Range equipment malfunction ?

[GSWEAR]

Alright A/P guys I have a question for you.

If you are shooting the falling plates and have a plate fall on it's own during the string of fire what happens?

This happened today (and has happened before) and the shooter asks me what do you do?

Me: You get the plate.

Him: Good can I use the extra shot for a make up shot?

Me: No you get the plate but no make up shots.

Him: Well but you get 6 shots per string.

Me: Hmmmmmm ...... don't know.

So what do you guys have to say and if you can show something in the rule book it would be even better.

Thank you, Greg

[underlug]

Alright A/P guys I have a question for you.

If you are shooting the falling plates and have a plate fall on it's own during the string of fire what happens?

This happened today (and has happened before) and the shooter asks me what do you do?

Me: You get the plate.

Him: Good can I use the extra shot for a make up shot?

Me: No you get the plate but no make up shots.

Him: Well but you get 6 shots per string.

Me: Hmmmmmm ...... don't know.

So what do you guys have to say and if you can show something in the rule book it would be even better.

Thank you, Greg

Range equipment failure: reshoot the string

Edited August 28, 2011 by underlug

[chad GUNder]

Is there a specific rule in the rule book that calls this a range failure... Re-shoot?

[wanderer]

Is there a specific rule in the rule book that calls this a range failure... Re-shoot?

9.14 and 10.7.1 (2011 rulebook)

Edited August 28, 2011 by wanderer

[kimmbeckwith]

If he fires the shot at the plate even if it's down he gets the plate. If he does not fire 6 shots he does not get the plate. 6 shots 6 plates. I have had this happen in a match and you must fire the shot, even if the plate is not there.

[gm iprod]

If he fires the shot and the plate is already gone it is a miss. Because he did not hit the plate.

The plate must fall when shot, not before.

If the plate is not there the shooter MUST stop immediately he realises the plate is not there. The RO should call stop and allow the reshoot if the shooter is unaware of the missing plate.

If there are other shooters on the line at the same time and respond to the stop command as well they also get a reshoot.

[kimmbeckwith]

If he fires the shot and the plate is already gone it is a miss. Because he did not hit the plate.

The plate must fall when shot, not before.

If the plate is not there the shooter MUST stop immediately he realises the plate is not there. The RO should call stop and allow the reshoot if the shooter is unaware of the missing plate.

If there are other shooters on the line at the same time and respond to the stop command as well they also get a reshoot.

I have shot Action Pistol since 1985 and have had this happen numours times. I have never been advised to stop in the middle of a string. Different rules at different places I gusess.

[JRB]

Alright A/P guys I have a question for you.

If you are shooting the falling plates and have a plate fall on it's own during the string of fire what happens?

This happened today (and has happened before) and the shooter asks me what do you do?

Me: You get the plate.

Him: Good can I use the extra shot for a make up shot?

Me: No you get the plate but no make up shots.

Him: Well but you get 6 shots per string.

Me: Hmmmmmm ...... don't know.

So what do you guys have to say and if you can show something in the rule book it would be even better.

Thank you, Greg

[JRB]

Alright A/P guys I have a question for you.

If you are shooting the falling plates and have a plate fall on it's own during the string of fire what happens?

This happened today (and has happened before) and the shooter asks me what do you do?

Me: You get the plate.

Him: Good can I use the extra shot for a make up shot?

Me: No you get the plate but no make up shots.

Him: Well but you get 6 shots per string.

Me: Hmmmmmm ...... don't know.

So what do you guys have to say and if you can show something in the rule book it would be even better.

Thank you, Greg

Sorry about the last reply, i am new to this stuff

This happened to me at the 2010 Bianchi Cup 2 times on the plates.

From position 2 1st string, the far right plate falls before i draw, i look at the RO he does nothing, i try to finish the string. ( not done very well )

From position 3 first string, the same plate falls, i am distracted again and look at the RO, he does nothing again.

I had a squib on the last string, so i looked like a goof anyway.

I tried to get a ruling on the RANGE Equipment failer but to no avail.

I would love to know what the rule is and why they don't do anything about these problems.

Thanks

russell

[DWFAN]

Alright A/P guys I have a question for you.

If you are shooting the falling plates and have a plate fall on it's own during the string of fire what happens?

This happened today (and has happened before) and the shooter asks me what do you do?

Me: You get the plate.

Him: Good can I use the extra shot for a make up shot?

Me: No you get the plate but no make up shots.

Him: Well but you get 6 shots per string.

Me: Hmmmmmm ...... don't know.

So what do you guys have to say and if you can show something in the rule book it would be even better.

Thank you, Greg

Sorry about the last reply, i am new to this stuff

This happened to me at the 2010 Bianchi Cup 2 times on the plates.

From position 2 1st string, the far right plate falls before i draw, i look at the RO he does nothing, i try to finish the string. ( not done very well )

From position 3 first string, the same plate falls, i am distracted again and look at the RO, he does nothing again.

I had a squib on the last string, so i looked like a goof anyway.

I tried to get a ruling on the RANGE Equipment failer but to no avail.

I would love to know what the rule is and why they don't do anything about these problems.

Thanks

russell

As far as I know, from my two CUP experiences. Once you fire a shot, you have accepted the range conditions. If you would have not fired, you could have been given a reshoot.

Now, onto the sympathetic falling plate. (which there is one or two on that Billings range that falls randomly isnt there?)

We usually play by what Kim said.

Here are some rules I found.

14.3b

In events where the 8" steel plate is used, the plate must be knocked down to score as a hit; each hit is

scored 10 points and 1 X.

It says the plate must be knocked down to score as a hit. It doesnt say the plate must be hit.

This next rule makes me also agree, that if the plate falls before you shoot at it, you must shoot at where it was to fire your 6 shots.

14.10c

If a competitor fires fewer than the prescribed number of shots through his own fault, and there should be

more hits on the target than the shots fired, he will be scored the number of shots of highest value equal to

the number he fired, and will be given a miss for each unfired cartridge.

This means to me if he only shoots 5 shots, but 6 plates are down, he only gets 5 scored.

Of course I could be completely wrong in my interpretations because this rule leads me to think you could get a reshoot.

9.14 Refiring - No refires will be allowed for defective guns or ammunition or for other malfunction of the

shooter's equipment. A competitor may clear jams or malfunctions and replace the necessary cartridge(s) that

have misfired or have been dropped, provided all safety requirements are met. Completing a string of fire in this

manner will not constitute a refire. No additional time will be allowed,

(a) When the firing of a string is interrupted by some occurrence which renders it impossible for one or more

competitors to complete the string under the conditions of the match, the Chief Range Officer will proceed

as follows: Without being permitted to examine their targets, competitors in the relay who have been so

prevented from completing their strings will be asked if they wish to refire or to accept their score as fired.

Targets will then be scored in the usual manner for all competitors except those who have elected to

refire. Without being scored, the targets of such competitors who have elected to refire will be pasted or

new targets substituted and a complete string will be fired and scored. Reasons authorizing this procedure

are:

(1) failure to allow full time, (2) failure of targets to operate properly or uniformly for the entire string,(3)

failure of paper target to remain in position on frame, ..etc...

Maybe an official ruling on this is needed..

[gm iprod]

If the plate is not there at the very beginning and you shoot they will score you the plates that were there and that you fired at. So if you only fire 5 shots (14.10c) you will only be scored 5 plates. If you shoot over the plate that is already down, you have not knocked it down therefore you will not score that plate.

Knocked down, not fell down, knocked down by the competitor or another competitor (as in crossfire). They are assuming you intend to knock them down with a projectile. As using a broom handle will constitute either being down range, non standard equipment (not making PF I would say) or over time, take your pick eitehr will not count.

Fell down is range equipment failure, same as target fell off stand. Sympathetic fall down, as in plate not yet fired at, same, equipment failure. Example: The shooter is firing at or has fired at plate 1 on the extreme right and plate 6 on the extreme left falls over, the RO / Observer "should" call stop and issue a reshoot. The competitor may not notice the plate missing until he/she gets to the missing plate, they are looking at only the piece of the range equipment that they are currently using, not the whole plate rack, easy to do when you are at the Cup and crapping yourself.

Each plate is an individual target, by not firing at the missing plate you have not accepted that target.