice, which improves your confidence. It has given you the ability to move thru a course of fire, and you've demonstrated to yourself an increased ability to move better, which has improved your confidence.

Unsung and often overlooked benefits, eh?

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Has anyone noticed that their current level of physical fitness has any positive or negative impact on their mental game? I have noticed that I am mentally more confident when I am in shape, and I believe I can do things physically better than I can when I am out of shape. I think being fit enables me to take chances physically on the course of fire that I don't/won't take when I feel out of shape.

Anyone else experience this?

This was my post that started this thread on 2/1/2012. It has morphed into a debate about physical fitness v. shooting ability -- and that is fine. But my initial question was were people finding that their physical fitness level had a direct impact on their mental game? We are more than a year removed from my initial post and I have some insights of my own in that regard. I have maintained a pretty high level of physical fitness during the past 14 months and it definitely has had a positive impact on my mental game. I feel better, I notice concrete differences in what I am capable of doing and all of it has been mentioned by posters in this thread. I can get into and out of ackward positions more easily and more quickly, and positions that used to be uncomfortable are no longer uncomfortable. I can draw my gun more easily and with no body motion because I do not have a roll of fat in the way. I can keep my center of gravity lower because I am lighter, my legs are stronger, and thus my weight to strength ratio is greatly improved. I do not get winded. Because I do not get winded, my gun stays steadier when I am shooting. All of these things boost my mental confidence because they give me better tools in my bag to use at the match.

Another thing I noticed,which I did not anticipate, is that being in better physical condition has greatly increased my motivation to practice. I have more energy, I feel more capable of improving and doing better, and I WANT to see just how good I can get. Where as a year ago I NEVER used to dry fire practice or live fire practice USPSA skills, today I dry fire TWICE EVERY DAY 15-30 minutes each session. I have built light weight moveable walls that I use in my backyard to make stages to dry fire. I also get in live fire practice periodically having gotten myself authorized to use pistol bays and all props at two different ranges. The result is that I am seeing the biggest gains in my game that I have ever seen. My draws, reloads, transitions, splits, movement into and out of shooting positions, even my stage planning are all much better than they were on 2/1/2012 when I started the thread. Again, all this improved my mental game even more and it just feeds on itself. So, I have answered my own question. YES, physical fitness has had a substantial positive impact on my mental game and also on my physical game!

One of the things I got from your update was your confidence level is higher overall. Physical fitness has increased your energy levels and your ability to focus on the technical aspects of your shooting, rather than how you're feeling. It has also given you more energy to practice, which improves your confidence. It has given you the ability to move thru a course of fire, and you've demonstrated to yourself an increased ability to move better, which has improved your confidence.

Unsung and often overlooked benefits, eh?

Yes, definitely overlooked and, more accurately, unexpected and unanticipated and very welcome benefits!

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