Trouble switching back to 12 gauge

[rexican]

I have used a little 28 gauge Huglu sxs for everything the last five years, but it has finally started showing some signs of wear. I've decided to relegate it to occasional quail use, but I'm having trouble switching back to a 12 gauge. I've gotten so used to a 6.5lb, fast pointing shotgun, but my old skeet gun is a massive stainless ruger red label 12. My best run was 20 out of 25 with it the other day.

I have the most trouble on the first and last positions of skeet, usually the ones going away from me. I need to get some practice in, but any training tips would be appreciated.

[59Bassman]

You'll ultimately be better of with the 12 gauge for skeet. Most of the top shooters are using guns much heavier than your Red Label (try swinging a tubed K-80 with 32" barrels if you want a workout!) A heavier gun will promote the smooth, grooved swing that is the key to consistent skeet.

If you're having trouble on high 1 and low 7, it often comes back to keeping your head on the stock. Lots of folks get freaked out when the target "gets away" on high 1 or low 7, and they pick their head up to follow the target. This will result in a miss, normally over the top. The next time you're shooting, try to keep your upper body locked together, and bend from the hips/back - not your shoulders.

Also, be sure you're not point-shooting either target. I love to ambush low 7 and dust it a few yards from the house - but that's a lower-probability shot than letting the target develop just a bit longer. High 1 is really tempting to point-shoot as well, but you'll almost always miss behind.

To practice, find a vertical seam in your wall at home (a corner works), and practice swinging the gun smoothly along that seam. Visualize the target coming from the house, and the path of the gun along the seam. Keep grooving the movement over and over along the seam (horizontal seams work well for the other positions), and pretty soon that Red Label will feel like an extension of your lead hand.

[EkuJustice]

+1 on the ruger not being that heavy for a skeet gun. Mine weighted close to like 11.75 pounds when I shot a ton. Easy way to miss is keeping the gun too high on high one and low 7 then shooting right over the top of them because the target comes out under the barrel and kind of out of your view. I always kept the gun a little lower then floated it up to the target. Worked very well especially in the wind when the targets are being pushed down. If I could trade a touch more gun movement for a better view of the targets in all weather conditions I considered it a good trade. Another way to stay smooth and really move the gun well no matter the weight is don't use your arms to swing the gun. Lock your upper body in place. Lean into the gun and move it with your lower body. Your upper body should stay locked in place. The lower body should move the gun and upper body like a tank turent. Good example of this is go on you tube and watch videos of Todd Bender shooting. Very good example of a pure lower body shooter.

[AlamoShooter]

my guess is that you are shooting at Capitol City , they have some good instructor that can help you out. professional help is cost effective as compared to spending $$ on learning to miss by bad practice.

Think about trying five stand too it twice five times the fun

[warpspeed]

I have found that it takes me a little while to get readjusted to a different gun. I picked up a Browning Citori O/U to shoot doubles trap with earlier this year and it took me 500 rds before I felt comfortable enough to shoot registered targets.

[benos]

I have used a little 28 gauge Huglu sxs for everything the last five years, but it has finally started showing some signs of wear. I've decided to relegate it to occasional quail use, but I'm having trouble switching back to a 12 gauge. I've gotten so used to a 6.5lb, fast pointing shotgun, but my old skeet gun is a massive stainless ruger red label 12. My best run was 20 out of 25 with it the other day.

I have the most trouble on the first and last positions of skeet, usually the ones going away from me. I need to get some practice in, but any training tips would be appreciated.

Double your lead!

That's what the best shotgun instructor (Steve Middleditch, who's a forum member, but I can't remember his forum member name at the moment) I ever met used to tell me when I missed a bird.

Which was ironic because he also used to say - "There is no lead - just shoot right at it."

His other big one was "Look at the bird!!" I can still remember him whispering that softly in my ear as I was coming on a target that I was unable to previously hit (a tough Sporting target) - that was the first target I ever truly "saw," and subsequently smashed.

[rexican]

Thanks everyone, and Bassman and Justice were correct: I was shooting over them on 1 and 7. I've appreciated your input and will be putting it to practice this weekend. I've been getting sloppy while quail hunting and relying on my upper body to make those quick shots, just point shooting.

I was actually shooting up in Waco, but I've been meaning to check out Capitol City for a while now.

I really do have to pay attention to my leading: the only reason I did well on 3-6 was because I was purposefully exaggerating my lead.

Funnily, I took an old full-choke 20 gauge Winchester model 12 and was dusting everything that crossed my path.

[AlamoShooter]

just to help out on the clay fields lingo, 'Dusting' means that the shot did a near miss on the target and only removed the dust from it with-out any breaking = no score=

The best breaks are Smoke, or Crush and the best break of all is an "Inkball"

I had friends that could do Inkball targets, but I never did shoot much at close targets with a tight choke

Also Best of the West range in Leander has clays too = they also have 3gun events the third sat of the month.

Edited September 9, 2011 by AlamoShooter

[rexican]

thanks for clearing that up: I've been mistaken for quite some time now. "Inkball" does conjure up a more appropriate image.

I am a member of Best of the West, but haven't made it over to their skeet towers yet. I plan on starting up 3gun soon: I just finished up my saiga 12 conversion yesterday.

I forgot to mention that I never start with my shotgun shouldered, but rather wait until I acquire the clay to shoulder my shotgun. It's a carryover from bird hunting and pure stubbornness on my part.

[Tangram]

"I forgot to mention that I never start with my shotgun shouldered, but rather wait until I acquire the clay to shoulder my shotgun. It's a carryover from bird hunting and pure stubbornness on my part."

Just think you are practicing for International Skeet (Olympic) where low gun is required by the rules.

[rexican]

Good to know Tangram. I don't know if I'll be able to do much bird hunting this year, and I think shooting clays will be able to fill that void quite nicely.

It was too doggone hot to reload in the garage, so I elected to save what's left of my shells and continue practicing how 59Bassman suggested. I'll break down and move my mec inside for a couple days this week.

[2alpha]

Sounds more like the huge difference there must be in gun fit more than just the weight. Going from a side by side to a OU is bad enough.

[rexican]

Just a little update.

I'm doing pretty well with the red label: I'm down to 1 or 2 misses per round (which makes me want to practice even more). I feel a lot smoother, and the doubles don't usually give me trouble.

Now my misses are coming from the low house on station 4 or 5, and occasionally that evil station 8.

My pride got the better of me and I ended up shooting 8 rounds last Saturday. 2 rounds were a humbling experience: my saiga with its new LM choke.

Thanks for the help everyone.

Rex

[inkballedtarget]

It sounds like your timing was just a little off.. If your shooting a lead make sure the sight picture is right. If your shooting a pass through where you're driving hard through the target give it time. The target wont get away.

[EkuJustice]

The key to improving is staying with the fundamentals. On the low 5, check your hold point. If its a little high, its easy to loose sight of the target and go right over it. Also what kind of foot postionn, break point etc are you using? Is it the low or high on 8 your having trouble with? Is the station 8 miss coming at the end of an otherwise clean round?

On the sight picture, you need to trust yourself and not check the sight picture. You really need to trust yourself as there is not a whole lot of time to excute the shot if yourjumping back between the gun and the target you stand a good chance of missing.

The good shooters are not afraid to miss.

[rexican]

Ah, this will be kind of hard to describe. I practice skeet to improve my wingshooting, so I have a rather unorthodox method. I do pretty well with high 8, my unfamiliarity with that stage gives me trouble on the low: The first time I ever shot that stage was just before my first post in this thread.

I walk into the box with my intended break point directly in front of me, feet parallel and the butt of my gun a little above my hip, end of barrels at chest height. I don't shoulder my shotgun until the clay enters my peripheral vision (except with station 8).

I understand what you mean about sight picture: if I hesitate at all I end up taking the shot well past a comfortable position and my chance of hitting it declines sharply. I'll remember about the hold point next for next time.

I don't know how well I answered that; I'll have to review this post tomorrow after I've had a little rest.

[Irishlad]

If you are only missing 1 or 2 targets per round...you are "there"...nice.

Not knowing what style of 'swing' you use, I might suggest on low 4 and 5 that you never let the bird get past your barrels. You might find that easier and more consistent, particularly if you are right-handed.

Other "tips" that might, or might not, be helpful.

Assuming you are right handed:

Your "break point" is the middle stake. That doesn't mean you can't or won't break targets past that, but as you practice more, you'll find that break point "natural". Much beyond center stake hits means you are 'riding" the target, picked it up "late" or just "enjoying a nice sunny day". All "fun", but will lead to more misses and make doubles tougher.

So, you might position your feet past center stake which gives you a bit more "swing through". No "absolutes" on foot work, but easy to test. Just position yourself on the station and see if you can swing through comfortably on the targets without running out of body swing well beyond the intended break point. If that makes sense?

The "height" of the barrels is dictated by the the height of the target. Meaning, barrels should be at or below the bird height so when when you start to move the barrels don't end up over the bird, which means you "lost" the visual.

Shoot low 8 like you shoot high. By the time you break it, it's almost the same height. This is one station, IMHO, where there is almost no 'technique' needed except follow through. Meaning, you will position your barrel 'so far' away from the house, look for the "flash" of the target between the house and barrel, move and shoot. Stock doesn't have to be on the face much, if at all, jerk the trigger, bad foot position, whatever. Move on the flash...turn, shoot, follow through...it's over. If you miss, try moving the barrel out more or in, seeing the target better..practice...simple station.

Have fun.

Edited October 10, 2011 by Irishlad

[EkuJustice]

If your shooting low gun for the non 8 stations, make sure the gun starts moving when you see the bird. Move the gun as you are mounting it. I always shot with a doubles foot position on all the targets weather i it was singles or doubles. On singles the center stake is about as far as I would take 4. I always went for a decent amount before the stake to provide time for the turn and reaquire and shot in doubles. My practice consisted of primarily 95 percent doubles and mainly 3-4-5 doubles. All singles shots were placed like their respective place in doubles. Your reflexes play a big part in where your shooting the shots. My low 8 was pretty unconventional. I would basically smoke it straight ahead with very little swing at all. It was more a lift gun up into it and smoke it on the way out. The main reason I shot it like that was the quicker it was hit the less the wind could move it even on a very windy day.

For a good video, I would say check out the todd bender video which is shot with the eye cam. Good way to see the hold and break points then tweak it for what works for you.

[rexican]

Oh, sorry, Irishlad, I was a bit frazzled last night. I don't know what type of swing I use either I am not an "ambush" shooter, nor do I always swing at the exact same speed as the clay is moving and excecute perfect follow through. I believe I use a swing that follows the clay, but increases in speed until a bit after I squeeze the trigger. Until recently, my shotgunning is something I have not analyzed as much as my pistol shooting (although I will probably set up a video camera next time now that I think about it).

I am right handed, and as you said, the right to left shots from the low station require me to make the shot fast; if I don't I end up in an uncomfortable position with my shoulders perpendicular to my waist when I take the shot. I have started to account for the trajectory of the clay, and have varied my footwork to some degree as I go along the stages, but have not altered the starting height of my barrels. I'll try that out next time.

Luckily, EkuJustice, I instinctually move the shotgun as I am turning my shoulders while following the bird. While mounting the shotgun, I am almost pushing the barrels to a spot in front of the clay and then pulling back slightly into my shoulder. I noticed last month that I occasionally fired (and broke the clay) withoug pulling the shotgun back into my shoulder (I haven't done it since).

If I could get down to practicing only doubles I'd be a very happy man.

I've enjoyed the Todd Bender videos, and although my stance is completely opposite from his, everything carries over... But ever since I am never really satisfied with just breaking those clays... All I want are inkballs for Christmas.