Chriss Grube Posted June 3, 2004 Share Posted June 3, 2004 Eric, It is a little of every thing. Offhand, prone etc. Depends on the stage and stage designer. There are lots of other style LR events and matches. Sniper style run out to 1000+ and require all kinds of things from towers and movers to weakside shooting. Even seen some where you had to shoot with the rifle homeboy style for a low port. You seem to be set on the LTR and it will work ok to the 425 you need. If you find you should have bought the 26"and cut it to 24" then I guess you'll just end up rebarreling sooner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michael_aos Posted June 3, 2004 Author Share Posted June 3, 2004 You seem to be set on the LTR and it will work ok to the 425 you need. If you find you should have bought the 26"and cut it to 24" then I guess you'll just end up rebarreling sooner. What about the stock / overall weight? Am I going to regret the 7.5lb model -vs- 9lb? Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
texasag93 Posted June 4, 2004 Share Posted June 4, 2004 The wieght/ recoil isn't an issue to me. It is a man. rifle. I like the LTR because the stock is slimmer than the "P". Swap stocks, cut off 4" and I would love the "P". My LTR doesn't like the 175s at all. 150s and 168s are the best w/ a slight advantage to the 150s. I have never shot for speed with mine. I am guessing that would change things for me. The "P" would probably be better. Still love my LTR. TXAG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chriss Grube Posted June 4, 2004 Share Posted June 4, 2004 Mike, It is a personal issue on the weight and stock. If you are recoil sensitive or smaller sized then they can become issues. The heavier gun will have less recoil. It can also be harder for some to manage. To me 2 pounds is not any different. My MOR with everything is 14.5 pounds. If it was me I'd get the 700P. You have all the info laid out in front of you now YOU have to decide what fits you and is going to make you happy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michael_aos Posted June 4, 2004 Author Share Posted June 4, 2004 Mike,It is a personal issue on the weight and stock. If you are recoil sensitive or smaller sized then they can become issues. The heavier gun will have less recoil. It can also be harder for some to manage. To me 2 pounds is not any different. My MOR with everything is 14.5 pounds. If it was me I'd get the 700P. You have all the info laid out in front of you now YOU have to decide what fits you and is going to make you happy. The guy who runs our 3-gun matches is currently out of the country and I'm kind of waiting until he gets back before I actually make my purchase. I've also realized I'm going to be out-of-town for the June, July, August and maybe September 3-gun / MOR matches. So I'm not in a HUGE hurry. I think you're right though. As much as I like to LTR and WANT to go that route, I think the regular 700P is the "right" way to go. As I alluded to earlier, I don't want to purchase an Acura MDX when what I really need is a Rover. I am still holding out a little hope....as I mentioned, the range where I shoot has 425yds as the max range. I read one review of the LTR that had issues with bullet stability >600yds, but otherwise great. I just need to understand what I'm likely to be shooting at. If the "worst" I'm ever going to encounter is 8x10 plates at 425yds the LTR might be OK for a while. Honestly -- I think I'd have just as much fun shooting 1" targets at 100yds as 10" targets at 1000yds. I'll be LUCKY if I can make 8 matches a year. The rest of the time will be on that same 425yd range, or the public 100yd range near my work or random places in the Pike National Forest. If I already had a bolt-rifle, I'd just be shooting that. Since I have to buy something anyway, I figured I should buy something "apropriate". Since I'm buying a rifle specifically to play this game, I want something that's especially suited to the game. Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
texasag93 Posted June 4, 2004 Share Posted June 4, 2004 Buy the "PSS". If you don't like the barrel length, have it cut down to appropriate length. I just don't like the bulky palm swell on the PSS. I have been tossing around the idea of a 22 or 23" barrel and smaller flatter shooting cartridge in my LTR. Just hate to ruin such a pretty rifle. May just build another one. TXAG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michael_aos Posted June 4, 2004 Author Share Posted June 4, 2004 Buy the "PSS". If you don't like the barrel length, have it cut down to appropriate length. I just don't like the bulky palm swell on the PSS. I have been tossing around the idea of a 22 or 23" barrel and smaller flatter shooting cartridge in my LTR. Just hate to ruin such a pretty rifle. May just build another one. TXAG Yeah, it's the palm-swell on the PSS that turned me off too. The LTR in a 25" .260 might be just the ticket.... Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michael_aos Posted June 17, 2004 Author Share Posted June 17, 2004 I was able to shoot a 700P in .308 yesterday. And after talking to the guy who runs our local matches, I think I'm going to go with a 700P in .223 for now. Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uscbigdawg Posted June 17, 2004 Share Posted June 17, 2004 If all you're going to shoot is local, and your distances are 425, then you'll be fine. It sounds like you are on a "conventional" range (i.e. side berms) so wind isn't that big an issue. Heck, my AR shot .25 MOA on Sunday, so if it wasn't for it not being an MOR gun, I'd have confidence in shooting .223 at 425. Glad you found a rifle. Rich Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michael_aos Posted June 18, 2004 Author Share Posted June 18, 2004 Mike,Rings and bases: Badger Ord. is the gold standard. Leupold will do but I'd spend the extra few bucks and get the best. Get the 20 MOA BASE. Premier Reticle has the best prices there. Bipod Harris 6-9 swivel notched leg model with Podloc. OK, ordered from Premier Reticles: 306-20 rings 306-12 reducers 306-06 RRHSA for right hand, short action I had NO IDEA they would be so expensive! I might try and buy the 700P locally ($799) tomorrow or early next week. I'm going to put a Bushnell Scopechief 4-15x50 on it for starters. Where should I look for the bipod? Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chriss Grube Posted June 18, 2004 Share Posted June 18, 2004 DNRSPORTS.com has the best price I've found. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michael_aos Posted June 18, 2004 Author Share Posted June 18, 2004 DNRSPORTS.com has the best price I've found. I haven't checked D & R for the rifle, but I've sort of got a personal policy. If the local "brick and morter" store down the street has what I want -- in stock -- then I try and buy from them. I like the idea of supporting my local stores, even if they're more expensive. I saw a 700P in .223 for $712 online. Add $50 shipping, plus $25 transfer-fee and you're up to $787. Note a huge difference from $799. Granted, when you take sales-tax into consideration, it's about a $63 difference. There are also a couple of local IPSC shooters with FFL's, but I haven't done any business with them yet. 10% over cost. Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chriss Grube Posted June 18, 2004 Share Posted June 18, 2004 Michael, Where I'm at D and R is about 40 min. away. The only other stores in the area have a limited selection and the prices suck. The more I save the more toys I can buy and the more I can shoot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michael_aos Posted June 18, 2004 Author Share Posted June 18, 2004 I've read there's a modification available for Remington 700's with a hinged floor-plates to adapt to box magazines...? Who makes it? What's it called? Where do I get one? And will it work with the model 700P? Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uscbigdawg Posted June 18, 2004 Share Posted June 18, 2004 There are a couple of options, but for .223 I don't believe the best one would work. The best is to just use an AICS stock and their magazines. However, this won't work with .223 as it's designed around a .308 body. Another is H-S Precision's detachable magazine kit. Here's their website: H-S Precision I would contact them if it'll work for .223. Cheryl Current and her hubby, use the Quik Clip from Trexel Industries, but it appears that they may be out business as I tried hitting their site and it didn't work. Good luck, Rich P.S. If you were going to go to a local store, why did you ask, "Where should I look for the bipod?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michael_aos Posted June 19, 2004 Author Share Posted June 19, 2004 If you were going to go to a local store, why did you ask, "Where should I look for the bipod?" They don't stock any bipods. I ordered 2 (BRM-S & LM-S) from DnR Sports. Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michael_aos Posted June 19, 2004 Author Share Posted June 19, 2004 Michael,Where I'm at D and R is about 40 min. away. The only other stores in the area have a limited selection and the prices suck. The more I save the more toys I can buy and the more I can shoot. I live about 2 miles from the largest gun-store in Colorado Springs. Might even be the biggest in Colorado. They have pretty much everything. Not rock-bottom prices, but I think they're pretty good. I like the idea of supporting local stores. It's kinda nice to actually put your hands on stuff before you buy it. Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Dunn Posted June 19, 2004 Share Posted June 19, 2004 I hate to do it, but I would advise against the HS Precision bottom metal/detachable mag combination. I have this on one of my .308s, I don't like the fact that the mag release is inside the trigger guard (I can envision bad things happening during a reload under stress), I don't like that the mags don't drop free, I don't like how awkward it is to try and hit the release with my thumb, while trying to rock the mag out, and then repeating a couple of times until the thing finally comes out. For detachable mags on a Remington 700, next time I'd go with the AICS system. I solved the problems of reloads with a Tubb 2K. Sweet! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chriss Grube Posted June 19, 2004 Share Posted June 19, 2004 John is right. The AICS is the ticket. The HS system works but it isn't fast. The TUBB 2K is great but finding mags can be a PITA. KAC doesn't make that many and finding 20 rounders is a nightmare. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattBurkett Posted June 20, 2004 Share Posted June 20, 2004 Here is some more info for you guys. :-) .260 remington with a 26" barrel and then a brake looks like it will be optimum for that cartridge. You want to shoot the Berger 140 VLD's at about 2900 if you can do it. Steel at 1000 yards is not an issue compared to the 6mm stuff like the XC which works great if you are just punching paper. Basically the 6XC is just a fancy .243 without the velocity. My new rifle is an Accuracy International AW. If you can get one, do it! There is nothing even close on the market. The AE model is pretty cool, but, you only get 5 round mags - no 10 rounders available. On a Rem 700 action do the following: (sell it and buy an AW - just kidding) AICS 2.0 chassis - get the torque wrench with it!!! Bedding job Trigger Job or a drop-in like a Jewel Badger bolt knob Krieger or Schneider barrel muzzle brake - nearly anything works 20 moa base from Larue Larue detachable rings are my favorite 4 10 round mags Other gear needed for LRR matches - not just the USPSA MOR Real scope: Nightforce NSX or USOptics Leupold although considered the gold standard is just a starting point of good LRR scopes 3 swivel bipods - shortest to longest Stoney point tri-pod Leica 1200 scan or BRF 10x laser rangefinders Horusvision and/or Perry Systems ballistic software Chrono - you need to know temp effects on velocity for your load Rearbags Gearbag like the Matrix from Hydrastorm Laser temp sensor Kestrel 4000 PWS Eagle drag bag Dewey cleaning rods Stoney point cleaning rod caddy The list goes on! :-) If you want, I will post up the LRR article I wrote last year about going through all of this stuff. Take care, Matt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chriss Grube Posted June 20, 2004 Share Posted June 20, 2004 Matt, You forgot the ACI for the tower shots, A scope level for those messed up positions and a bore guide. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattBurkett Posted June 20, 2004 Share Posted June 20, 2004 Chriss, good point! Although I generally leave the ACI at home unless going to a canyon/mountain sniper match. Texas is too flat for it to make a difference. I always have a level mounted on the gun for any shooting over 500 yards. BTW I think I left out Butler Creek flip up scope caps, cleaning patches, rag, brush and jag, muzzle protector, scope/muzzle cover from Eagle, sling, spotting scope such as the Leupold 12-40 x 60 Mark 4 with the H5 reticle. Horus products :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michael_aos Posted June 20, 2004 Author Share Posted June 20, 2004 You guys are killing me! Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michael_aos Posted June 20, 2004 Author Share Posted June 20, 2004 OK, I'm going to go tomorrow and purchase a Remington 700P in .223 Remington. I'm going to just forget about the whole detachable mag thing for a while. That was a big hangup. I may wind up moving to .223 Ackley Improved (AI) at a later date. Thank you all very much. I think my biggest problem is I need to walk before I can run. Baby steps. Baby steps. Just need to start with something and work from there once I have a clue. Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michael_aos Posted June 20, 2004 Author Share Posted June 20, 2004 It's really amazing to read-back over this thread from the last 21-days. A LOT of what I read the first time just didn't make any sense to me. Now it's all starting to come together. I'm start to "get" it. Thanks again for all your help. Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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