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A few questions about reloading .223/5.56


jdknotts1

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Just getting started reloading for my carbine for shooting 3 gun. I have a Colt LE6920, 16" bbl, 1:7 twist, JP Comp, and I plan on using 69gr SMK bullets. Below are a few questions.

1. I have about 3k pieces of brass that I get for free. Once fired, from the range. The headstamps are 223 REM FC NT. I have heard the "FC" makes this brass really horrible. Blowing out primers and seizing up the trigger. Anyone have a history with this stamp? I don't want to waste time prepping a bunch of it if its only going to give me problems.

2. At a gunshow recently I purchased 2k Federal 210M primers. Then I read they are too soft, just fine, will cause trip fires, blow out, etc... Anyone have SPECIFIC experience with them in an AR15? I read all about guys "hearing" people having problems with them. I would like to hear, GOOD OR BAD, experience with them.

3. Varget Powder.... With my 16" bbl, and the 69gr bullets, will I have problems burning up my comp? I read a thread that had pictures of a guys comp burning and deteriorating from the Varget. I only bought a lb of it so I wont have any problem switching to something else (AA-2520, TAC, etc) if there will be problems.

Thanks for any advice or warnings.

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Your brass I'm not sure about, I think it's Federas cleaner burning load. I have purchase Federal's new and then returned because of crappy offset flashholes. But with said, I just shot a whole match with 2nd or 3rd timers and they preformed perfect???? Your primers are to soft, while I've used them in the past, I have had them double on me. I use Federal 205 small rifle for my Open Guns and love them, but I prefer to use a Winchester or CCI Primers for my 223's. On the Varget powder, most of the guys I shoot with use it and love it. My Dillon 650 doesn't throw stick powders very accurately so I've been using H-335 with much lighter bullets 55/60 grain. I did just buy a powder thrower and a pound of Varget myself last week and I do find it slightly more accurate then the H-335. For our USPSA matches most of our shots are less that a 100 yards so handloading with Varget is to much of a hassle for me, but for the larger matches I'm going to use it. Guy

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I don't know about the brass either. I usually use Lake City or PPU brass, but I will pick up anything and use it. I keep my various mixture separate and use them for plinking. It would be worth giving the brass a try.

I use 7 1/2 Remington Benchrest primers, they are harder for semi-autos. I was doing some long range shooting with a buddy last year and he had several doubles, we think it was due to soft primers.

I've seen the pictures also of what Varget does to a comp. I use 24 grains of TAC or Reloader 15 for heavier bullets, I like the 75 gr Hornady. TAC shows a max of 24.3 for the 69s. The 75s do very well, I typically shoot them in 300 to 800 yard range.

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Scrap the brass. The brass is soft, and the rumours about primer pockets are true. Even free, it's not worth it.

I used to process 1F police range brass.

I sorted them by headstamp fortunately.

Dies that produced perfectly headspaced and trimmed Winchester cases, had Federal cases dropping well below the bottom mark of the gauge.

Edited by Canuck223
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Scrap the brass. The brass is soft, and the rumours about primer pockets are true. Even free, it's not worth it.

What problems do the soft brass cause? I only plan on loading any of these cases one time. I have no intention of picking up any of them.

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If you are loading for an AR15, don't use FC brass, you will be sorry sooner or later...and don't ask why unless you want a long drawn out story with lots of swear words...suffice to say, FC primer pockets will spit primers out at the worst time.

If you are loading for a bolt/manual operated rifle, use the FC brass, its fine for that. I trade mine with a buddy that has several 223 bolt guns.

Varget is THE powder for heavies. under 60gn, 335 or 2230. Never heard of "buring out a comp" with Varget or any other powder. A comp will not last forever thou, regardless on the powder used.

I don't use Fed primers at all, too soft, slam fire is possible. I prefer Win or CCI.

jj

Edited by RiggerJJ
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Yep, what I took away from that thread was what I said, Varget is more for the heavies. I do know that getting enough Varget in a case with a lighter bullet is a problem as well, this just reinforces that with another reason not to use it, with light bullets. It works great with heavies, so you should be fine with it with 68-69gners with a 16. I use it for 16-20in 223 barrels, and 16-24 in 308 barrels. Have not seen any premature comp wear.

jj

Edited by RiggerJJ
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not all FC brass is bad IMO.

I believe *some* fc brass is identical to LC brass (all ATK) with a different headstamp. the kind im thinking of has a small FC logo and needs primer pocket swaging.

However, anything marked NT I'd stay away from.

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A little load testing today. Ended up getting a double from using the 205M primers. Guess I will be switching to another primer. Any recco's? Here are my groups @100yds. I didn't chrono.

Question is, for 3gun, how much accuracy can/should you sacrifice for a higher fps? From the groups, the best two I got were on the highest end and the lowest end. Thats a big difference in fps. Using Sierra's load data, I estimate the differnce to be 250fps. Once I do some more testing with a chrono, and at 2-300 yds, I will have some better data.

post-31708-0-55922700-1326148217_thumb.j

post-31708-0-23631800-1326148226_thumb.j

post-31708-0-70629500-1326148236_thumb.j

post-31708-0-23597700-1326148261_thumb.j

post-31708-0-75234000-1326148268_thumb.j

Edited by jdknotts1
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I have reloaded a fair amount of FC brass. You can tell by the way that the primers seat that the primer pockets loosen up. I leave them on the ground now.

You should shoot those loads at distance using your BDC and see how they match up. Reloading data is a good guide but the velocity out of a 16 inch AR is probably going to be less than you expect, or less than a standard reloading manual would indicate. They typically use bolt guns and generally longish barrels in their testing unless indicated otherwise.

Edited by Vespid_Wasp
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I use CCI primers a little harder which is nice for the floating firing pin on the AR15. Varget may not drop consistently in your 550 if you switch try Tac or 8208 XBR.

I use FC brass without much trouble, all of it is newer than 2005 though. I have heard stories of the older stuff having thin webs. All primer pockets will loosen with time and the hotter you load them the faster they will come loose. If a primer goes in too easy pull the case the same as you would investigate a primer that is taking too much force. You could even tumble the loaded rounds to be sure the primers won't come out in the rifle.

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I use CCI primers a little harder which is nice for the floating firing pin on the AR15. Varget may not drop consistently in your 550 if you switch try Tac or 8208 XBR.

The Varget seems to do fine in my 550. I polished up the internals on the powder dumper thingy...

So is there really any accuracy difference between the Rem, CCI, or Win primers?

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for our 3 gun/multi-gun games, no probably not.

and probably even for the guys who shoot Camp Perry type rifle matches, I bet they use the cheaper less consistent stuff at the shorter ranges, and then pony up the bigger bucks for so called "match primers" for the longer ranges.

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  • 2 weeks later...

Hi Everyone...new guy here. Topic is "A few questions about reloading .223/556...so here goes. ;)

Can I get an opinion from 1st hand experience about .223 brass? My understanding is the 'LC' brass is Lake City armory mil brass and that it is has primer pocket 'issues' as well as re-sizing issues due to the mil 'aggressive' crimps?

Also, I found a ton of 'FC' brass that looked like they were annealed...similar to the PMC X-TAC 62g 5.56 factory loads I had been using. I thought annealed cases were hardened neck/shldrs and were better for max load reloading? Are these 'FC' cases not "Federal Cartridge"? Should I even try re-loading both of these cases ('LC' and/or 'FC')?

FWIW, I only shoot out of a 1:9 20" bbl AR.

Thanks for sharing...this is a great forum.

*----->X

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As far as the 205M Federal primers, I've loaded about 1000K of them with 69gr SMK bullets and Varget. Never had a problem. They ignite very reliably and consistently. But they have softer cups than other brands and are more sensitive to impact. You may see flattened primers that are not from excessive pressures, but from that soft metal cup. You also have to handle them a little more cautiously especially when loading your primer tubes and when actually seating the primers.

Try using IMR 8208 XBR powder instead of Varget, especially if you're loading on a progressive. The extruded granules are much shorter than Varget's, and it will meter better through a measure. I'm really liking Ramshot TAC too, it's a powder which has really surprised me, and it meters like silk. Hodgdon has their new CFE223 powder too.

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I would like to try some new powders, but unless a friend has a lb or so, I doubt I'm going to go buy any on a whim. Honestly, the Varget does very well. I shot some loads at 300yds last week and got some good results (5 shots-2.6"@300yds) all from the 550. The drops seem to all be right there within +/- .2grs.

And as far as the primers. I did a little test one day with the 205M primers. I put a primer in a piece of sized brass. Inserted the primed brass in the chamber and flew the bolt hme as hard as I could. Did this at least a dozen or so times on the same piece of brass. Nothing..... Could see the little dimple but no different than any other brass. So I'll probably just go ahead and use them until I run out.

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  • 3 weeks later...

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