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thopkins22

Never thought it would happen to me(DQ)

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So shooting a small 3-gun match today during the first stage I watched a shooter's speed belt fall off resulting in his DQ, and remember thinking "at least it was an equipment failure not gun handling." If only I were so lucky.

The match continued, and I had been shooting relatively well. The last stage for my squad revolved around a van...prior to the match it was made blatantly clear that if you shoot the van your day is over. So of course, when shooting over the hood I didn't remember to keep enough offset and put a round into it.

The glass was mostly already broken out and I really wanted to believe it was my muzzle blast knocking out some more, but someone showed me the windshield wiper that had absorbed the impact. I made it clear to the SO that I wasn't protesting his call when I asked. I like to think I took it like a man, but man I sure did want to have an allergy attack. We were wrapping up at that point so I stayed around to tape. A lesson learned the hard way.

On the drive home I spent a lot of time thinking about it and realized it was one of those things that I knew happened to everyone, novices and advanced shooters alike, but I never thought would happen to me.

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There are two types of shooters, if you will. Those that have DQ'd, and those that are going to. :unsure:

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I had a similar issue but thank goodness for a video camera. I had a rifle stage where we started out behind a barrel for the first 6 shots. At the end of the stage someone pointed out that the barrel had 6 holes in the lip. It looked like the muzzle was too low. The RO thought it was me. My wife was videoing the stage. When we looked at the video during "make ready" you could see the holes in the barrel from where she was standing. So it happened before me. Got lucky on that one.

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Barricaded subject years ago in Ft Lauderdale....suspect surrenders peacefully...all the SWAT guys are putting away their equipment in front of the TV cameras...a LE sniper is unloading his rifle when WHAM! He lets a .308 round go right through the back windshield..through the car...through the front windshield....and out into civilian land to points unknown.

Thank God no one was injured/killed but this guy found out the quickest way to resign from his SWAT team.

By all accounts he was a good guy and guys were surprised that it happened to him but all that saw the tape said "There but for the grace of God....."

Guys get wrapped around the axel thinking on this and that and NOT PAYING ATTENTION TO WHAT THEY'RE DOING RIGHT NOW.

His face when he realizes that he just fired a round is what should be in the dictionary under "Shock".

Theres also a "3 shot group" on a bank robber that was caught on film. New Mexico.....

Bank robber exits with hostage...SWAT sniper shoots at him and hits a wall right in front of the sniper that he does not see in his scope.....shoots a second round and hits the wall a second time...this time his spotter smacks him and tells him "You're shooting the wall." He raises up and the third round was the charm.

It can happen to anyone dude....thank God no one was hurt.

JK

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I do hear there are two types of shooters. I do not look forward to the day when (if) it happens to me. $300 match fees, I hope I don't have a meltdown.

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My first DQ was at a level 2 match. $120 match entry fee. Done on the fourth stage of 8. LAME!!!

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The thought of a DQ scares me. Maybe that's why I don't shoot as fast as I know I can during competition matches.

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Too far to the right??? Didn't see it on the video.....

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Too far to the right??? Didn't see it on the video.....

Too far to the left. Just edited it.

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I DQed at a match yesterday. Probably my 2nd DQ in 2 years. It involved shooting a classifier where a loaded gun and magazine sits in a cubby, you start in surrender. In the process of placing magazines and gun I suppossedly swept myself. The RO stated that he saw me sweep myself the 1st time but decided to call me on it on my 2nd and 3rd time?? I recognized the error of my ways even though my finger was off the trigger. I didn't argue though I was just pissed this RO didn't feel he couldn't say 'muzzle' to give me a heads up but instead wait till I supposedly swept myself '2 or 3 times?' Now I thought an RO is there to maintain safety and help a shooter NOT to DQ them. I spoke about this to another local shooter who is a member of that club. He agreed that he would have said muzzle or held the shooters arm and stopped him from DQing himself but mentioned that I got the "range NAZI" on that stage as he rolls his eyes. 3 stages later a totally new shooter I brought in was placed first to shoot so I was coaching him on strategy feeling his anxiety as a newbie. This same NAZI starts yelling to clear the range and to start the stage. I yelled back that the guy he was yelling at was THE 1st shooter and that he had the right to finish reviewing that stage before he shot. It's not like the newbie had taken his 5 minutes wasting time but we were discussing were NOT to break the 180.

I've learned a valuable lesson from this but I sure as hell didn't appreciate this nazi putting a bad spin on 2 other shooters who were totally new to the sport.

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I DQed at a match yesterday. Probably my 2nd DQ in 2 years. It involved shooting a classifier where a loaded gun and magazine sits in a cubby, you start in surrender. In the process of placing magazines and gun I suppossedly swept myself. The RO stated that he saw me sweep myself the 1st time but decided to call me on it on my 2nd and 3rd time?? I recognized the error of my ways even though my finger was off the trigger. I didn't argue though I was just pissed this RO didn't feel he couldn't say 'muzzle' to give me a heads up but instead wait till I supposedly swept myself '2 or 3 times?' Now I thought an RO is there to maintain safety and help a shooter NOT to DQ them. I spoke about this to another local shooter who is a member of that club. He agreed that he would have said muzzle or held the shooters arm and stopped him from DQing himself but mentioned that I got the "range NAZI" on that stage as he rolls his eyes. 3 stages later a totally new shooter I brought in was placed first to shoot so I was coaching him on strategy feeling his anxiety as a newbie. This same NAZI starts yelling to clear the range and to start the stage. I yelled back that the guy he was yelling at was THE 1st shooter and that he had the right to finish reviewing that stage before he shot. It's not like the newbie had taken his 5 minutes wasting time but we were discussing were NOT to break the 180.

I've learned a valuable lesson from this but I sure as hell didn't appreciate this nazi putting a bad spin on 2 other shooters who were totally new to the sport.

There are times when I'm not going to yell at a shooter. Passing the gun over a part of your body is one of them. The last thing that I want to do is startle you and have you jump and discharge the weapon, whether it be "STOP" or "MUZZLE", I'll wait until you clear yourself, then I'm going to tell you STOP, unload and show clear. I'm sorry that you had a hard time with the RO. Personally I would have told you exactly what you did, and it wouldn't have been I let you slide until you did it 2-3 times. Of course, I can see how that could happen - reaching in front to set mags after getting your gun charged. I'm assuming this is like something akin to mini mart or the like.

Again, sorry he's a bit of a heel, but in that situation - I wouldn't have warned you with your muzzle pointed at your forearm.

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If you break a safety rule, expect to be DQ'd without warning. Muzzle is used when someone is getting close to the 180. Sweeping yourself repeatedly? I'm not sure how you'd rather the RO handle it other than DQing you the first time you did it, which is what I would have done. It sounds like you got away with it the first time and then repeatedly did the same thing.

No one likes to be DQ'd. I don't know of any RO's that enjoy DQing people.

As a competitor and an RO, I see competitors arguing a DQ when the whole squad is nodding in agreement and the DQ is blatantly obvious or being pissed about it.

I saw a guy DQ on the last stage of an Area match. He was a good shooter and a hard charger and he was having a really good match. He backed out of a port (which he never should have had his gun through in the first place) with his finger on the trigger, caught the sight and fired a round over the berm. It took a second for the RO to realize what he had just seen and he stopped the guy at the next position. Of course, the guy was pissed, didn't believe he made the error, demanded to see the RM (who was coming anyway) and argued long and loud because the RO didn't stop him immediately, he didn't believe the round went over the berm, etc, etc, etc.

He got DQ'd anyway and he pouted and threw crap for awhile before finally stalking off towards the parking lot.

One thing we all need to remember is that the DQ is the shooters fault, no one elses.

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There is no warning for sweeping and calling it does not make anyone a range nazi. We are there to have fun and to be safe, and neither of these two things should be compromised for the other. Muzzle is a 180 warning when you are getting close not when you have broken it. Muzzle has nothing to do with sweeping what so ever. Nothing about a DQ is the RO's fault it is the shooters fault. The RO is there to call what happens. The Shooter makes it happen.

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Funny this thread comes back up now.... Just had my first DQ. Thank god it was only a monthly match. RO said I swung my shotgun to far to the LEFT. You be the judge...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r8LXUOiiOaQ&feature=youtu.be

I failed to seethe DQ. By the RO body gesture he had in for you. Maybe he had it in for everyone shooting the stage. No way in hell you broke the 180. NO WAY!!! :blink:

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Wait, is down range towards were you are walking to or is downrange the direction where you are shooting... If the former then :eatdrink: DQ. If the later then BS. <_<

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"muzzle" and "finger" are courtesies, not required. I used to use them when I first started, but no longer do after reading and posting on a thread regarding this. Learned a lot from the perspectives relayed by others and appreciate the forum as a place to share.

Broke the 180 at a VA-MD Section match several years ago on a re-shoot, think I had one or two stages left in that match - my first trip to the dairy queen. It can happen to you. An inadvertent turn, a poor position in a shooting area, a basic brain f- -t and your day is over.

Edited by vluc

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I was ........

Did you learn something about yourself?

Are you better for it?

RO did his job.

As an RO at some fairly big matches, I might have got you on the first sweep. It's a tuff job that demands constant attention. Give the guy a break with the name calling. Go to RO class and let that club know that you are prepared to RO anytime. Take some buddies with you and by sheer #'s you might get enough RO's so that guy won't be a factor. If an RO is truly a prick then most MD's will avoid them if they have options.

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DQ'd at a 3-gun match in Texas. Was on vacation there and found a monthly match. Got through the 2 pistol stages fine. On the first rifle stage I proceeded to fire 10 rounds at 5 targets, move to another postion and fired 2 or 3 rounds and could not pull the trigger. Pull the charging handle and still nothing. The second time I pulled the charging handle it slam fired over the berm. I almost had the gun empty before the RO could say stop. I appoligized and politely left the range. I found two primers in the gun case when I inspected my rifle. I discovered I had some soft brass that I had loaded and primers popped out of them real easy. Later found out that brass had been close to a building that had burned which made it soft.

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I was ........

Did you learn something about yourself?

Are you better for it?

RO did his job.

As an RO at some fairly big matches, I might have got you on the first sweep. It's a tuff job that demands constant attention. Give the guy a break with the name calling. Go to RO class and let that club know that you are prepared to RO anytime. Take some buddies with you and by sheer #'s you might get enough RO's so that guy won't be a factor. If an RO is truly a prick then most MD's will avoid them if they have options.

Actually I have been through the RO class twice. I thought about this hard and yes, there is no leeway for sweeping. Calling the RO a NAZI were the words of another RO present. I don't think you should startle someone who is sweeping either. In retrospect I suspect I DID NOT sweep myself but was coming close and say this as I recall moving very deliberately only to be stopped on my "3rd sweep" then ULSC. I wondered from the start why the RO had a smirk on his face with such a supposedly serious event. Don't take this statement as a denial but more a recollection. I don't blame this RO but myself. The comment was only to elicit a better way to protect and help the shooter. One RO present stated he would have kept a better eye on the shooter and prevented the DQ. I accepted the DQ but later events that seemed intended to intimidate other new shooters only reinforced that other RO's N word.

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If the RO IS an ass and just looking to DQ people then that should be brought to the MD's attention. Several years back there was an IDPA competitor that was so obnoxious, loud and profane and occasionally would shout stuff out while another competitor was shooting. We brought it up to the MD, he looked into it, talked to people on the squad and made the decision to ban the guy from shooting IDPA at this range. Guy got pissy and called Bill Wilson. Now he can't shoot IDPA anywhere...LOL

If this RO is truly that bad, you are not his first victim. There is no place for this in our sport. Report him up the line.

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Slight drift but some of our newly minted RO's seem to have the "finger/trigger" issues highlighted and that is what they are looking for. Have to go around letting them know that SAFETY is the issue, not trying to catch somebody doing something. A very good way for these younger folks to get their RN degree (range nazi).

I have been encouraging MD's to incorporate these new RO's with experienced RO's and CRO's. Letting them run alone is setting them and shooters up for conflict and failure.

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I was ........

Did you learn something about yourself?

Are you better for it?

RO did his job.

As an RO at some fairly big matches, I might have got you on the first sweep. It's a tuff job that demands constant attention. Give the guy a break with the name calling. Go to RO class and let that club know that you are prepared to RO anytime. Take some buddies with you and by sheer #'s you might get enough RO's so that guy won't be a factor. If an RO is truly a prick then most MD's will avoid them if they have options.

Actually I have been through the RO class twice. I thought about this hard and yes, there is no leeway for sweeping. Calling the RO a NAZI were the words of another RO present. I don't think you should startle someone who is sweeping either. In retrospect I suspect I DID NOT sweep myself but was coming close and say this as I recall moving very deliberately only to be stopped on my "3rd sweep" then ULSC. I wondered from the start why the RO had a smirk on his face with such a supposedly serious event. Don't take this statement as a denial but more a recollection. I don't blame this RO but myself. The comment was only to elicit a better way to protect and help the shooter. One RO present stated he would have kept a better eye on the shooter and prevented the DQ. I accepted the DQ but later events that seemed intended to intimidate other new shooters only reinforced that other RO's N word.

Ok, thanks for clarifying it. I've dealt with the like and they are few and far between. The smirk would have probably sent me to coo coo land.

Good on you for being ahead of the game and an RO. I should have asked you first, bad on me.

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When I first started shooting I was using a belt made more for military or police use. Traveled to an out of state match and it proceeded to fall down to my feet while running with rifle in hand from one portion of a stage to the next. Didn't want to mess with grabbing it with the rifle in hand so just slowed down and let it fall and took the DQ. I now use a proper double belt and haven't had any problems since.

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